Quote from: Novastar;390750By that definition, if Kevin uprooted Palladium to Colorado, and became a medical marijuana grower making money hands over fist, he'd by a successful RPG salesman?
 
I think the point is still valid: SJG is profitable, but not really in the RPG business anymore. Just like Carella & Coffin were successful writer's, that have since left the RPG biz cause they found there was better money in other endeavours.
 
Kevin is, for better or worse, about the only old grognard publisher left. SJ & PS (and others I'm probably forgetting) have been doing it as long, but most of them have done it for multiple companies at this point, or made RPG's their "side business".

He is one of the few "grognard" publishers left only by dint of the fact that he hasnt had the decency to have died like some of the better known ones...

Quote from: Werekoala;390753Wow - what an incredibly one-sided rant devoid of any content whatsoever. No details, not one, of poor little him getting the axe for "asking to be left alone" and yet you present it as Exhibit A as to Steve Jackson being an asshole.

Yarly?

Are you guys referring to Mechgogo/Bob?
(Since I'm polite and have a certain poster on ignore, I had to figure out the clues)
He's a nice guy and a friend. He and I still talk via e-mail and Facebook chat at times.
Let you in on a minor secret: He kept his GURPS books, and is likely to still run it for his circle of friends.
So yeah, he was honked off....but he's still going to play the game from time to time. (This was true last time I jokingly asked him about sending me some of his GURPS books)

- Ed C.

By-the-way minor point or sidelight: Mechgogo was one of the people that RPGPundit badmouthed about 3 to 4 years ago in the initial blog rant/thread about the SJG Forums that drew my attention to this forum in the first place. My SJG handle and name were mentioned as well.

((snip this bit - on second thought, after a bit of reading of his LJ, I don't really care))

Also, I'm totally fine with KS, and Palladium. Its his company, he can run it how he wants. He's making a living doing what he loves while I'm stuck in a cube all day, so if nothing else I'll give him props for that.

(...and I kinda like Rifts...)

Quote from: Spinachcat;390649So how can KS be a "shit business man" if he is standing while most of his contemporaries have either bailed on RPGs or just closed shop?

He did essentially go out of business. The sole reason he has a shot to publish anything today is not because of his business acumen but because he begged his fans for money.

Seanchai

Quote from: Werekoala;390753Wow - what an incredibly one-sided rant devoid of any content whatsoever. No details, not one, of poor little him getting the axe for "asking to be left alone" and yet you present it as Exhibit A as to Steve Jackson being an asshole.

Yarly?

Actually given the evidence on SJG's forums and jackson's own behavior in other cases I'm inclinded to believe that mechgogo was attacked by a fellow MIB for being a liberal, and when he complained SJ followed true texas form and solved the matter in texas fashion: LYNCH THE LIBRUL!

Every time there's any dispute between users, the one who gets hosed is the one who's expressed any leftist leanings.

Also note that john kovalic himself sided with mechgogo.

Count me down for a vote of "Palladium is in business despite its terrible business skills".  

Kevin is brilliant at coming up with game-able concepts.  Even people who hate his games usually like a fair bit of the ideas.  Not to mention that Palladium is one of the few companies still producing a rule-medium, old-school style of games and at affordable prices to boot.  They have a lot of fans because Palladium is one of the few companies that still puts Fun! over rigorous designs and marketing segments.

But let's face it, Palladium still being alive has nothing to do with Kevin's business skills.  They've been coasting for the last 10-15 years on the metric fuckton of money made back in the day with Robotech, Rifts, and TMNT.  When that ran out, Kevin got all the money he could from family and friends.  After that, he begged the fans.



As for SJG, saying they are "no longer a RPG company" is just dumb.  They have always been a general game company.  They mostly focused on Ogre and Car Wars in the 80s, gave heavy attention to GURPS in the late 80s / early 90s, then focused on card games starting in the mid-90s.

Quote from: Seanchai;390765He did essentially go out of business. The sole reason he has a shot to publish anything today is not because of his business acumen but because he begged his fans for money.

Seanchai

And as a result of his business acumen his fans and supporters rallied behind him and put u-p the money to help his stay in business.

Quote from: Koltar;390759Are you guys referring to Mechgogo/Bob?
(Since I'm polite and have a certain poster on ignore, I had to figure out the clues)
He's a nice guy and a friend. He and I still talk via e-mail and Facebook chat at times.
Let you in on a minor secret: He kept his GURPS books, and is likely to still run it for his circle of friends.
So yeah, he was honked off....but he's still going to play the game from time to time. (This was true last time I jokingly asked him about sending me some of his GURPS books)

- Ed C.

By-the-way minor point or sidelight: Mechgogo was one of the people that RPGPundit badmouthed about 3 to 4 years ago in the initial blog rant/thread about the SJG Forums that drew my attention to this forum in the first place. My SJG handle and name were mentioned as well.

