I have heard much love for Adventures in Middle Earth. How much does ACTUAL PLAY in AME differ from the actual play in a regular 5e campaign?
AKA, how different is AME from a usual D&D campaign?
And if you do find there is a difference, what does AME do that achieves this?
Haven't actually played it, but I've read the player's and GM books. The most significant departure is the lack of magical spells and magical healing. It really does a good job of gritty fantasy. There's also a lot less magic items. Race is not discussed, instead everyone has a culture, with dwarves and elves as just another culture variant.
The GM book has some nice monster-building tools. Stuff that should have been in the 5e DMG, I think.
You could easily run a GoT style game with it. The Tolkienism is very much "baked in" so you might have to do a little house ruling to get it over to the preferred style of play. Of course if you're happy playing in Middle Earth, it is perfect.
I am pondering a way to convert it to the Midnight setting and trying it that way.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1000287I have heard much love for Adventures in Middle Earth. How much does ACTUAL PLAY in AME differ from the actual play in a regular 5e campaign?
It deadlier
Quote from: Spinachcat;1000287AKA, how different is AME from a usual D&D campaign?
Very, it is way more people oriented, wilderness journey are a factor.
However it also very familiar due to the prevalence of Tolkien tropes in D&D and the use of the D&D 5e rules to handle combat and task resolution.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1000287And if you do find there is a difference, what does AME do that achieves
this?
1) No magic users and very little in the way of anything that can be considered an outright spell. However there is magic it just low key. For example scholar can heal, remove conditions (given time), and make useful herbs.
2) The Fellowship rules, The Journey Rules, and the size of Middle Earth even when focused on a region like Wilderland.
3) Sauron's Shadow as source of corruption.
These three factors make using the AiME a very different experience than using D&D 5e rules 'as is'. And interestingly the three things above and the other AiME can be mixed with bog standard D&D 5e to produce different feel for the campaign. For example using Sauron's Shadow and corruption instead of alignment in D&D 5e. Or use the Fellowship Rules, and Journey rules with D&D 5e. Or use AiME classes in place of D&D 5e classes but keep everything else the same. AiME is by far the best 3PP supplement for D&D 5e and I feel a contender for one of the best 3PP supplements of all times.
Some further details,
I am currently running a weekly campaign with two players.
Farin - a dwarf warrior from the Lonely Mountain
Enoch - a human scholar from Lake-Town
The campaign started in the Spring of 2946 five years after the Battle of Five Armies. Wilderland has experienced prosperity and a huge celebration of the victory is going to be held in Dale in November
Farin is haunted by a vision that he will die by the fangs of a wolf, and Enoch is a son of a recently wealthy Lake-town merchant who somewhat disapproves of his son's scholarly inclinations.
The campaign starts by Enoch sent to the house of Gloin (the father of LOTR's Gimli) where he meets Enoch. There they hear of Balin and Oin, members of Thorin's company, being lost. Enoch resolves to find the famed Dwarf and recruits Enoch's help.
I run the adventure the Marsh Bell, and the party successfully finds Balin and Oin. Along the way they met with some Mirkwood Elves. Which establishes the fact that despite the victory at the Battle of Five Armies and ensuing prosperity, the inhabitants of Wilderland still act like assholes to each other. Of course it is to be expected since the leader of the elven patrol was the ex-cellarmaster that Bilbo stole the keys off of.
As far as mechanics go, the Journey rules took some getting used too. Basically it is a system of generating encounters while going from one place to the next in Middle Earth. it flexible in that it is not on a per hex basis. Instead a number of encounters is generate depending on the length of the journey. It up to the referee to best place these encounters. The encounters themselves are also general. You have to be comfortable with improvisation to make full use of them.
Over time I think they are outstanding for a Middle Earth campaign. They have the right level of specifics versus generic. Being able to choose where they occur along the Journey is great. Finally the resolution of the encounter have far more options than beating something up and taking their shit (although that could occur).
One reason is that Exhaustion is an important mechanics used by the rules. And the standard way to recover exhaustion is to take a long rest which for the most part can only occur during the fellowship phase not during an adventure.
The series of adventures involved escorting a merchant across Mirkwoods and helping a bunch of hobbit who own an inn next to one of the Anduin fords find a lost relative. I am using Adventures in Wilderland for the most part as I am try to get a feel for a AiME campaign. But recent sessions seen the introduction of my own ideas relating to Farin's vision and the growing fame of Enoch as a healer.
The Fellowship phase has worked out well so far. However I can see it being an issue for groups who are on the go all the time. Basically the campaign has flowed like this.
Laketown - the party meets in April of 2946
Rescues Balin and Oin and return to Lake Town
Fellowship Phase
It now Summer (July) 2946
Enoch has been helping his father, Farin been working for Gloin.
The group decides to help a friend of Enoch's father journey across Mirkwood to the Forest Gate.
Adventure.
