As the title tells. I have every intention to play 5e sticking mostly to core only.

However, some things I want are simply missing. Future releases might find themself augmenting the canon of rules. More likely, I'll scour the internets for stuff others made. And most likely, I'll just write up that stuff myself.

This threat is for that last group. If I want it, others might have some use for it as well. Also, it's always good to have a few extra eyes and brains available when designing rules.

So I invite you, esteemed and distinguished fellow posters, to criticize and use everything I post here.



This first contribution is an iconic magic ability missing from the PHB, we can interrogate the remaining spirit of the dead via speak with dead, but we can not hold a seance to contact the departed souls.

The seance spell fixes this, but as far as information gathering gets, it is of little use, petitioners of the great wheel cosmology being how they are.

I see three main uses: exchanging last words with loved ones, mocking a hated enemy after death and finding out whether someone wants to be raised (though you might reach a mischievous fiend intend on deceiving you).

My biggest concern is wording, as the spell requires a somewhat convoluted  setup and a lot of DM fiat to work.


Without further ado, I present the Seance spell, available to warlocks and clerics:





Seance
2nd-level divination (ritual)

Casting Time: 1 minute
Range: Self
Components: V, S, M (special candles worth at least 20gp that are consumed in the casting)
Duration: Concentration, up to 10 minutes

The spellcaster allows the petitioners of one outer plane to talk through them. For the duration the Spellcaster is incapacitated and unable to speak.

A personal item of a "guide" can be used to reach the plane that guide dwells on. This item is not consumed in the casting. If no guide is called on or the guide is not on an outer plane, a random outer planes is contacted.

During the duration up to ten individual messages can be addressed to the petitioners of the outer plane through the spellcaster. If the dead soul in question doesn't dwell on this particular plane, and otherwise at a five percent chance, some random petitioner, fiend or celestial receives the message.

Whether the requested spirit or not, the soul that receives the message will attempt to answer, using the mouth, but not voice, of the spellcaster.

Dealing with Petitioners is a frustrating experience, as the dead souls remember nothing to very little of its life, tends to ramble and loose track and often isn't even aware of its status as deceased.

However, petitioners often recognize loved or hated ones and can tell whether they enjoy their shadow existence in the lands of the dead.

Technically you have also Commune, which could fulfill a similar purpose with some retrapping (especially in cultures with strong ancestor worship).

What this spell lacks are the spell lists it appears on.

Quote from: Gold Roger;787843Dealing with Petitioners is a frustrating experience, as the dead souls remember nothing to very little of its life, tends to ramble and loose track and often isn't even aware of its status as deceased.

You could make that dependent on an Int save done by the caster for each message. By using the save of the caster and not of the deceased one, the spell effect would also elegantly scale with the ability and proficiency of the caster.
Using higher slots could either improve this save, or allow for more questions.

Quote from: Skyrock;787857Technically you have also Commune, which could fulfill a similar purpose with some retrapping (especially in cultures with strong ancestor worship).

Contacting with my dear departed grandma and a opening a channel to the gods themself is quite different. I can use Commune to do what I want Seance for, yes. But Seance means I can have  spellcasters of level 3 instead of 9 for all this usual "Tell momma I love her one last time" stuff.

Quote from: Skyrock;787857What this spell lacks are the spell lists it appears on.

To quote myself:

Quote from: Gold Roger;787843Without further ado, I present the Seance spell, available to warlocks and clerics:

I could see it for paladins and wizards, depending on the setting. Bard, sorcerer, druid and ranger, not so much.

Quote from: Skyrock;787857You could make that dependent on an Int save done by the caster for each message. By using the save of the caster and not of the deceased one, the spell effect would also elegantly scale with the ability and proficiency of the caster.
Using higher slots could either improve this save, or allow for more questions.

This is only applicable for wizards, whom I myself wouldn't give this spell. Considering the Seance is a bit like possession, charisma is usually used for saves with possession and both cleric and warlock are proficient with charisma saves, your idea could be used though.

I feel perfectly comfortable leaving this to DM fiat though. It is a weak spell, that offers an entertaining roleplaying opportunity, sometimes small info and is propably in high demand with the common people.

This is why I decided against letting it scale as well.

There is little way in which it can improve and the confusion of petitioners, is, going by my main sources of planescape and the third edition Manual of the Planes, an inherent quality of being a deceased soul.

