What do you think was the biggest blown chance, of something that was practically a license to print money, but that for whatever stupid reason got fucked up?

To me, that would be the Call of Cthulhu D20 game. Wildly successful, tanked by Chaosium's anti-d20 prejudice.

RPGPundit

Quote from: RPGPunditWhat do you think was the biggest blown chance, of something that was practically a license to print money, but that for whatever stupid reason got fucked up?

To me, that would be the Call of Cthulhu D20 game. Wildly successful, tanked by Chaosium's anti-d20 prejudice.

RPGPundit

I'll agree with that.  I really dig that game, but I don't like BRP.

I think the Dune debacle is the biggest blown opportunity.  I'd love to have a copy of that book...

Quote from: RPGPunditTo me, that would be the Call of Cthulhu D20 game. Wildly successful, tanked by Chaosium's anti-d20 prejudice.

I'm not sure what's the biggest screw up but that was definitely a big one.  Chaosium had a bunch going for it.  It had two big brand names to bank on, CoC and D20/D&D.  It had WOTC doing part of it, which got it in front of new faces/places where Chaosium wouldn't have normally been.  The book itself was extremely well done (not a perfect measure but ebay prices are well above original retail).  The timing was fairly early in the D20 cycle.

They had an inside line to get an early jump into the D20 market and have a lead in to get new faces into their other lines.  Part of the problem might have been that they were still financially strapped from jumping in the CCG glut at exactly the wrong time.  I know Pulp Cthulhu was supposed to be dual stat and follow soon after - I'm not sure if it's out yet.

But, based on comments on their website, there is definitely and anti-D20 bias.

Quote from: joewolzI'll agree with that.  I really dig that game, but I don't like BRP.

I think the Dune debacle is the biggest blown opportunity.  I'd love to have a copy of that book...

Yeah.  It was awfully nice for WotC to ignore all the pre-orders and create a situation where most of the people who did get the book were scalpers.

Chaosium blew earlier opportunities too. RQ was highly popular at one time, second only to D&D in fantasy and vying for second overall popularity with Traveller. The supplements were groundbreaking and great to play in. That's when any sensible company...sells their RPG to a wargame company?

Quote from: joewolzI think the Dune debacle is the biggest blown opportunity.  I'd love to have a copy of that book...

Don't bother, it really wasn't very good (I managed to get two copies of the book at cover price when it was initially released.  Fast forward five years where I sell them on eBay. Easiest $400 I ever made).

With:
d20 Modern
or
d6 Space
or
Burning Wheel: Jyhad
or whatever you system of choice is that has SF and psychic powers

PLUS

The Dune Encyclopedia

EQUALS

Enough Dune gaming to last a lifetime.

The Dune book was just a pile of rules for "background noise" (falling, radiation, poison, character generation etc) where all the "setting" and "genre rules" (rules for mentats, rules for bene gessrit, etc) would have been coming out in future books.  The only thing the book did well was that it had a pretty layout, and lots of pretty color art, all taken from the Dune CCG if I recall correctly.

Oh, so with the above it might make sense to check eBay for like a $5.00 set of thousands of DUNE cards, and just cut them up to use the art in your game.

-Andy

I actually think Chaosium blew it biggest with Dragonlords of Melnibone, their d20 fantasy outing.  They could have planted their flag as the one true way for dark fantasy d20 gaming.  Instead, they blew their wad on a slipshod project.

An even bigger lost opportunity was Decipher's inability to capitalize on the LotR movies.  They had a license already signed for a megahit movie trilogy.  Why didn't that game break big?  Why wasn't more product on the shelves at the release of the second and third films?

But the biggest blunder in the history of the hobby would have to be the wargaming companies passing on OD&D when Gygax and crew shopped around the manuscript.  Back then I can see not wanting to take a chance, but hindsight is pretty unforgiving on this one.

Chaosium are second to none when it comes to A) getting their hands on fantastic IPs and B) fucking up spectacularly by putting out poor material or not putting anything out when they should do.

There's also Eden who were riding the crest of a wave of good will generated by Buffy and their incessant hyping on RPGnet.  Then Angel actually comes out and then nothing... for practically a whole year.  Suddenly all the bullshit hype comes home to roost and Eden have to deal with customers not only pissed off at Eden's support for DriveThru's DRM but also pissed off at having been bullshitted into expecting games that weren't even close to being released.  Textbook example of a bubble bursting.

I second Lord of the Rings. The only thing Ive heard anyone us it for is as a holodeck adventure in their Decipher Star Trek games. Seriously. Lord of the Rings RPG+Big Time Movie tie in should equal success. The frikkin Buffy RPG is doing better!
 
Here's a missed oppurtunity: Why hasn't WotC made D20 setting books that tie in with their Magic the Gathering universes? They have the artwork and the backstory, just flesh it out, add some d20 sats and be done with it. I can already see them making sales to quie a few of my Magic playing D20 addicts.
 
Kamigawa?
 
Ravnica?
 
Money?
 

Actually, I thought WizKids should have released d20 stats for their MageKnight figures.