Arrives at the Forest Gate.
Instead of going to Woodsmen Town with the Merchant, the party decides to head south.
Arrives at the Old Ford. Decide to stay there for a while as there is an inn (Inn of the Crossing) and a small hamlet.
Fellowship Phase Both work around the Old Ford and open it as a Sanctuary. Now they can take long rests there. In-game Farin works as a guard and Enoch pitches in as a healer.
It now September of 2946
The party hears of a family of hobbit who has a relative missing. Decides to go help.
They track the missing relative to the High Pass over the Misty Mountain. Successfully manages to evade a horde of goblins looking for the hobbit and his small mule train.
Returns the hobbit to his family at the Easterly Inn. They now are considered friends and can stay at the Inn. The party returns to the crossing.
Fellowship Phase - Farin works as a Guard at the Crossing and earns some gold. Enoch decide he want to meet Beorn (the werebear guy) and see if he can become a client. The meeting goes well despite Beorn dislike of Farin and asks Enoch to deliver a message to Radagast at Rhosgobel.
When they leave the Old Ford is now October of 2947.
They journey to Rhosgobel, they meet and rescue Beran one of Radagast's watchers from the minion of the Lord of Tyrant Hill. The Lord of Tyrant Hill has occupied a ruined tower in Mirkwood and gathered to him many who were left masterless after the downfall of the Necromancer of Dol Guldur. The party was outnumbered but thanks to Enoch's wit half of the bandits attacked the other half.
The party got Beran to Rhosgobel who had a report that orcs were seen gathering at Fenbridge Castle an outlying outpost of Dol Gulgur. They were given accommodation and could consider Rhosgobel a sanctuary.
Fellowship Phase - Farin works at a Forge and works off some corruption (Shadow Points). Enoch gathers herbs.
It now November of 2946
A local child goes missing in a cave and Farin and Enoch take point on the rescue. They find vicious lizard like creatures called Eye-biters and fend them off but sustain injury. In the back of the cave they find an old dwarven made secret door. Beyond which they found the missing child and the River-folk peddler that abducted her. The party found he was under the influence of a dagger made in Dol Guldur and were able to successfully overpower the peddler and neutralize the dagger.
The girl was returned to her parent, with Radagast's help the dagger was destroyed. The woodsmen of Rhosgobel wanted to hang the peddler but Enoch convinced him that exile was more merciful. Radagast helped by conjuring a fresh breeze that gave Enoch advantage on his Persuasion roll.
Fellowship Phase.
Farin worked off the last of his shadow points, while Enoch was given the title of Friends of the Woodsmen and granted a small holding at Rhosgobel.
It now January 2946, (the year starts in March).
The party hears a friend that was injured at the Inn of the Crossing during a Wolf attack and decide to head back despite being the middle of winter.
Unfortunately they were spotted by men from Tyrant Hill's who were stationed around Rhosgobel to find out what happened to the earlier party. (The effect of which was that unbeknownst to all the party members their rolls are at a disadvantage).
About three days into the journey the party's path was block by fallen trees and branches. It took them a whole day to get through at the end of which they were exhausted (Level 1 all rolls at a disadvantage). Unbeknownst to them the Men from Tyrant Hill got ahead of them and altered the path into that area.
The party was observant enough to notice the alteration when they return to the original path. On their guard they were not surprise a day later when the Men of Tyrant ambushed them (the next event I rolled on the Journey chart). The fight did not go well and the party had to surrender.
However once again, Enoch used his wits and manipulated the greed of one of the bandits. The next night he managed to convince him that the dwarf Farin had a hidden treasure cache nearby. The three marched into the Wilderness during the bandit's night shift (there were only three bandits).
There the lamest but most epic fight ensued. The party won when Enoch managed to smash and ignite a flask of oil on the bandit. They feld 20 miles east to Woodland Hall and suffered another level of exhaustion after arrival. But their fame preceded them and the men of Woodland Hall gladly gathered a forces and tracked down the bandits and recovered the party's possessions.
Enoch was able to secure some herbs and brewed a potion to remove a level of exhaustion. Although still at disadvantage the party made the short remaining journey to the Old Ford and was able to heal their friend.
Fellowship Phase, Farin returned to Guarding the Ford, earned some more gold and again inspiration from all the tales of people returning from the Gathering of Five Armies. Enoch took the time to learn Expertise for his Persuasion skill.
The last session was completely unscripted and resulted from me improvising from the Journey rules.
The next time we play it will be in the Spring of 2947.
Overall I am getting the hang of the different pace and enjoying myself running this campaign. I am beginning to see how I write my own take on the Journey and Fellowship rules for my Majestic Wilderlands campaign.
I have it, but haven't used it. What it wants to do is largely stuff that I don't want to do, and I'm not going to run a game in Middle Earth (or any setting famous from a novel). I bought it based on early reviews and high hopes for the journey rules and maybe using bits and pieces in a regular D&D game. The journey rules leave me completely cold.
