Quote from: Darrin Kelley on December 26, 2023, 07:30:13 AM
Those so-called activists and ideologues don't represent anyone actually with the condition.

Yes they do. They influence policy in government and academia and media. Ostensibly to represent trans people, but really to represent their demented ideology, and exert social control over people.

QuoteIt's all political hogwash.

Well, that I agree with.

Quote from: BadApple on December 26, 2023, 08:19:48 AM
Also, if you consume any recreational pharmacology products, stop immediately. 

I don't. And I never have. I have always taken so much required medicine that recreational use would be certain suicide due to medication conflicts.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on December 26, 2023, 08:27:49 AM
Yes they do. They influence policy in government and academia and media. Ostensibly to represent trans people, but really to represent their demented ideology, and exert social control over people.

What they claim they represent has nothing to do with the reality of the condition. That's the bottom line.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley on December 26, 2023, 09:12:35 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on December 26, 2023, 08:27:49 AM
Yes they do. They influence policy in government and academia and media. Ostensibly to represent trans people, but really to represent their demented ideology, and exert social control over people.

What they claim they represent has nothing to do with the reality of the condition. That's the bottom line.

No, the bottom line is that the trans "community" is perfectly happy to be "represented" by those folks when it results in things they want, and only when their extremism results in blowback does there suddenly become a disconnect.  It's like Bad Apple said with the ADL.  While positive attention is being drawn to trans people by activists or anti-semitism being decried by the ADL, no one stands up and says "they don't speak for me!"  When someone has his life destroyed by activists because of a pronoun, actual trans people don't flood the switchboards to defend him, any more than Jewish people push back when the ADL unfairly targets political opponents.  At best, the normal folks think "not my problem."  At worst, they keep silent because they like the benefits and don't care if strangers get hurt occasionally, as long as things get better for themselves.  Either way, it doesn't matter.  By accepting the positives from the "trans-acceptance" movement, you've allowed the negatives... in your name.  The fact that you couldn't be bothered to intervene until your own ox was gored is NOT a point in your favor.

Sadly, trans people get the worst of it, because as the claims of the trans activists have gotten more ridiculous, it just gets easier to dismiss the whole thing.  Men can't become women.  Women can't become men.  Mental illness is not fixed by surgery.  Once the claims of the activists become so divorced from reality and enforced by brutal government and social sanctions, there's no "live and let live" possible any more.  One reality must be dominant.  And most people aren't going to accept the one that seems to be grooming their kids...

Quote from: Darrin Kelley on December 26, 2023, 08:28:46 AM

Quote from: BadApple on December 26, 2023, 08:19:48 AM
Also, if you consume any recreational pharmacology products, stop immediately. 

I don't. And I never have. I have always taken so much required medicine that recreational use would be certain suicide due to medication conflicts.

If you're on a bunch of medications then likely your liver is very stressed.  Talk to a dietitian about liver support and health.  You may get some easy food choice solutions that give you a much better quality of life.

If estrogen is making your migraines go away, it's masking a problem and not fixing it.  I wasn't judging you or assuming anything with the comment about narcotics except they can aggravate serious health problems that the estrogen could be covering up.  I just believe in informed consent.

I don't think transitioning is a good choice for anyone.  At best, you trade one set of life issue for another and at worst it can pile up problems to the point of completely ruining your life.  That said, it's your life and your journey.  I hope you find some serenity and meaning.

If you, like so many of us, have other mental health issues then get them treated directly rather than assuming that transitioning (or any other indirectly connected action) is going to fix it.  I hope you can find a professional that doesn't judge you but does challenge you to face and deal with the heavy problems in your life.

Finally, if you see us talking and complaining about the trans community, we are talking about those who are being asshats.  Many people will be uncomfortable with the idea of being trans but you'll find many more that will be sympathetic to your problems and willing to be on good terms.  No one is fully accepted by everyone and most people are only accepted as who they are by about 20% of those they know. 

You can be our friend and ally and we yours if you're willing to try and share perspectives.

I'm not assuming anything. I have been committed to transitioning for far more than a decade. I know it's the right choice for me. And any second thoughts I did have about it are long in the past. What's done will be done.

