I've done quite a bit of Googling to no avail, so I thought I'd come here and ask.  Is there a Buck Rogers XXVC RPG retroclone?

Buck Rogers XXVC was / is my favorite non-super-hero RPG.  However, it has been out of print for twenty years.  I managed to snag new copies of all of the books several years ago, but to find new players, having the rules readily available to download and print would be best.  With the resurgence of basic Dungeons & Dragons and AD&D 1E via retroclones, I wonder if someone has made a Buck Rogers XXVC retroclone, seeing as how the game was based on AD&D 2E.

If not, perhaps I should get on that...

Not to my knowledge. I've never seen the BRXXVC game, but would actually really like to check it out.

As to why a clone has not be done yet, I'm just going to drop one name: Lorraine Williams (Lorraine Williams was the granddaughter of John F. Dille who, while president of the National Newspaper Service syndicate in the 1920s, arranged for Buck Rogers to be turned into a syndicated comic strip. When Dille died, she and her brother Flint inherited of the rights to Buck Rogers, hence, the TSR game after she took over). Feelings are still kinda raw where she is concerned, especially coming from the OS gamer base.

It dose seem odd, but I don't think that product was that successful; 2e is generally not superpopular with clone writers or consumers; and there are already a bunch of sci fi/space opera oldschool d&d clone iterations.

Because she owned the rights to Buck Rogers, wasn't she (basically) using TSRs chequebook to write cheques to herself?

As for a retro clone, you'd need to file off the serials. Just use the system (standard 2e with sci fi weapons and a surprisingly easy D100 based skill system). Though I own all the modules, books etc I could never find anyone to play the game with either (finally tracked down the last one - No Humans Allowed - last month) but played the Amiga game 'Countdown to Doomsday'.

Perhaps there's a possibility - take the game manuals for CtD and Matrix Cubed and pull the rules from them.

The biggest problem with such a project would be art, in my opinion. With it's unique retro-sci fi feel it's the sort of game that would need reasonable pictures of cigar shaped rockets, robots and rayguns.

And there's the name of your game - Rocketships, Rayguns and Robots™

Quote from: APN;650765Because she owned the rights to Buck Rogers, wasn't she (basically) using TSRs chequebook to write cheques to herself?

Basically yeah. There's a rumor she was referring to TSR as her "retirement fund" that "nobody would snatch away from her until she was done with it" and "could retire on an island somewhere" (she was retired in Switzerland last time I heard, though I don't know what truth there is to that rumor either). I think Ryan Dancey talked about the mountains of unsold BR products that were found in the warehouse when WotC acquired TSR as well. So yeah, basically, she was writing out checks to herself.

I think the D&D based Buck Rogers did okay. But the second version (which just used d10s) really tanked.

There used to be a surplus store (American Science & Surplus?) that sold liquidated RPGs for like $5 for 3 books. The catch is, it was random.

I bought a bunch of boxes from them and ended up with a ton of TSR stuff - mostly the Buck Rogers adventure game (the 2nd RPG), generic supplements (_____ Sites mostly), and a few Ravenloft books (Van Richten's guide to _____). Also (not TSR) lots and lots of Prime Directive supplements.

I'd love to see a RC. I only played the computer games, but it seemed decent enough version of D&D in space.

Anyway, I think the art would be easy to find, at least in the US, because there is a ton of old pulp magazines and comics that are PD here (but not in the rest of the world).

I own the core books, but this is one case where I don't see a Space-Pulp Transhuman setting needing D&D rules, mind you it wasn't /horrible/ in fact I rather enjoy the game. Yet given the nature of space-pulp and heroes expected success rates, it might could use an improvement over a strict retroclone.


Yes the game has both elements of pulp and transhumanism (modest transhumanism) and makes for a damn fine SF game if you strip out Buck Rogers and his NPC allies.

Just out of curiosity, are there any Buck Rogers rpgs that use the origional setting from the books?

Quote from: Bill;650954Just out of curiosity, are there any Buck Rogers rpgs that use the origional setting from the books?

Buck Rogers: High Adventure Cliffhanger. The second Buck Rogers game put out by TSR, I believe it uses the original setting.

While the Buck Rogers game was certainly better than the rap it got due to the POG connection, I don't think creating a retroclone of it would be viable.

Essentially, it's AD&D + some sci-fi rules (rocket ship combat, d100 skill system, etc.) + a setting. Of these, the setting is the only thing that actually made it unique, there was nothing new or particularly noteworthy about the actual rules.

Now, the setting would need to be changed for a serial-number-filed-off copy, that's unavoidable. But then you're looking at making a retroclone of D&D + some sci-fi rules, and, well, we already have that; it's called Stars Without Number. So why not just write up a Buck Rogers-lookalike setting for SWN and be done with it?