I do agree it is put together well, in both organization and clarity. I was a little disappointed in the amount of content for the price, as it uses a lot of sparse layout to give the book more pages than it really needs. Though having decided to do that, they use the sparse layout well to make it a pleasure to read and look at. YMMV.
I'll probably use it to run my next Forgotten Realms game.
The AiME rules for journeys/fellowship phase etc, seem to me to be what a Realms North campaign would most likely be like. Sure, with all the orcs and ruins you could murderhobo it around, but more likely even the most roving group would be more likely closer to Indiana Jones. You'd winter in various places, doing research, getting involved in the different communities, building contacts and information sources to plan next Springs expedition, with lots of minor happenings to get involved with...or not.
I don't really get the Fellowship/Journey rules. They seem very vague and don't really explain how it works, or what effect they have.
From what I understand, during the "rest" phase the players just make up whatever they want. How's that different than the DM just asking them what they did in the time interval?
Q: Adventures in Middle Earth vs. a "regular" 5e campaign?
A: [ATTACH=CONFIG]1777[/ATTACH]
Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;1000687I don't really get the Fellowship/Journey rules. They seem very vague and don't really explain how it works, or what effect they have.
From what I understand, during the "rest" phase the players just make up whatever they want. How's that different than the DM just asking them what they did in the time interval?
I'm afraid you'll have to get more specific about any parts you don't understand. The rules are a little vague to allow for flexibility, but the effects are very much laid out. The Loremaster's Guide expands on both Journeys and the Fellowship Phase, in case you were unaware.
The Fellowship Phase is sort of like downtime in a normal game of D&D, but it's more codified. Groups can split up or not, and where they spend that downtime matters (as well as how much time they have). There's a list of the most common undertakings that characters will want to do, but that's not all that they're limited to pick from. They can certainly come up with something else, and a GM can always improvise the effects those undertakings can bring. I've got all of the TOR books, and that system has added dozens of extra undertakings, so I have no doubt that we'll see even more options added to AME as more books come out for the 5e version of the game. Regardless of the options, though, expect Heal Corruption to see a lot of use until characters find a way to get advantage on those Corruption tests.
Journeys likewise have a set system. There's a nice summary on page 164 of the Player's Guide, and the Loremaster's Guide expands greatly on this including charts to allow for custom event tables.
Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;1000687I don't really get the Fellowship/Journey rules. They seem very vague and don't really explain how it works, or what effect they have.
The Journey rules are specific in effect, it just what causes the effect is vague and require some improve by the GM. Event then the Loremaster's Screen has booklet that gives additional tables to flesh it out. Finally the one thing to remember is that the Journey and much of Adventures of Middle Earth require that the players roleplay circumstances not of their own choosing. Similar to Pendragon Virtue and Call of Chuthlu insanity.
Journeys have a Embarkation roll which sets the initial tone of the journey, then a series of events, then depending on how the events where handled by the players a final arrival roll.
For example
Embarkation:
Feast Fit for the Kings of Ancient Times
+1 to all skill checks
Embarkation Roll: 7
Check DC: 13
Journey Events:
Event #1
Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Hunter: Survival test. Success results finding a Roebuck
(removes 1 level of Exhaustion or restores 1 Hit Dice).
Failure results in -1 to Arrival roll.
* The test is subject to Disadvantage/Advantage if Embarkation roll was 6 or 7.
Event #2
The Enemy is Abroad
If the Embarkation roll was a 3, there will be a combat.
Look-out: Perception. If successful, the party gain a round of surprise.
If the Embarkation roll was a 10: Look-out tests Perception or Stealth. If successful, the party avoid the enemy.
* If the roll fails, there will be combat but the party gain a round of surprise.
If the Embarkation was neither 3 nor 10: Each member of the party may test Stealth. If all are successful they may avoid the combat (If the party have horses or ponies, one of the characters must also make an Animal Handling roll).
* If any of these rolls fail, combat ensues, with no bonus to either side.
Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;1000687From what I understand, during the "rest" phase the players just make up whatever they want. How's that different than the DM just asking them what they did in the time interval?
The fellowship phase has specific undertakings that like the Journey events are specific in effect but the players and referee will have to imporv the specifics based on where the players are and what going on.
I'm a huge LOTR fan and really wanted to like ToR, which I didn't for various reasons.
I have a look at AiME and whilst it's an interesting read, I doubt I'd enjoy running or playing it.
I think some stories just don't translate easily into RPGs.
I'm not saying either RPG is bad, but it's just not to my taste.
Quote from: danskmacabre;1000898I'm a huge LOTR fan and really wanted to like ToR, which I didn't for various reasons.
I have a look at AiME and whilst it's an interesting read, I doubt I'd enjoy running or playing it.
I think some stories just don't translate easily into RPGs.
I'm not saying either RPG is bad, but it's just not to my taste.