There is no room for argument at this stage of my life. I am committed. For the good and the bad of it. It was not a casual decision.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley on December 26, 2023, 10:32:35 AM
I'm not assuming anything. I have been committed to transitioning for far more than a decade. I know it's the right choice for me. And any second thoughts I did have about it are long in the past. What's done will be done.

There is no room for argument at this stage of my life. I am committed. For the good and the bad of it. It was not a casual decision.

Good luck to you. But just because you are committed does not mean you are correct.

Quote from: squirewaldo on December 26, 2023, 10:40:01 AM
Good luck to you. But just because you are committed does not mean you are correct.

That's not really your decision. Is it?

Ultimately, what you do with your body past adulthood is your decision, no question. Doesn't mean folks have to agree it's the best choice or that there isn't potentially an objective better or worse that folks can spend time arguing about, but sure.

Personally, for instance, I don't see a problem with what folks call gender expression, or acting against stereotypes and the like. If anything it can be positive at times. Though I do fear mainstream trans ideology promotes those stereotypes and bs oftentimes through associating psychology firmly with sex. If folks want to have expensive cosmetic surgery, I guess that's their own decision, and hopefully they at least get something out of it. But I'm not necessarily going to cheer for it at all times either.

When pronouns are required on the part of other people, while generally I'll go for it out of fear or conflict avoidance, I think it starts pushing into the domain of requiring society and the judgements of others to fit one's own ideology. In Canada and elsewhere, there are actual legal repercussions for speaking your mind on that, which is pretty stupid. There can be retaliations even here within an intra-corporate context.

I think most folks would agree that children shouldn't get to suddenly change their medical choice paradigm within a legal context here and only here to act without parental consent. Likewise, I'd be skeptical of any parent who transitioned their child at a young age or the like. Especially since detransitioning can be as hard socially or biologically as it oftentimes is. And children who cannot even vote or have the mental capacity to have guardianship over themselves seem to me potentially vulnerable within that sort of context.

There's obviously a whole lot more to say and discuss, on both sides of the equation. But at the same time, my point is that people can absolutely have opinions on the issues. And that is arguably their decision and civic duty to try and think things through that impact society, so to speak.

Quote from: Koltar on December 24, 2023, 11:15:40 PM
The use of "CisHet" does feel like a slur.

- Ed c.

I agree, but it only feels like a slur because it is a slur. I just meant that it doesn't fell like a slur but it's not. I always meant that it is a slur.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley on December 26, 2023, 06:27:28 AM
You know what? I'm done here.

The people here spewing trans hate and misinformation have nothing to do with the reality of the condition itself. It just spreads bigotry. Which I deal with enough every day. I'm done. I've had enough.

I can handle people like Pawsplay misinforming people with pro-tans-hate and racist bigotry.  It's good to have a free speech forum that lets people's true colors be known.

"Blah, blah trans-hate" Pics or it didn't happen

"The trans activists don't speak for us"

Yes, they do, unless you as a "community" are out there opposing them they are your defacto representatives, it's really easy to stay silent (giving your tacit agreement and support) until you need to throw them under the bus in a private setting only to go back to your original silent position.

I'm done with engaging with hatemongers.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley on December 26, 2023, 10:43:43 AM

Quote from: squirewaldo on December 26, 2023, 10:40:01 AM
Good luck to you. But just because you are committed does not mean you are correct.

That's not really your decision. Is it?

You are absolutely correct. It is not my decision to make. And as such, being a live and let live sort of guy (at least I like to think that...) what you believe is none of my business unless you make it my business.

However, when and if your belief system goes beyond that, and you insist that not only you be left to your own beliefs, but that others HAVE to accept them as truth/gospel, and that any failure to do so should be punished, you are making it my business in a very negative way.

I have no idea if you are extending your beliefs in that way (I am using 'you and your' as a grammatical convenience...), but many many many trans activists do just that.

Again, best of luck!

Quote from: Darrin Kelley on December 26, 2023, 11:54:02 AM
I'm done with engaging with hatemongers.

What a pity you are incapable of distinguishing between people who simply disagree with you vs people who hate you. It is just another delusion you suffer from. But it only harms you... for now.