A published study that polled gamers and non-gamers of different ethnicities revealed what I already suspected about the level of public support for RPG Wokist claims.
#dnd #ttrpg #osr

My thoughts/feedback:

Chomsky has a similar quote about framing what questions are radical and what are okay.  I don't read his work, but Russel Brand pointed it out to me the other day...

Don't assume that conservatives don't send their kids to college.  There's really no choice these days.  It's high school 2.0...

The "Call me Chato" channel on YouTube presents a theory that fresh woke liberal arts graduates are cheaper to hire, and so have an outsized influence on content being produced.  He applies it to movies and such, but it likely applies to the whole as well.   He calls it navel gazing, saying they make content mostly for themselves, and then are shocked when it doesn't land.  It's good content, you might check it out.

I fully agree that wokism is the new Satanic Panic.

Quote from: mcbobbo on April 02, 2022, 12:55:16 PM
I fully agree that wokism is the new Satanic Panic.

It is not in the normal sense. The current "social justice" cult is just one in a series of these about every 20 years. Always the same patterns. And Im old enough that this now is my 3rd and the 4th is a mere 8 years off.

The Satanic Panic was just one head of the hydra this thing always becomes. Moral Ourage, Moral Guardians, Censorship, and the riling up of minorities under the guise of "equality". This wave is just the most damaging so far.

What was the first?

I did see some vestiges of the satanic panic in the late 90s in Canada, but it wasn't really serious. So this is the first one that really caught my attention.

Satanic Panic was first to touch RPGs, but overall some populist outrages are common every few years in democracies, and there are always hyenas willing to exploit or even simply cause one.

Quote from: migo on April 03, 2022, 06:28:19 AM
What was the first?

McCarthy?

Arguably you could go back to Socrates.

"He was the teacher of Plato, who was in turn the teacher of Aristotle, and like Ozzy Osbourne, was repeatedly accused of corruption of the young." -- Ted Theodore Logan

Quote from: mcbobbo on April 02, 2022, 12:55:16 PMI fully agree that wokism is the new Satanic Panic.

I don't see them as at all similar. The Satanic Panic was a group of people outside the RPG world that were trying to convince people to not play D&D. They only managed to make D&D seem more cool and make the game more popular.

The Wokists or SJWs or whatever you want to call them, are a group that is inside the RPG industry and their goal is to make sure that certain people are not allowed to play RPGs. Even all the nonsense about orcs being racist is just a tool used to exclude certain people from the RPG community. And they have been overwhelmingly successful. Even the guy that made this video agrees with their central premise that people should be kicked out of the RPG hobby because of their personal beliefs. He only disagrees with where to draw the line.

Quote from: hedgehobbit on April 03, 2022, 11:32:56 AM

Quote from: mcbobbo on April 02, 2022, 12:55:16 PMI fully agree that wokism is the new Satanic Panic.

I don't see them as at all similar. The Satanic Panic was a group of people outside the RPG world that were trying to convince people to not play D&D. They only managed to make D&D seem more cool and make the game more popular.

The Wokists or SJWs or whatever you want to call them, are a group that is inside the RPG industry and their goal is to make sure that certain people are not allowed to play RPGs. Even all the nonsense about orcs being racist is just a tool used to exclude certain people from the RPG community. And they have been overwhelmingly successful. Even the guy that made this video agrees with their central premise that people should be kicked out of the RPG hobby because of their personal beliefs. He only disagrees with where to draw the line.

That's not exactly true. The Satanic Panic did have a negative impact on D&D (IIRC), forcing TSR to change the terms Demons and Fiends for other stuff, and also affected society as a whole beyond RPGs. Wokists involved in this stuff are also not exclusively industry insiders, but largely operate outside of it, threatening companies and demanding everyone else conforms to their views. And those inside the industry largely infiltrated it or fell for the brainwashing.

The only real difference is that wokists managed to be more thorough than the church ladies. But they're still religious fanatics trying to dictate what everyone else should think, say or be allowed to consume.

Orcs were not created by racists, were not intended to be racist, and don't correlate with racist attitudes. Also, dwarves are not Nazi propaganda aimed at Irish Jews. Good to know.

Quote from: hedgehobbit on April 03, 2022, 11:32:56 AM

Quote from: mcbobbo on April 02, 2022, 12:55:16 PMI fully agree that wokism is the new Satanic Panic.

I don't see them as at all similar. The Satanic Panic was a group of people outside the RPG world that were trying to convince people to not play D&D. They only managed to make D&D seem more cool and make the game more popular.