The Wilderlands setting and their adventures is what does the trick for me. Since details of the War of the Ring in Wilderlands are so vaguely described in the LoTR there is a lot of room for the players to have an impact. In addition it has a generational aspect similar to Pendragon since the default start is decades prior the War of the Ring.
Thank you very much estar!
It sounds interesting. If I see a demo at a con, I will definitely give it a try.
I've been running AiM for about 6 months. I think the biggest change is the differing expectation for character motivation. Middle Earth doesn't really do big treasures and material awards as player motivation. Characters are intended to be genuinely heroic and unselfish and that can take some effort, depending on the group. The rules help here because they try to incentivise different behaviour. That said, things like Journeys and Fellowship phases are OK but not great. You can play them to the letter but there is still that hint of disconnect when applying them to what is essentially a D&D game.
That said, even though as a group we've drifted somewhat from a pure Middle Earth tone, we've had an absolute blast playing it.
My advice is if you want to be heavily authentic you have to invest a lot of time coming up with theme appropriate adventures. Most regular modules are a poor fit in tone and the ones produced by Cubicle 7 have the right tone but are utter tripe as far as quality adventuring goes.
Utter tripe? The Darkening of Milkwood is excellent. Can't speak to the rest of the adventures though.
Quote from: Voros;1003104Utter tripe? The Darkening of Milkwood is excellent. Can't speak to the rest of the adventures though.
What makes it excellent? I haven't read any of them, much less played them, although the game seems interesting despite the goofy Gandalf die. If I ever play Middle-earth I might try it in lieu of MERP of Lord of the Rings Adventure Game.
Quote from: Dumarest;1003110What makes it excellent? I haven't read any of them, much less played them, although the game seems interesting despite the goofy Gandalf did. If I ever play Middle-earth I might try it in lieu of MERP of Lord of the Rings Adventure Game.
It similar to the Great Pendragon Campaign. Starts five years after Battle of the Five Armies and has events extending for 30 years and ends with the death of King Bard the Bowman of Dale. It clever in weaving in things that the players can effect but keeping the larger events of the time period on track. The central conflict is the return of Sauron's shadow to Mirkwood. Like the Great Pendragon Campaign it captures the essence of Middle Earth and gives the players the freedom to create their own destiny.
Like Call of Cthulu insanity, the Shadow mechanics works well to reflect the struggle of a character to maintain hope in face of overwhelming evil. However if you are not that into roleplaying both CoC Insanity and AiME Shadow points will be unsatisfactory. Along with the fact that there no chance in hell of defeating certain foes like a Ringwraith in the traditional manner of beating it down.
What estar said. Recently heard the designer on the Gauntlet podcast and he mentioned GPC as a major inspiration for The Darkening of Milkwood.
Hmm. It's interesting that someone took inspiration from the GPC.
I guess that the GPC was somewhat inspiring to me in terms of my timeline of events in Dark Albion.
In addition to the Player's book and the Loremaster's book, I see that there are a couple of sourcebooks out as well as a set of maps. Anyone have any feedback to share about these newer products? Are there any decent fan-made adventures out there, or do I have to rely on the C7 books?
Quote from: finarvyn;1024479In addition to the Player's book and the Loremaster's book, I see that there are a couple of sourcebooks out as well as a set of maps. Anyone have any feedback to share about these newer products? Are there any decent fan-made adventures out there, or do I have to rely on the C7 books?
The problem is that AiME doesn't have much in the way of open content so the amount of fan created content is proportionally low compared to other D&D 5e variants.
The first stopping point is the AiME forum (http://forums.cubicle7.co.uk/viewforum.php?f=60&sid=262af9ddf4a00aed2a2a33e99de7855c).
There are some out there more for the The One Ring. For example the ones listed in this post (http://forums.cubicle7.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=4489).
However as it turns out nearly all of the AiME (and TOR) supplements and adventures have been excellent and worth the bucks.
In order I would get
Rhovanion Region Guide.The sourcebook for detailing the Anduin River Valley in Wilderlands and Mirkwood itself. But not Erebor, Dale or Laketown and points east and south east.
Wilderlands AdventuresSix different adventures set in the Western Wilderlands.
The Mirkwood CampaignThe closest thing to this would be the Great Pendragon Campaign. It outlines and supports a 30 year campaign in the Wilderlands starting five years after the Battle of Five Armies. It doesn't extend to the War of the Ring which takes place 30+ years after the ending this campaign.
Road Goes Ever OnContains a booklet to flesh out the possibilities with the Journey rules. But the focus is on the maps covering all of Middle Earth. Wilderlands, Eriador, Rohan/Gondor, and Mordor are covered. Basically four maps each covering the NE, NW, SW, and SE of the original map from the book. The primary use is dividing everything into regions for use with the Journey rules. However the above supplements duplicates relevant maps. So this is not necessarily a much have.