Quote from: KrakaJakI second Lord of the Rings. The only thing Ive heard anyone us it for is as a holodeck adventure in their Decipher Star Trek games. Seriously. Lord of the Rings RPG+Big Time Movie tie in should equal success. The frikkin Buffy RPG is doing better!
 
Here's a missed oppurtunity: Why hasn't WotC made D20 setting books that tie in with their Magic the Gathering universes? They have the artwork and the backstory, just flesh it out, add some d20 sats and be done with it. I can already see them making sales to quie a few of my Magic playing D20 addicts.
 
Kamigawa?
 
Ravnica?
 
Money?
 

given the huge number of settings in MTG, they could cover a lot of ground with multiple  MTG setting books. Sadly I don't think we will ever see a MTG Setting book.

I'll toss my money in with D20 CoC.  The layout's gorgeous, the rules are tight and the setting's perfectly presented.  Near the end of the book there's a breakdown of all the shitty things that happened in the 20th century that's probably the best historical writing in an RPG ever.  The stats for using the Mythos gods in D&D was just icing on the meatball sub.

Chaosium didn't just drop that ball; they cut it open, shit inside it and threw it off the end of a pier.  The sooner those marvels of capitalism just hand the game line over to their German counterparts, the better off CoC will be.  (I sometimes wonder if the boys at Chaosium shit themselves in terror at the idea of CoC getting popular and the buying public forcing them to publish something other than short fiction anthologies.)

KrakaJak makes a fine point, though.  What in the hell is WotC doing with all that setting info?  Their MtG guys write massive style bibles for the worlds they set the game in, there's a metric fuckton of official art that's already paid for...  I hope there's an angle I just don't see.

Quote from: RPGPunditWhat do you think was the biggest blown chance, of something that was practically a license to print money, but that for whatever stupid reason got fucked up?

To me, that would be the Call of Cthulhu D20 game. Wildly successful, tanked by Chaosium's anti-d20 prejudice.

Yeah, that's the one that leaped to mind when I saw the subject line for the thread.

Quote from: jrientsI actually think Chaosium blew it biggest with Dragonlords of Melnibone, their d20 fantasy outing.  They could have planted their flag as the one true way for dark fantasy d20 gaming.  Instead, they blew their wad on a slipshod project.

I did a positive review of DLoM right after it was released. Looking back on it, it wasn't a bad early effort for third party d20 stuff. But what it could've been was squandered. Rather than rush to get it out, they would've done well to take their time and really get it right. Licensed products like Black Company, Conan, Babylon 5, and Thieves World have proven how good such books can be when care and time are taken.

Quote from: jrientsAn even bigger lost opportunity was Decipher's inability to capitalize on the LotR movies.  They had a license already signed for a megahit movie trilogy.  Why didn't that game break big?  Why wasn't more product on the shelves at the release of the second and third films?

They seriously dropped the ball by not having a Return of the King sourcebook. Beautiful books, lovingly researched.

Quote from: KrakaJakI second Lord of the Rings. The only thing Ive heard anyone us it for is as a holodeck adventure in their Decipher Star Trek games. Seriously. Lord of the Rings RPG+Big Time Movie tie in should equal success. The frikkin Buffy RPG is doing better!

I ran a campaign using it, and was pleased with it. It ran smoothly, and was very much like a streamlined d20 system, using 2d6 as the core mechanic. It evoked the feel of the setting very well.
 

Quote from: fonkaygarryI'll toss my money in with D20 CoC.  The layout's gorgeous, the rules are tight and the setting's perfectly presented.  Near the end of the book there's a breakdown of all the shitty things that happened in the 20th century that's probably the best historical writing in an RPG ever.  The stats for using the Mythos gods in D&D was just icing on the meatball sub.

CoC d20 set a standard that wasn't met or surpassed for years. It's still one of the best d20 books produced. I played in a campaign of it that lasted the better part of a year, and it played as well, if differently, than the BRP version. Simply baffling the way Chaosium gave up on it, even with their half-hearted dual-stat books.

Quote from: fonkaygarryChaosium didn't just drop that ball; they cut it open, shit inside it and threw it off the end of a pier.  The sooner those marvels of capitalism just hand the game line over to their German counterparts, the better off CoC will be.  (I sometimes wonder if the boys at Chaosium shit themselves in terror at the idea of CoC getting popular and the buying public forcing them to publish something other than short fiction anthologies.)

It really does make no sense. Chaosium has had some truly cool properties at its disposal, but never seemed to take full advantage of any of them, besides CoC. RuneQuest, Elric/Stormbringer, Pendragon, and even less-well-known efforts like the Ringworld RPG have either been taken over by other companies or left dormant.

TSR refusing to license AD&D to a Japanese company that had a new manga series inspired by it. In the end, the Japanese published their own game.

The manga's name? Record of Lodoss War. :rolleyes:

Quote from: JongWKTSR refusing to license AD&D to a Japanese company that had a new manga series inspired by it. In the end, the Japanese published their own game.

The manga's name? Record of Lodoss War. :rolleyes:

I had no idea TSR had a chance to buy into that...

:banghead: