OK

I have a beef with Exalted.

I really like the Iliad, the Odyssey and the Aenead. I really like epic heroism with a classical feel. I wanted a game that would let me do that, with perhaps a dash of superheroics and anime for fun. At first, Exalted seemed like it would be that game.

There are two trends that made me loathe Exalted. The first is that the anime influence became stronger and stronger as the game went on, while the influences of classical history and literature grew weaker. I really liked books like Scavenger Sons, Manacle and Coin, Exalted: the Dragonblooded, and Games of Divinity. This influence seemed to drop off as first edition went along though, especially in the "Aspect" books for DBs and Cult of the Illuminated. By the time second edition came around, anime was _the_ force behind Exalted, down to one of the suggested campaign options in the corebook involving a Voltron-style team of solars who flew around in magitech cats.

And that's the second part - the "magitech". I really like the view of magic and the gods presented in Exalted until Sidereals came out. Sidereals wasn't too bad by itself, but combined with Savant and Sorceror, House of the Bull God, Outcastes, Exalted: Autochtonians and the magitech of the Mountain Folk in Exalted: the Fair Folk (which I otherwise think is one of the coolest books in the 1st ed game), I just lost my taste for the way Exalted wanted its magic to work. I play sci-fi games if I want jet fighters and laser pistols. The 2nd ed corebook seemed like it was really going to emphasise that kind of play, and it was at that point that I gave it up and haven't gone back.

Quote from: walkerpI have a fairly major beef with WotC-based D20 products and the way the baseline assumption is that there is no other way to roleplay and that if you don't follow their class and level structures, you are cheating.  

This is pretty absurd, given that in D20 there are versions of the game which don't have classes or don't have levels.

RPGPundit

Yes, but to be fair, those aren't WotC products, which is what he was complaining about. Every WotC D&D and d20 product I've seen has classes and levels, even if those classes might change from product to product.

I beef D20.

For it's flat probablility, shitty skill system and it's inability to accomplish anything with any degree of believability. I also hate it's reactive ruleset and reliance on classes and levels which allows only "wiggle-room" for player concepts.


I beef D&D for all these reasons + it's ridiculous Magic systems. Also, the abstract Hit Point damage system.


Although...I may have been spoiled by all the books WW has put out. With it's focus on story over game and bell curved dice pool system.

I've got no beef with any shit you choose to play. You! I'm talking to you, Spotty Herbert!

Quote from: LacrioxusFor D&D/D20Modern I have some advice.
Hunt down the AD&D2e GM Screens. They include Hit Location Tables and Citical Hit tables.
The Hit Location Table, If you score more than like 8 or 9 damage to say the Torso, They are DEAD or Dieing. No matter how much HP they have. It is easy to sever limbs this way too to disarm foes on the fly. It is a GREAT addition to and D&D game AD&D2e or D&D3e+ or d20Modern or whathave you.

Just use the damage threshhold optional rules. They're in the d20 modern book.

If they take more than their Con in damage, they make a Fort save DC 15 +damage over Con or die.

D20. Cause I hate the damage system. I hate the incremental improvement of class levels ("Wow, a +2 sword to go with my +1 to strength! I'll be whipping ass now! Oh, we're fighting things with more hitpoints now?").

The magic system.

How the current community of creators for D20 use every excuse they can find to add to the legion of prestige classes.


When 3.0 first dropped, I thought Prestige Classes were genius. I had played Baldur's Gate and the kits in there were pretty swank, but the actual implementation feels like the classes are just a collection of contrived excuses for a character to be a "specialist" and then players have to find the most obscure printed prestige class in an effort to make their character different.

Also, that it feels like it's the only game in town.

Quote from: Dr Rotwang!Of course I'm joking, dude.  Question is, do you house-rule that away, or not?  I bet you do, and then I wonder why it's a beef at all.

Yeah, that was pretty good indeed. It was lean and didn't go against the grain.  You have a rare wit, sir!   :haw:

Yes indeed! It's rare to see something so well done in this medium, particularly with nothing important at steak. I mean, this is just a place where we can all chew the fat together, which is marble-ous, but some take it too seriously, and make nasty, cutting remarks, which are hard to swallow. When I'm making a choice on a lean, trimmed-off, low-fat system, I want all the gristley details, with a minimum of spam.

-clash

I pretty much think lots of game systems out there are pretty damn ghey. Even the ones I like have their bad days.

For instance I love Shadowrun 3rd Edition, and although I own 4th Edition I have yet to play it, so I will keep my comments to SR3:

• I pretty much hate must of the punk elements of Cyberpunk, because they're GHEY.
• Furries were never fun for me, and if I wanted to play a good furry game I'd play TMNT. Surge is ass on a stick.
• Environmental Disasters aren't always the answer, and just because we have one every five minutes doesn't make the game cooler.
• Cyber Pirates might have seemed like a good idea, but trust me it's pretty god damned queer.
• Screw selling in depth books, that add depth to the game world. We'll sell books that can barely called books, and offer a scatter shot approach to a game that traditionally sold and stood on it's amazing depth!
• Anyone who uses the word Shadowrunner to describe themselves is a complete Homo.
  
• Selling the same recycled material is always appreciated by the fans. Why rewrite or update an amazingly cool books like Lone Star and Corporate Shadowfiles when we can just reprint vast sections of therm in other books and claim it's all new stuff?

Don't even get me started on D&D. Talk about a massively crappy rules system that we enjoy playing once a week. We're getting ready to run an SR game for the first time in several months as well.

I haven't touched most other games since high school: Amber, Palladium stuff, Twilight 2000, a single misguided attempt at Vampire and Mage, Cyberpunk 2020, Underground, Shadow Conspiracy, Battletech, etc....

Now a days I just have much interest in buying new systems. I have yet to see something that really draws me in.

Quote from: flyingmiceYes indeed! It's rare to see something so well done in this medium, particularly with nothing important at steak.

"At steak"? chuckle lol rofl

Quote from: flyingmiceYes indeed! It's rare to see something so well done in this medium, particularly with nothing important at steak. I mean, this is just a place where we can all chew the fat together, which is marble-ous, but some take it too seriously, and make nasty, cutting remarks, which are hard to swallow. When I'm making a choice on a lean, trimmed-off, low-fat system, I want all the gristley details, with a minimum of spam.

-clash

Stop it, Clash.  You're really butchering the joke.

Quote from: Dr Rotwang!Stop it, Clash.  You're really butchering the joke.

Are you calling me a hack, doc? I know I have some bad tendoncies, but I think I'm as sharp as anyone in this joint. I try my best to cleave to the subject, paring things down to the bone. I'm not here to chop logic...

-clash

Doc is just jekying you around, Clash - you win by slaughter rule. I gotta hoof it to lunch..for some reason I'm craving hamburger...

Quote from: James J SkachI gotta hoof it to lunch..for some reason I'm craving hamburger...

Chicken.

AND NOW, BACK TO OUR THREAD!

You guys play rough here!  That was some painful punning the likes of which I haven't seen in some time.  I feel raw- d'oh!