Eaves of Mirkwood and Loremaster ScreenThe only meh product of the bunch. The adventure is meh, except if you want a complete package for a demo or one-shot then it is better but only worth it if you get the PDF. The screen is pretty lackluster.
The FutureFirst each of the supplements so far has short but worth rules expansion and supplements. For example Mirkwood Campaign has rules for holdings. Rhonvanion adds more creatures.
The One Ring for the most part is ahead but AiME is catching up. Just announced is Rivendell which will probably covers eastern Eriador like the Rhonvanion does for Western Wilderlands.
They are working on the Moria boxed set which will support TOR and AiME.
TOR products with no AiME equivalents yet are
Bree, Ruins of the North (the adventures for Eastern Eriador), Erebor (Eastern Wilderlands), Laughter of Dragons (Adventures for Easter Eriador), Rohan, Oaths of the Riddermark (Adventures for Rohan). Likely that by the end of next year most of these will have been covered by AiME equivalent.
I bought the PDFs for TOR versions and they are quite good. The TOR Supplements are not rules heavy so I can use them for AiME. The only one I think could be a must have depending on how your campaign works out if set in the Wilderlands is Erebor, the Lonely Mountain.
All and all the AiME is one of the few lines (like Harnworld) I would pretty much buy automatically when my RPG budget permits.
Quote from: finarvyn;1024479In addition to the Player's book and the Loremaster's book, I see that there are a couple of sourcebooks out as well as a set of maps. Anyone have any feedback to share about these newer products? Are there any decent fan-made adventures out there, or do I have to rely on the C7 books?
I have the Wilderland Adventures book which has 7 loosely linked scenarios. They're not bad, and they highlight some of the unusual downtime mechanics. The first three adventures could be played in any order, but the last four are kind of a mini campaign that begins escorting a weary elf princess to the west and ends thwarting an evil sorcerer in the Withered Heath with some mass combat possible as the friendships forged in the Battle of five Armies is tested. It's not bad, but it is more plot-y than situation-y, and IMO, it is also somewhat over-written and fluffy like most modern hardback adventures for 5e or Pathfinder.
I've just recently gotten into AiME, but I own a lot of the TOR parallel materials and have played a little of it. I won't go into my views of TOR as a system as it isn't relevant to your question, but I feel like their supplements are very worth while and their adventures are not. The adventures are well written and produced, and I'm sure some people love them; but I find them too scripted. I have played many Middle Earth campaigns using other systems, always running it as a more or less sandbox setting with a few open ended adventure hooks. This is a very enjoyable way to approach ME because basically everyone already understands the setting well and is prepared to make their own decisions about what they would like to do (in my experience this usually means, 'go into Moria and get murdered'). I very much dislike adventures that lead the players by the nose through a story, and that is what C7 offers.
I have a bunch of TOR stuff as well, but stopped buying with AiME came out because I like the 5E rules set better than TOR. I'll have to dust off some of my books to see what they offer, as it's been a long time since I've read them (and didn't ever really play TOR).
Yes, TOR is probably the most beautiful and thoughtfully made game I wouldn't play except under duress. The player-focused initiative and range system alone puts my teeth on edge. But D&D is (and always has been) a great system for middle earth, and C7 did a great job translating their TOR material into that new format. It's seriously good. I haven't had a chance to play it AiME yet, but its a core system with 40+ years of playtesting so it is hard to see it going too far wrong.
The only bit that earns an eye roll on my part is that they are too conservative in their treatment of magic in the default recommended system. It isn't worth arguing about here, but I think you can make a very good case for more widespread and dramatic magical powers than the 'subtle magic' concept they suggest. But, because we (finally!) have a middle earth game with a good, well understood core system, it is trivial to power up your ME game to whatever degree you think appropriate - the 5E core books provide more than enough material.
True, but there is a section in the Loremaster's Guide that addresses the whole magic-using-PC thing. It lists off spells that have the Middle-earth "feel" and gives suggestions on how one can handle wizard characters. Totally optional, of course, but at least they anticipated that some folks would want to have more spells.
Is there anyone using AiME materials from the books in non-middle Earth campaigns? I'm interested in adopting the journey rules though reading this thread it seems like maybe a weak point.
I also like low magic which it seems to nail. It almost sounds like this could almost power a gritty Game of Thrones type campaign with a little effort. I know it would not be like Conan or something although the madness rules could almost lend themselves to that.
Is it worth scavenging for other than Tolkien?
I haven't done that. But the classes and backgrounds look like good foundations for a 'gritty medieval' sort of campaign, the rules for fellowship supplement the down time rules, and the Audience rules seem like a good idea for added interest in social interactions.
Ironically, there's two AiME/5e threads going and they both asking these kinds of questions.
From what I've read of the Player's and Lorekeeper's guides, AiME appears to be a great system for playing a more gritty/low-magic version of D&D. Classes transfer over better than Cultures, I would assume.