I recommend taking a look at Hulks and Horrors.

The PDF is free if you follow the links on the Kickstarter.

It's not a direct clone, but XXCV was a definite inspiration on H&H, as it's the closest to the kind of SF D&D I wanted anyone else ever really got.

Making a setting free 2e D&D clone + Skills system (along with space combat, stats for robots and weapons etc) then adding settings/adventures (Firefly, Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon, X-Com, generic Traveller, Star Wars, Battlestar Galactica etc) with any setting specific rules might be the easiest way to do it.

I'll dig the game out at some point and have a good look over it for more suggestions if anyone wants to pursue this.

Quote from: Benoist;650742As to why a clone has not be done yet, I'm just going to drop one name: Lorraine Williams (Lorraine Williams was the granddaughter of John F. Dille who, while president of the National Newspaper Service syndicate in the 1920s, arranged for Buck Rogers to be turned into a syndicated comic strip. When Dille died, she and her brother Flint inherited of the rights to Buck Rogers, hence, the TSR game after she took over). Feelings are still kinda raw where she is concerned, especially coming from the OS gamer base.

I read about the situation regarding Lorraine Williams and TSR a few years ago, and I understand and appreciate the ire "old school" gamers have towards her.  However, I entered the RPG hobby as a 13 year-old lad back in 1990 because of the Buck Rogers XXVC RPG, and so I thank her for that, and for publishing one of the best sci-fi settings I've ever encountered.  Good with the bad, I suppose.

Quote from: APN;650765Though I own all the modules, books etc I could never find anyone to play the game with either (finally tracked down the last one - No Humans Allowed - last month) but played the Amiga game 'Countdown to Doomsday'.

Perhaps there's a possibility - take the game manuals for CtD and Matrix Cubed and pull the rules from them.

The "Countdown to Doomsday" computer game is actually how I discovered the Buck Rogers XXVC RPG, and then RPGs in general!

Quote from: Premier;651003While the Buck Rogers game was certainly better than the rap it got due to the POG connection, I don't think creating a retroclone of it would be viable.

Essentially, it's AD&D + some sci-fi rules (rocket ship combat, d100 skill system, etc.) + a setting. Of these, the setting is the only thing that actually made it unique, there was nothing new or particularly noteworthy about the actual rules.

Now, the setting would need to be changed for a serial-number-filed-off copy, that's unavoidable. But then you're looking at making a retroclone of D&D + some sci-fi rules, and, well, we already have that; it's called Stars Without Number. So why not just write up a Buck Rogers-lookalike setting for SWN and be done with it?

Quote from: J Arcane;651110I recommend taking a look at Hulks and Horrors.

The PDF is free if you follow the links on the Kickstarter.

It's not a direct clone, but XXCV was a definite inspiration on H&H, as it's the closest to the kind of SF D&D I wanted anyone else ever really got.

It is true that the Buck Rogers XXVC setting is what makes the game so awesome, at least IMO.  It's not just the rules, although the ruleset is pretty good and fairly simple.

I'll take a look at both Stars Without Number and Hulks and Horrors.  Thanks for the recommendations.  If there is already a well done D&D sci-fi retroclone, then perhaps you are both right in that it would be better to make a retroclone of the Buck Rogers XXVC RPG setting, not so much the rules.

I know it's almost 10 years later, but there is now a retro-clone of the Buck Rogers XXVc RPG, called Overlords of Dimension-25 that is available on DriveThruRPG along with a couple of supplements.

So, my take would be to use the overall transhuman setting without calling the transhumans "genies"  I'd probably push the timeline to 3000 or so because while XXVc is largely hard sf the time line for terra forming Mars and Venus is wishful thinking.  I'd have teams that were put in suspended animation in preparation for the post holocaust world waking up to a very different age.  Visually, I'd make it look pulpy but grounded.  I'd genericize the races enough to avoid prosecution.

Mechanically, stats would be 1-20, skills would be stat + 25 if skilled + 5 per level.  The classes would be Soldier, Pilot, Scientist, Technician, Smuggler.  You'd get half a dozen class skills and a couple electives.

I'd lose the d20s in combat and just use weapon skills to hit.

Hit Points would be Health + class based increment per level.  I'd make the personal / vehicle / ship scaling explicit.   I've never been overly fond of armor making you harder to hit but I'd put a threshold on armor where you'd hit the target and not the armor.  Otherwise armour would be extra hitpoints.  Personal ECM and chameleon fields would give a penalty to be hit.

Rather than use other polyhedral dice for damage I'd give a fixed damage and a double and half level based on success rolls.

I'm not quite sure how to do the super cool moving planets on the solar system map with the clear ruler.  But you'd be able to burn more fuel to cut your travel times.