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Against the Darkmaster?

Started by Pen, February 27, 2023, 09:01:49 PM

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Pen

February 27, 2023, 09:01:49 PM
Anyone tried this game?  It's a MERP clone.

Persimmon

#1
February 27, 2023, 10:07:08 PM
Yep; wanted to like it and it has a cool vibe, but after the tedium of creating characters (which is also rather true for MERP) we just asked "Why not just play MERP?"  I was hoping it was more streamlined than MERP, but it's not.  I think the rules might even be harder to follow as they're roughly three times longer.  And I'm too old school to worry about crap like my characters' passions.

It's not a bad game and there are some cool ideas for world-building, creating villains, etc., but my current players just weren't going to play and there's no local interest from what I can tell.

Baron

#2
February 27, 2023, 11:37:40 PM Last Edit: February 28, 2023, 11:57:06 AM by Baron
I found MERP a drag, and Rolemaster gave me screaming fits. If Against the Darkmaster is no improvement, then I'm rather disappointed (have it on the ol' hard drive somewhere).

On the other hand, if you're looking for a decent game system to use with all those ICE Middle Earth supplements, I suggest Age of Shadow, which is based on the old d100 Chaosium system. http://ageofshadow.freehostia.com/

I'll probably end up using that if I ever get around to ME. Maybe with some supplemental stuff from some of the fan creations from BRP Central.

Pen

#3
February 27, 2023, 11:43:52 PM
I love Age of Shadows. I have the print version. It's great.  It's very Middle earth with the serial numbers filed off.

rusty shackleford

#4
February 28, 2023, 04:04:14 AM Last Edit: February 28, 2023, 04:05:48 AM by rusty shackleford
I love MERP and am an unabashed ICE fanboy, but I skipped on this game due to a morality appeal on their licensing page while perusing their site with intention to purchase it:
https://www.vsdarkmaster.com/open-license/
QuoteTTRPGs are for anyone: sexist, racist, homophobic, and transphobic tropes and themes have no place in our hobby. Please make sure to avoid them when creating your content.
I can't tell if they actually meant for this to be a clause in their license or a general statement. There is no definition of these words if it was part of the legal terms(these are words very open to interpretation — for example, would Tolkien's views on homosexual marriage be "homophobic"?), and if it was a general statement it simply doesn't belong on that page.

This may not be an issue for most, I just find these sort of things off-putting.

SHARK

#5
February 28, 2023, 05:29:09 AM
Quote from: rusty shackleford on February 28, 2023, 04:04:14 AM
I love MERP and am an unabashed ICE fanboy, but I skipped on this game due to a morality appeal on their licensing page while perusing their site with intention to purchase it:
https://www.vsdarkmaster.com/open-license/
QuoteTTRPGs are for anyone: sexist, racist, homophobic, and transphobic tropes and themes have no place in our hobby. Please make sure to avoid them when creating your content.
I can't tell if they actually meant for this to be a clause in their license or a general statement. There is no definition of these words if it was part of the legal terms(these are words very open to interpretation — for example, would Tolkien's views on homosexual marriage be "homophobic"?), and if it was a general statement it simply doesn't belong on that page.

This may not be an issue for most, I just find these sort of things off-putting.

Greetings!

Interesting. I own all of the MERP and Rolemaster books. *Against the Darkmaster* likely would have been a product of keen interest for me. I would have been inclined to buy all of their relevant books for their Darkmaster game.

However, that little Woke, moralistic snot sobbing admonition they tacked onto their open license is a HARD NO for me. They can go pound sound and sob in their safe space. I hope they go broke. They won't get so much as a dime from me.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

Arioch

#6
February 28, 2023, 05:47:09 AM
Quote from: Pen on February 27, 2023, 09:01:49 PM
Anyone tried this game?  It's a MERP clone.

Just a clarification: while Against the Darkmaster is admittedly inspired by MERP, and openly recreates some of its mechanics, it is not an exact clone of MERP. It's pretty easy to convert MERP stuff to VsD, but if you're looking for a 1:1 copy, you won't find it in VsD. So, keep that into consideration before buying the book (though, if you still on the fence, you can check out the Quickstart rules for free: https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/273729/Against-the-Darkmaster--Quickstart ).

Persimmon

#7
February 28, 2023, 08:50:26 AM
I'll add the first few published adventures for it are pretty meh.  They had a KS last fall for expansions, but I was already out by that point so I can't offer my opinion on them.  If I found the right group, I'd go back to MERP, but it's just not for my current crew.  We tried the new version of TOR, but hated the board-gamey feel and intrusive mechanics.