The Wokists or SJWs or whatever you want to call them, are a group that is inside the RPG industry and their goal is to make sure that certain people are not allowed to play RPGs. Even all the nonsense about orcs being racist is just a tool used to exclude certain people from the RPG community. And they have been overwhelmingly successful. Even the guy that made this video agrees with their central premise that people should be kicked out of the RPG hobby because of their personal beliefs. He only disagrees with where to draw the line.

The Wokists are really just showing up full force in rpgs but the Woke Left has existed in this Woke form since the early 2000's, and it is just an extension of neo-Marxism. The Woke Left was able to get its foothold into society by subversion if higher education in universities, and from there it expanded. But social media is what has given the Woke Left true staying power.

Quote from: hedgehobbit on April 03, 2022, 11:32:56 AM

Quote from: mcbobbo on April 02, 2022, 12:55:16 PMI fully agree that wokism is the new Satanic Panic.

I don't see them as at all similar. The Satanic Panic was a group of people outside the RPG world that were trying to convince people to not play D&D. They only managed to make D&D seem more cool and make the game more popular.

The Wokists or SJWs or whatever you want to call them, are a group that is inside the RPG industry and their goal is to make sure that certain people are not allowed to play RPGs. Even all the nonsense about orcs being racist is just a tool used to exclude certain people from the RPG community. And they have been overwhelmingly successful. Even the guy that made this video agrees with their central premise that people should be kicked out of the RPG hobby because of their personal beliefs. He only disagrees with where to draw the line.

You're incorrect. The Wokist Entryist goals for RPGs is not "so certain people can't play", it is "so tabletop RPGs as we know them will cease to exist".

Quote from: VisionStorm on April 03, 2022, 12:04:03 PM

Quote from: hedgehobbit on April 03, 2022, 11:32:56 AM

Quote from: mcbobbo on April 02, 2022, 12:55:16 PMI fully agree that wokism is the new Satanic Panic.

I don't see them as at all similar. The Satanic Panic was a group of people outside the RPG world that were trying to convince people to not play D&D. They only managed to make D&D seem more cool and make the game more popular.

The Wokists or SJWs or whatever you want to call them, are a group that is inside the RPG industry and their goal is to make sure that certain people are not allowed to play RPGs. Even all the nonsense about orcs being racist is just a tool used to exclude certain people from the RPG community. And they have been overwhelmingly successful. Even the guy that made this video agrees with their central premise that people should be kicked out of the RPG hobby because of their personal beliefs. He only disagrees with where to draw the line.

That's not exactly true. The Satanic Panic did have a negative impact on D&D (IIRC), forcing TSR to change the terms Demons and Fiends for other stuff, and also affected society as a whole beyond RPGs. Wokists involved in this stuff are also not exclusively industry insiders, but largely operate outside of it, threatening companies and demanding everyone else conforms to their views. And those inside the industry largely infiltrated it or fell for the brainwashing.

The only real difference is that wokists managed to be more thorough than the church ladies. But they're still religious fanatics trying to dictate what everyone else should think, say or be allowed to consume.

I'm not sure about this being the case. If I think of some of the top SJWs in RPGs they've been involved for a long time.

Cam Banks started out writing for Dragonlance decades ago and worked for MWP before the SJW infiltration of the hobby was obvious.
Fred Hicks was developing FATE as an off-shoot of FUDGE also long before it was obvious.
Cat Tobin was writing for The Circular back in 2005, so I'd assume Wikipedia saying she was working for UK gaming conventions in the '90s is true.

Now maybe they are just a minority and the majority came from the outside, but I'm pretty sure they were all invited in by the likes of Banks, Hicks and Tobin, rather than forcing their way in from the outside.

The Satanic Panic was always about embarrassing Christians for predicting that promoting moral degeneracy in media would lead to negative outcomes in society. Turns out they were 100% correct in their concerns.

The fact that the phrase "Satanic Panic" is even used is a demonstration that this was a media-led campaign to discredit middle-America & Christians simply by framing their concerns as ridiculous.

In that sense, Wokism is a continuation of the "Satanic Panic" because the same bad actors that brought us the Satanic Panic by demonizing legitimate concerns are now bringing us more of the same type of subversive propaganda in media.

Quote from: mightybrain on April 03, 2022, 07:06:27 AM

Quote from: migo on April 03, 2022, 06:28:19 AM
What was the first?

McCarthy?

Ehh, McCarthy wasn't entirely wrong. There were a ton of actual communists in Hollywood and hidden in American business, academia, and politics.