So what was he supposed to do, burn his gurps books like jack chick would recommend?

Quote from: Cylonophile;390810Actually given the evidence on SJG's forums and jackson's own behavior in other cases I'm inclinded to believe that mechgogo was attacked by a fellow MIB for being a liberal, and when he complained SJ followed true texas form and solved the matter in texas fashion: LYNCH THE LIBRUL!

Every time there's any dispute between users, the one who gets hosed is the one who's expressed any leftist leanings.

In other words, you really don't know but just want to keep up the character assassination.

I think you need to switch to decaf. And this is coming from a guy who can rant aimlessly with the best of them.

Werekoala,
Thank you for quote-boxing him.

That being said - I'm friends with Mechgogo, so I guess that makes me a 'librul'.  (Zheesh!!)

Not everything in the world is politics.
 Sometimes something gets fucked up and might not involve politics or political-leanings.

 I just know Mech is a pretty cool guy and I hope to game with him at a con some day and meet him and his wives in person.


- Ed C.

I actually don't remember that particular drama bomb and don't have strong opinions about it. But I will say that getting upset because someone said "libelous things" about you on the internet is a recipe for never ending butt hurt. Internet disagreements happen. And when they do, you will be compared to Hitler. And while that might technically cunt as libel, mostly you should just get the fuck over it. Contacting a lawyer over mean things someone said about you in a message board is so much escalation that it wouldn't surprise me if that is what he actually got fired for.

-Frank

Frank,

I don't know what the whole story is either.

Tho the claim that SJ Games is either 'conservative' or 'liberal' is completely ridiculous. Their line editor for GURPS lives in Quebec, is biased in favor of light socialism and refuses to drive or own a car.  He is a nice guy tho, I've met him a couple of times at Gen Con. You could say that Sean Punch/Kromm falls onto the liberal side of things.
For that matter, the author of GURPS: SPACE 4/e I remember had some very liberal political views on things.
Just because their company is headquartered in Texas - that doesn;t every one of their authors or freelancers has a 'Texas  Mindset'. I buy their books because I enjoy the game , not because of any perceived political agreement one way or the other.


- Ed C.

Quote from: Werekoala;390753Wow - what an incredibly one-sided rant devoid of any content whatsoever. No details, not one, of poor little him getting the axe for "asking to be left alone" and yet you present it as Exhibit A as to Steve Jackson being an asshole.

Yarly?

Fuck you.  I know the guy.  He didn't say one false word in that post, and he is indeed responsible for all of the local deeds that he claimed.  If John Kovalic goes to bat for you, you're One Of The Good Guys.  That he got fucked over like this is Fucking Retarded, and I can't blame him for returning betrayal with abandonment.  CONvergence starts on Thursday, so when I see him I'll suggest that he approach our two local publishers--Fantasy Flight and Atlas--to see if either of them would like him on board.

Bradford,

Mech invited up to that con a couple of years and I just couldn't afford it on my budget.

Tell him I said Hello when you're there. (Just say that GURPS GM Klingon in Ohio said Hello)

 Also I sent him an e-mail earlier today with a link to this thread. Hope I'm not adding to his stress or anything.

- Ed C.

Quote from: Bradford C. Walker;390841Fuck you.  I know the guy.  He didn't say one false word in that post, and he is indeed responsible for all of the local deeds that he claimed.  If John Kovalic goes to bat for you, you're One Of The Good Guys.  That he got fucked over like this is Fucking Retarded, and I can't blame him for returning betrayal with abandonment.  CONvergence starts on Thursday, so when I see him I'll suggest that he approach our two local publishers--Fantasy Flight and Atlas--to see if either of them would like him on board.

I'm thrilled shitless that you know him. I never questioned anything in his post except the reason he was let go - he asked to be left alone? What kind of fucking excuse is that? I'm sure there was a ton of background drama that went along with the Purge or what the hell ever his fanbois like to call it, but not one ounce of information was given about the circumstances leading up to it. THAT is what I was questioning, and if not immediately breaking down in red-misted rage over the fact that he was shitcanned is a problem with you, you're the one with the problem. "Just Because" doesn't work (I know, I've tried it).

Cy threw this out as a reason to hate SJ Games, and I don't care what he thinks, but it just seems like such an odd bit of nothing. You going to bat for the guy gives it some credibility, but there is still NOTHING to go on.

Since you know him so well, you might be able to give some details, then maybe I would have some sympathy. Again, if he did this job for 10 YEARS, he must have had a lot going for him. He must have done something REALLY AWFUL to be let go like that - or else someone did something awful to HIM. But there are no details to be had, so how can we judge?

Without any facts, it just looks like a huge case of butt-hurt.