Wtrmute

#8
February 28, 2023, 09:32:29 AM
Quote from: rusty shackleford on February 28, 2023, 04:04:14 AM
I love MERP and am an unabashed ICE fanboy, but I skipped on this game due to a morality appeal on their licensing page while perusing their site with intention to purchase it:
https://www.vsdarkmaster.com/open-license/
QuoteTTRPGs are for anyone: sexist, racist, homophobic, and transphobic tropes and themes have no place in our hobby. Please make sure to avoid them when creating your content.
I can't tell if they actually meant for this to be a clause in their license or a general statement. There is no definition of these words if it was part of the legal terms(these are words very open to interpretation — for example, would Tolkien's views on homosexual marriage be "homophobic"?), and if it was a general statement it simply doesn't belong on that page.

This may not be an issue for most, I just find these sort of things off-putting.

It is off-putting, definitely. It's also, on its face, self-contradictory: if TTRPGs are for anyone, aren't they also for sexists, racists, homophobes and transphobes? If they said "if you use those tropes and themes, don't tell us about it" or "You're not allowed to publish supplemental material for this game which contains any of these tropes and themes," then fine, but saying "these elements an preferences are badong" is a bridge too far.

Brad

#9
February 28, 2023, 10:25:58 AM
I guess the trope that orcs are a vile, evil race is racist. And Eowyn being forced to disguise herself in order to go to war is sexist.

So...how exactly can I use this game to play a Middle-Earth campaign?

And I am 100% certain that Tolkien, a hardcore Catholic, would find homosexuality and transsexuals problematic. Whatever.
It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance.

Pen

#10
February 28, 2023, 10:51:32 AM
Quote from: rusty shackleford on February 28, 2023, 04:04:14 AM
I love MERP and am an unabashed ICE fanboy, but I skipped on this game due to a morality appeal on their licensing page while perusing their site with intention to purchase it:
https://www.vsdarkmaster.com/open-license/
QuoteTTRPGs are for anyone: sexist, racist, homophobic, and transphobic tropes and themes have no place in our hobby. Please make sure to avoid them when creating your content.
I can't tell if they actually meant for this to be a clause in their license or a general statement. There is no definition of these words if it was part of the legal terms(these are words very open to interpretation — for example, would Tolkien's views on homosexual marriage be "homophobic"?), and if it was a general statement it simply doesn't belong on that page.

This may not be an issue for most, I just find these sort of things off-putting.


Definitely a hard no for me then.  Virtue signaling does the exact opposite for me.

I never played MERPS but have found memories of it.  My mom bought it for me when I was too young to understand the rules. I remember looking at the pictures and thinking how cool it looked.  I think I did a small intro adventure at the beginning of the book.

Tasty_Wind

#11
February 28, 2023, 06:45:11 PM
Short version: I like the system, but as other have stated, character creation is a slog.

Maybe I'm just a poser, but I'm starting to wish that if a game isn't an old school BX clone where it takes 10 minutes max to make a character, the game company would offer a series of free PDFs for premade characters.

Arioch

#12
March 01, 2023, 03:20:43 AM
Quote from: Tasty_Wind on February 28, 2023, 06:45:11 PM
Short version: I like the system, but as other have stated, character creation is a slog.

Maybe I'm just a poser, but I'm starting to wish that if a game isn't an old school BX clone where it takes 10 minutes max to make a character, the game company would offer a series of free PDFs for premade characters.

To this we can actually help, there are 6 premade characters in the Core Rules, but you can get them also here for free: https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/274741/Against-the-Darkmaster--Ready-to-Play-Characters

We'll be including 6 more in the new supplement, and probably some extra pregen in our future adventures.

Punch and Pie

#13
March 01, 2023, 05:27:30 AM
Quote from: Pen on February 27, 2023, 11:43:52 PM
I love Age of Shadows. I have the print version. It's great.  It's very Middle earth with the serial numbers filed off.

Is this the same Age of Shadow?
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/93513/The-Age-of-Shadow-Roleplaying-Game

Punch and Pie

#14
March 01, 2023, 05:40:17 AM
Quote from: rusty shackleford on February 28, 2023, 04:04:14 AM
I love MERP and am an unabashed ICE fanboy, but I skipped on this game due to a morality appeal on their licensing page while perusing their site with intention to purchase it:
https://www.vsdarkmaster.com/open-license/
QuoteTTRPGs are for anyone: sexist, racist, homophobic, and transphobic tropes and themes have no place in our hobby. Please make sure to avoid them when creating your content.

Well, it does say:
QuoteThe awesome people of Mörk Borg came to our rescue, kindly letting us use their third party license ..as a reference to write our own. And thus, the Powered by Open00 license was born.

so maybe it was a quick copy/paste.

I don't recall, wasn't Against the Darkmaster Core Rules translated from Italian? 

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