Quote from: MonsterSlayer;1024976Is there anyone using AiME materials from the books in non-middle Earth campaigns? I'm interested in adopting the journey rules though reading this thread it seems like maybe a weak point.
The overall idea is solid. It just that as presented in Adventures in Middle Earth they are tied heavily to the Middle Earth setting. But the more generic description of the event in the Loremaster Guide helps lay out the foundation of the mechanic. This makes it easier to see how it can be adapted to an arbitrary setting.
The basic gist is that you generate all the events of a journey as once. Longer journeys get more events but it not linear so never get out of hand. Then you can use your creativity as a referee to space out the events in a way that interesting. Maybe they are bunched up on a single bad day, maybe they are spread out.
There are three type of events. There is a single event that occur when you leave (the embarkation roll), one or more events along the route, and an arrival event.
It relies heavily on 5e's exhaustion mechanic which is a simple six step chart starting at having disadvantage on all ability check (including combat) and ending at death.
It works best with players that are willing to roleplay the results. Several events involve feelings of elation, wonder, discouragement, or despair.
But the general principle of the mechanic can be adapted. There are only 12 embarkation results, 20 journey events, and 8 arrival results. They are split 50-50 between the good and the bad.
Quote from: MonsterSlayer;1024976I also like low magic which it seems to nail. It almost sounds like this could almost power a gritty Game of Thrones type campaign with a little effort. I know it would not be like Conan or something although the
madness rules could almost lend themselves to that.
It about 2/3rd of the way for a Game of Throne type campaign. The problem is that like Call of Cthulu and insanity resulting from "Things Man should not know.", AiME/TOR have the idea of the Shadow, a malevolent force with Sauron at the center that prey on those left spiritually vulnerable by misdeeds and evil. GoT is much more nuanced.
Quote from: MonsterSlayer;1024976Is it worth scavenging for other than Tolkien?
Absolutely yes and everything useful for that is in the two core books. Just realize that there some work involved.
Quote from: Robyo;1025047From what I've read of the Player's and Lorekeeper's guides, AiME appears to be a great system for playing a more gritty/low-magic version of D&D. Classes transfer over better than Cultures, I would assume.
The idea of cultures instead of race is readily adaptable although the specific will need to bet tailored to one's setting.
Quote from: Larsdangly;1024978... and the Audience rules seem like a good idea for added interest in social interactions.
Can you explain a bit about the Audience rules? Here or in a separate thread?
Quote from: Bren;1025217Can you explain a bit about the Audience rules? Here or in a separate thread?
Basically, an audience is any formal interaction with one or more NPCs, but the rules are generally aimed at interactions with important or high-status NPCs who are being approached to request help, hospitality, etc.. Every audience starts with a default attitude based on the respective cultural backgrounds of the PC's and NPCs. This then is modified based on the success or failure of a roll based on the 'Traditions' skill, made by a representative of the party. Once you know the basic stance of the NPC to the party, you can then make your request (or whatever), and the resulting reaction is keyed to a table.
The audience rules are just on this side of fiddleness. What valuable is known the default attitudes various ME cultures have towards each other and the listing of NPC's expectations. The expectations provide positive and negative modifiers to the audience check. Even if you don't use the audience rules those two help a lot in roleplaying the people the characters met.
Quote from: Larsdangly;1025309Basically, an audience is any formal interaction with one or more NPCs, but the rules are generally aimed at interactions with important or high-status NPCs who are being approached to request help, hospitality, etc..
I was thinking "audience" like in a theater rather than an audience with the king. More clearer now thanks. :)
And of course there could be an audience (courtiers and what not) for my audience with the king. :D
Quote from: Larsdangly;1025309Basically, an audience is any formal interaction with one or more NPCs, but the rules are generally aimed at interactions with important or high-status NPCs who are being approached to request help, hospitality, etc.. Every audience starts with a default attitude based on the respective cultural backgrounds of the PC's and NPCs. This then is modified based on the success or failure of a roll based on the 'Traditions' skill, made by a representative of the party. Once you know the basic stance of the NPC to the party, you can then make your request (or whatever), and the resulting reaction is keyed to a table.
....why don't they just roleplay it?
That's a fair question, though you could generalize it to asking why anyone rolls anything for any non-combat interaction. Which begs the question as to why we roll anything for any interaction, in or out of combat. My opinion is that die-roll based rules are used to resolve events that have uncertain outcomes and to introduce a feeling of risk or gambling. Everyone seems to accept that this is how you should sort out what happens when you fire an arrow at someone. Some people think it an equally fun and valid way to sort out what happens when you try to befriend, intimidate, impress, etc. an NPC. I tend to agree - if this always gets handled as the players trying to wheedle something out of the DM the game devolves to 'mother may I'. And in my experience DM's manipulate outcomes and fall into ruts when they are asked to arbitrate everyone's reactions to every situation.
Quote from: RPGPundit;1025695....why don't they just roleplay it?
Yes followed by a dice rolls to see how well they changed the attitude of the target. But if the result obvious from the roleplaying then I will decide what change in attitude was. And AiME makes easier to adjudicate this by explicitly listing out expectations for most NPCs.
Of course roleplaying has to have some impact even when you use die rolling mechanics. If your approach to an audience in Thranduil's woodland court is to drop your pants and take a public dump, I'm totally cool with that but you should expect a negative outcome no matter what you roll on your d20.
Quote from: Larsdangly;1025737That's a fair question, though you could generalize it to asking why anyone rolls anything for any non-combat interaction. Which begs the question as to why we roll anything for any interaction, in or out of combat.
Indeed!
Quote from: RPGPundit;1025695....why don't they just roleplay it?
Because it's your character doing the thinking and talking not you.
Quote from: estar;1025751And AiME makes easier to adjudicate this by explicitly listing out expectations for most NPCs.
Please explain this.
When I first encountered AiME, I thought; holy shit balls!!! I love the LotR trilogy, this has to be awesome!!! But then I realized, I don't like railroad adventures; and the LotR would be a huge railroad.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1105405Please explain this.
Here is an an example from Wilderlands adventures
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3857[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3858[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3859[/ATTACH]
You could roll play by reducing everything to a dice roll. However for somebody like me who require roleplay first, roll second, it provide an outline of how to adjudicate the situation. The Expectation section defines specific factors that are important to the character, in this case Lindar. The outcome section nicely summarize the range of possible results. The section also explains what skills could be relevant.
Now for my Majestic Wilderlands this would be overkill but then I been running it for several decades so I have internalized my version of the above. The way AiME does spells out for me (and presumably others) the nuances of roleplaying Middle Earth in a clear cut format. I like it because it helps me run a Middle Earth not Rob Conley's Majestic Wilderlands with Middle Earth place names. Furthermore it not too verbose although other sections are like the character creation rules.
Quote from: Razor 007;1105408When I first encountered AiME, I thought; holy shit balls!!! I love the LotR trilogy, this has to be awesome!!! But then I realized, I don't like railroad adventures; and the LotR would be a huge railroad.
That what I thought as well, but Cubicle avoids this by focusing on different regions and the time period between the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings. Wilderlands was a particularly brilliant choice because
1) You have a fair amount details of what the region is like after the Battle of Five Armies
2) It was ultimately a battlefield in the War of the Ring
3) How that battle was won wasn't described in detail
These factors allowed Cubicle to present a region and a series of adventures that felt consequential but didn't interfere with the main story of the Lord of the Rings
Similarly the Rohan adventures, Oaths of the Riddermark (only for the One Ring at the moment) flesh out the reign of Theoden's father Thengel
Another theme for both the The One Ring RPG and AiME is the how the Shadow (the evil of Sauron) is a corrosive force on the characters spirit and psyche in a manner similar to that of Insanity and Call of Cthulu. In some way AiME is about how much you can do to save Middle Earth before you are forced to retire or succumb to the Shadow.
Quote from: rgrove0172;1105336Because it's your character doing the thinking and talking not you.
My goal is to immerse the players in Middle Earth, to get them feel like they are there as their character. So I use the Audience mechanics as guidance not as a mini-game.
Quote from: estar;1105434Here is an an example from Wilderlands adventures
I like this a lot, as I'm doing something similar.
Quote from: estar;1105434Here is an an example from Wilderlands adventures
Thank you!
How the D20 roll work? Does only one party member roll? Is there some sort of aggregate bonus among all party members? AKA, if everyone is rolling, you're gonna get various results.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1105504Thank you!
How the D20 roll work? Does only one party member roll? Is there some sort of aggregate bonus among all party members? AKA, if everyone is rolling, you're gonna get various results.
Whoever is the primary speaker makes the roll. With the usual 5e mechanics of assistance to grant advantage in play. But in the end it is whatever make sense for the situation. It expected that the typical situation is a fellowship as a whole dealing with a NPC. But if you have a group in Dale or Laketown cutting individual deals then that player rolls. And the modifiers are based that player's roleplaying and circumstances.
Also, regular 5e mechanics work here perfectly well, although most 5e things have almost no relevance in Middle Earth because magic in Middle Earth works slightly differently from D&D magic. Middle Earth also seems not to have any tradional D&D Clerics (Which were drawn from primarily European and Middle Eastern worship practices). Adventures in Middle Earth have thus far been my big 2019 gaming acquisitions, with the purchase of the Player's Guide just before Christmas, followed up with the Loremasters Guide in February. I want to get the Wilderland Adventures book, Eriador, as well as Rhovanion, and I'm really hoping Cubicle 7 will do a book for Rohan & Gondor as well. Looking on the web site now I see they have the Bree-land Region Guide, as well as Adventures in Eriador on sale, so I'll likely have lots of nice new Middle Earth RPG bling under the Christmas Tree this year!
