(if you aren't familiar with the term, the Pundit defines it here)

RPGs are an inherently escapist hobby.  They are about pretending to be someone else for a while.  This means that they will appeal to someone with a tenuous grasp on the consentually perceived reality or who has something about themselves or their life that they want to escape from

Also, the complex formal systems will appeal to high-functioning autistics like those with Aspergers syndrome as will the creation of a world where you can control the details (I'm speaking as an Aspie myself).  There's a strong collaration between autistic spectrum disorders and social disfunction (heck, it's one of the differential diagnostics).  Many autistics have a problem with strong sensations on their skin (part of the reason why they don't like being touched) and this can manifest as poor personal hygiene

(myself, I've learnt to "ride the wave" - showering and being hugged feels goooooooood)

None of these are excuses.  They're reasons why these people are attracted to our hobby

Assuming this is true, what can and should be done.  I have some ideas, but I'd like to hear other responses first

Edit: Added more 'o's to good

I think, yes, you're pretty much right, there will always be lawncrappers, but that doesn't mean there have to be lawncrappers at one's gaming table.  Not wanting to game with someone because they stink isn't elitism or snobbery, it's sound hygienic policy.  I'm sure others will step and talk about just quietly telling people in order to play with your group, they need to shower.  And that's cool, too.

If you ask me, any hobby is susceptible to folks taking it too seriously. It's just a matter of not really kicking them out, because you can't really force people to not do things they want to do, but either slowly induct them to the rules of proper conduct, or make them play with someone else.

I try to interview new people who want to join our group.  I meet them in a public place and talk to them about the game.  If I don't like the person, I won't call them to join us.  It's as simple as that.

I'm not a lawncrapper.  I'm a very functional graduate student.

I think they're inevitable, sure. I also think it's good when they can find one another and have their very own groups consisting entirely of folk who can deal with their presence, because I can't.

Its inevitable that Lawncrappers exist in all areas of hobbies or social structures, but it is accepting it as part of the norm that is wrong.

Knowing that there is that scary smelly guy in the FLGS is enough to put you off, especially when you are at an impressionable age.

It is kicking these sods out of your group that we are saying.

Quote from: S. John RossI think they're inevitable, sure. I also think it's good when they can find one another and have their very own groups consisting entirely of folk who can deal with their presence, because I can't.

For some reason, thinking about this reminded me of that Blind Melon video.

I think they're inevitable in any hobby that, at some point, might require you to venture into the general hobby goer population for new gamers, a convention, or even a trip to the game store.

Some percentage of the population is screwed up. Just three weeks ago I had a meth addict almost run me over with his bike, jump off it, throw himself on the ground, and start begging for money. I mean, does that make this guy a methamphetamine lawn crapper? Do the other meth heads sit around thinking, "Man, meth would be so much cooler if we didn't have so many freaks doing it?"

Anyway, regardless of what you do messed up people will also do it. In the case of RPGs, we can always hope that the socially dysfunctional will all retreat to the comforting, no social skills required World of Warcraft.

They can have 'em!

Quote from: mearlsSome percentage of the population is screwed up. Just three weeks ago I had a meth addict almost run me over with his bike, jump off it, throw himself on the ground, and start begging for money. I mean, does that make this guy a methamphetamine lawn crapper? Do the other meth heads sit around thinking, "Man, meth would be so much cooler if we didn't have so many freaks doing it?"

Well, Mearls, generally speaking the meth-smoking percentage of our population is pretty well screwed up already.

Did you seriously just compare the RPG hobby to Meth addiction? :wtfsign:

RPGPundit

Quote from: mearlsAnyway, regardless of what you do messed up people will also do it. In the case of RPGs, we can always hope that the socially dysfunctional will all retreat to the comforting, no social skills required World of Warcraft.

They can have 'em!

Like Stephen Colbert said: "Enjoy your magnificent isolation!"

Or, if you want the green screen version...

Quote from: mearlsDo the other meth heads sit around thinking, "Man, meth would be so much cooler if we didn't have so many freaks doing it?"

Not that it has anything to do with the discussion, but I felt the need to answer your rhetorical question.

Yes.  They do.

Quote from: RPGPunditWell, Mearls, generally speaking the meth-smoking percentage of our population is pretty well screwed up already.

Did you seriously just compare the RPG hobby to Meth addiction? :wtfsign:

Only in a (failed) attempt at humor.

I think the goal of improving the image of RPGs is a laudable one, but RPGs are simply too niche to ever gain reasonable media coverage.

The media will always focus on the fringe aspects of whatever niche hobby or activity they cover. It's simply a better story. A story about crazed baseball fans simply doesn't resonate, because almost everyone in the US knows a baseball fan and can plainly see that he's not crazy.

The same thing is increasingly true for console games. They're in so many households, and used by so many people, that any attempt to paint their users as maladjusted or weird is bound to fail.

We see things like WoW and RPGs portrayed in such negative light because, unless there's a freak angle, people really don't care to read about it.

Now, I do wholeheartedly agree that individuals and groups should try to help normalize people with destructive personal habits. I worked as a sysadmin at a college and joined the school's gaming club. One guy at the club absolutely refused to bathe, and NOBODY in the group confronted him about it. His stench was so bad that any social gathering that he showed up to quickly dispersed, yet no one ever said anything to him. Publicly advertised group meetings were always cursed by his presence. In my POV, the club quickly lost any casual or fringe gamers and became the retreat of the hardcore gamers who were willing to condone the guy's behavior.

So, I think there are ways that gaming can refrom its image, but there's only so much you can do. There will always be messed up people in gaming, and in many cases merely confronting them about it (Bathe, goddamnit!) doesn't do any good.

I mean, what are you supposed to do? Fire someone from gaming? You can't prevent people from going into a store or showing up at a con. And where the heck do you draw the line? I'd have gladly kicked the shrieking anime girls out of GenCon, but I doubt that I'd be in the majority if it came to a vote.

Quote from: mearlsI mean, what are you supposed to do? Fire someone from gaming? You can't prevent people from going into a store or showing up at a con. And where the heck do you draw the line? I'd have gladly kicked the shrieking anime girls out of GenCon, but I doubt that I'd be in the majority if it came to a vote.

I guess we know who was responsible for that busted water main at the Hyatt this year that wiped out some of their events. :heh:

Quote from: GabrielNot that it has anything to do with the discussion, but I felt the need to answer your rhetorical question.

Yes.  They do.

So, so true. Hell, I remember when crack was classy, before all of the nutters got into it.

Those were the days.

QuoteSo, so true. Hell, I remember when crack was classy, before all of the nutters got into it.

Those were the days.

:teehee: