I feel I overlooked the other reading of "abstracted wealth." I was thinking of debts, credits, favors, boons, and the like. This conversation seems more about RPG hand-wavium.

Given some systems use things like Resource (WW), Credit (CoC), or Profession (various rpgs) levels, I am OK with abstracted wealth as RPG hand-wavium. D&D 5e using Lifestyle levels is a similar handy convenience. If you're middle or upper-middle bracket income, I'm going to assume you can afford a new shovel and some lanterns.

I just don't want it to replace buying and selling of any adventurous significance. (Granted, I make my shopping excursions adventurous, so that spectrum is very broad indeed.)

Depends on the setting and genre. Some games work well with abstracted wealth, some bean counting seems to be part of the experience (Dungeon Fantasy and RPG Cyberpunk come immediately to mind). In general I lean more towards abstracting wealth though. Its the one kind of abstracted rule that don't usually bother me.

I like non-abstracted wealth for individual characters, and abstracted wealth for Company/Organization level statblocks (see Reign). Still trying to figure out the best way to make those play together....

Quote from: Bren;824502I'd rather have more detail and actually track coins, items of value, etc. in a game where accumulating wealth is an object of play or I'd rather have less detail and totally hand wave wealth without the need to track levels.

I don't run games where wealth is an object.

Quote from: flyingmice;824572I don't run games where wealth is an object.

Which makes your preference not to track actual coins or other details reasonable. In that sort of game I just go one step farther and don't bother with using or tracking wealth levels at all.

Abstracted wealth is good for genres like superheroes or Cthulu where acquisition of wealth is not a goal.
D&d is best with concrete wealth. My sword &"sorcery 5e game uses the Arneson rule where you get xp for gp *spent* - this avoids the risk of miserly pcs, which is a big problem in gp-for-magic items games.

Depends on the players and system, really. I'll go with what's there. On the whole, though, I prefer a concrete system, rather than an abstraction. I also think that, if I'm gonna play a game about loot, the loot should be, well, loot, rather than a modifier to an abstracted number. For other stuff, like the super hero games I run, well, who gives a damn about that. Wealth is a complete abstraction.

I just ran across this while reading FATE Core this week, and I must say it's intriguing. I'm running a Savage Worlds game in which wealth isn't really a major issue, and I wonder how hard it would be to adapt such a system to SW.

Quote from: tuypo1;824353as a spinoff to the non coin economy thread what are your thoughts on abstracted wealth rather then measuring your money and buying things for a set price

If the acquisition of treasure is not an immediate goal of the game or setting, I generally prefer an abstract wealth system.

If trade is a major component of play, I can go either way. (Although any abstract system needs to be tied into the trade mechanics enough for the trade to remain meaningful.)

As an abstraction, I really like abstract wealth systems, since it avoids having to track every copper piece/penny/decicredit/whatever.

Unfortunately, I've never manged to find a concrete example of an abstract wealth system which works for my group and doesn't break down the first time they want to do something out of the ordinary with it.  They frequently also end up being more complex to administer than just tracking every copper piece/penny/decicredit/whatever would have been.

In general I prefer abstract systems of wealth or even equipment.  'Preparedness' or 'Resources' as a stat is fine to me.  It allows you to have a character who resolves issues through the application of money or tools / gadgets without getting pulled down into minutia and extensive record keeping.  Same for ammunition.

This doesn't really work for games where the acquisition of wealth is the major focus of the game, however, but since my group don't tend to play campaigns around this it isn't an issue for us.

Gaming time is precious so we like to use it for the stuff we find fun, and tracking coins or arrows doesn't fit within that criteria. YMMV.

Quote from: nDervish;824841As an abstraction, I really like abstract wealth systems, since it avoids having to track every copper piece/penny/decicredit/whatever.

Unfortunately, I've never manged to find a concrete example of an abstract wealth system which works for my group and doesn't break down the first time they want to do something out of the ordinary with it.  They frequently also end up being more complex to administer than just tracking every copper piece/penny/decicredit/whatever would have been.

That's pretty much me as well. I spent more time trying to figure out how to use the abstract wealth system in Honor+Intrigue than I would have spent tracking wealth. So I junked the abstract wealth rules and grabbed pricing from other sources - initially I used Black Vulmea's mods of Flashing Blades for pricing.

If you have an income, then abstract wealth works - roll against Wealth with penalties for expensive items, if you succeed you can buy it, if you critical then it doesn't decrease your Wealth, if you fumble then it you cannot buy it as you have run out of money for the month.

If you don't have an income, then Wealth will go down until you find a way to increase it. That's a bit of a pain to work out.

Increasing wealth is a similar pain.

   GM: You find a chest full of Spanish Doubloons and Pearls.

Players: Yeah! So now we are Rich!?

GM: Yes. Well maybe. Ummm...let me check the wealth table...OK now cross referencing that with your current wealth levels...OK Norbert you go up 2 wealth levels now you are Well Off. Gaston you go up 1 wealth level you are also Well Off. Foul Corsair, 2 levels...

Corsair: But that would mean I am only Poor. Remember I was a galley slave last week.

GM: Right...OK...umm...you go up 3 Wealth Levels to Common.

Guy: What about me?

GM: Let's see...oh...your wealth level doesn't change.

Guy: What? We find a chest full of gold coins and pearls and I'm not any richer. That sucks.

GM: Well you were already Rich...

Quote from: soltakss;825166If you have an income, then abstract wealth works - roll against Wealth with penalties for expensive items, if you succeed you can buy it, if you critical then it doesn't decrease your Wealth, if you fumble then it you cannot buy it as you have run out of money for the month.

If you don't have an income, then Wealth will go down until you find a way to increase it. That's a bit of a pain to work out.

It can depend on the system. Marvel FASERIP's Resource ranks worked pretty well, for example. A character with no income would have Feeble Rank and have to make fairly difficult rolls for even meager purchases and couldn't make them at all for some. It would represent money the found, borrowed or somehow earned "off camera". If they tried to make too large purchase their resources would drop and could even be exhausted for a time even if the roll was successful.  

Of course there could be circumstances where this might not make sense but that's ging to come up with almost any abstraction. And like others have noted is more suited for a game and premise where finances are a secondary or less concern.