Really have been looking for something that captures the inspirng adventures of Middle Earth ever since ICE folded back in 1998, and I was unable to buy the IP for Rolemaster in bankruptcy court. I was on the American team that bid on ICE's IP after they folded. They had already lost the support of the Tolkien Estate by that time though, however there was still a warehouse with a healthy stockpile of MERP RPG books, adventures, and supplements.
Adventures in Middle Earth fills this void nicely, and is a very solid game, this presents many opportunities for roleplaying that can be enhanced by roll-playing. In game terms "magic" is not a field of study, but a collection of strange supernatural gifts and permissions. Dwarves, for example, can create perfectly hidden doors, and no human or elf could ever learn that art. The elves can speak to the stones, the waters, the trees, and the animals, and this is not a talent that can be taught. Middle earth has Fairy-tale like enchantments, Palantirs or crystal balls, talking animals, enchanted clothes that fasten themselves, magical toys and magic enhanced fireworks. There are rivers that cause forgetfulness, and waters that allow characters who are attuned, to scry. Items have inherent magic powers, There is an unseen spirit world that cannot be perceived by most people, but is inextricably, immediately, and permanently linked to Middle Earth. There is necromancy, and names and songs themselves have magic powers.
Using Magic in Middle Earth at the end of the Third Age will draw the attention of the Lidless Eye of Sauron, for he covets all magic and power for himself, and would not willingly share it, just as the Ringbearers are drawn to possess the one ring, for it is simply the most beautiful as well as terrible thing to behold.
D&D has none of this, so using the rules of D&D in order to run games that include this, seems unfit, or would otherwise defile the setting of Middle Earth, and break the immersion.
Finally on a scale of 1-5, I rate the Adventures in Middle Earth RPG a 4.75 in terms of playability, presenting good opportunities for roleplaying, and in keeping the setting faithful to J.R.R. Tolkien's original Middle Earth. Unlike D&D with it's Vancian magic system.
Quote from: Razor 007;1105408When I first encountered AiME, I thought; holy shit balls!!! I love the LotR trilogy, this has to be awesome!!! But then I realized, I don't like railroad adventures; and the LotR would be a huge railroad.
You honestly think the game follows the plot of the books?
Quote from: rgrove0172;1105796You honestly think the game follows the plot of the books?
I'd think a well run Mirkwood Campaign would be absolutely mind-blowing. I love the idea of it taking (in-game) 30 years start to finish.
Forgotten Realms seems a bit goofy and superficial for me
As far as I'm concerned, AiME is the best way to play D&D 5E. The classes fit the literature, and the setting background is great if you like Middle Earth.
Nice thread here to read.
Lots of useful information.
I will SO buy into a Moria boxed set!
So, the bad news is C7 is discontinuing AiME and TOR due to licensing issues. We won't get the Moria box set after all. {Sad Face}
Quote from: Robyo;1115246So, the bad news is C7 is discontinuing AiME and TOR due to licensing issues. We won't get the Moria box set after all. {Sad Face}
I'm absolutely gutted with this news!
https://www.cubicle7games.com/unexpected-tor2-update/
Luckily I have all of the physical books.
I've got Erebor adventures and the Rohan Region guide PDFs from Drivethrurpg and downloaded them now (just in case they get removed).
Maybe they'll work something out, who knows...
Quote from: danskmacabre;1115251I'm absolutely gutted with this news!
https://www.cubicle7games.com/unexpected-tor2-update/
Luckily I have all of the physical books.
I've got Erebor adventures and the Rohan Region guide PDFs from Drivethrurpg and downloaded them now (just in case they get removed).
Maybe they'll work something out, who knows...
Which of the books would you reccomend getting a physical copy for?
Quote from: Aglondir;1115258Which of the books would you recommend getting a physical copy for?
Loremaster book (GM book)
Player guide (Has classes, races, etc.)
All the region guides (they're really good reading and handy to have on hand easily)
You don't really a physical copy of the various adventure books various adventure books IMO. A PDF copy would be fine.
I really like the Wilderlands adventure book and Mirkwood campaign, so if you have the budget for those too, then they're worth buying.
The GMs screen is not required either and it's not that great anyway. The intro adventure that comes with it is decent enough, but nothing groundbreaking.
Alternatively, If you're on a budget, but have a tablet or laptop to run a game from and you're ok with that, then just get the Loremaster book and Player guide and get a PDF of everything else.
Such a bummer there'll be no Moria Boxed set. I was REALLY looking forward to that! :(
Quote from: danskmacabre;1108001Nice thread here to read.
Lots of useful information.
I'm not sure if I'd play AiME, specifically, but based on the information presented here, particularly by estar, the Journey and Audience stuff seem like an interesting addition to spice things up in any medieval/ancient world or D&Dish game to generate ideas for traveling and encountering important NPCs.