Ah, I must have overread that half-sentence about clerics and warlocks.

I could see the spell also being part of the druid list in certain cultures where where both spirits of nature and spirits of the dead receive worship (like Japanese shinto, or Polynesian huna), but that could be left to setting-specific adjustments, or circle spells of certain land circles.
And this being a ritual, there is also always the Ritual Caster feat for those who can't do without...

Quote from: Skyrock;787873Ah, I must have overread that half-sentence about clerics and warlocks.

I could see the spell also being part of the druid list in certain cultures where where both spirits of nature and spirits of the dead receive worship (like Japanese shinto, or Polynesian huna), but that could be left to setting-specific adjustments, or circle spells of certain land circles.
And this being a ritual, there is also always the Ritual Caster feat for those who can't do without...

No sweat on the classes, it was a bit hidden.

I actually think, especially with casting time of 1 minute, this spell is so likely to be cast as a ritual, that I wonder if I should put in some incentive to prepare it at all. But then again, I just don't see it as a 1 action spell.

Flavorful and absolutely fraught with danger without a guide.

Perhaps allow "remnant of the petitioner's life" as a limiter on the planar deviation? So, if without a spirit guide's relic (I assume, you haven't explained this well), you can use grandma's old knitting needles to limit how random which plane is selected. Instead of all the outer planes, only 2 planes away or less from the target petitioner's plane.

Also I think a quick ratio for petitioners, fiends, celestials would make things easier: i.e. DC 20+ exact one petitioned, 15+ someone associated to the petitioned, 10+ random minor plane denizen, 5+ random strong plane denizen, less than 5 equivalent celestial or fiend denizen.

Then you can tabulate modifiers (or Adv/Disadv) for context, like group alignment composition, etc.

edit: If it was me I'd have the deviation of caster alignment v. target petitioned alignment (Outer Plane) be a penalizing modifier. e.g. LG caster seeks to seance specific CE soul, that's 4 steps away and thus -4 (or disadvantage, or -2 per step, or something). Then I would make every Helping participant (up to 4) who shares at least one part of the target's alignment to reduce that penalty by -1.

I would also do something about possession. Adding more Helpers (up to that 4) can help add +1 each to Possession saves of all seance members, but only if they remain holding hands. Personally I already make Possession saves choose any of the 6 attributes. So the end result is there is strength in numbers, but it is only a matter of time for the Hostile Denizen to find the weak stat among the party, thus the danger of adding more people AND maintaining lengthy contact.

Overly involved, I know, but it shares enough benefits and penalties as to make such a spell an event unto itself.

Quote from: Opaopajr;788042Flavorful and absolutely fraught with danger without a guide.

Perhaps allow "remnant of the petitioner's life" as a limiter on the planar deviation? So, if without a spirit guide's relic (I assume, you haven't explained this well), you can use grandma's old knitting needles to limit how random which plane is selected. Instead of all the outer planes, only 2 planes away or less from the target petitioner's plane.

Also I think a quick ratio for petitioners, fiends, celestials would make things easier: i.e. DC 20+ exact one petitioned, 15+ someone associated to the petitioned, 10+ random minor plane denizen, 5+ random strong plane denizen, less than 5 equivalent celestial or fiend denizen.

Then you can tabulate modifiers (or Adv/Disadv) for context, like group alignment composition, etc.

edit: If it was me I'd have the deviation of caster alignment v. target petitioned alignment (Outer Plane) be a penalizing modifier. e.g. LG caster seeks to seance specific CE soul, that's 4 steps away and thus -4 (or disadvantage, or -2 per step, or something). Then I would make every Helping participant (up to 4) who shares at least one part of the target's alignment to reduce that penalty by -1.

I would also do something about possession. Adding more Helpers (up to that 4) can help add +1 each to Possession saves of all seance members, but only if they remain holding hands. Personally I already make Possession saves choose any of the 6 attributes. So the end result is there is strength in numbers, but it is only a matter of time for the Hostile Denizen to find the weak stat among the party, thus the danger of adding more people AND maintaining lengthy contact.

Overly involved, I know, but it shares enough benefits and penalties as to make such a spell an event unto itself.

Yes, wording the guide so it is clearly understood is one of my worries with the spell.

In general, you've got it right. By using the token (the usual, body parts, hairs, fingernail clippings, a prized possession, like grandmas knitting needle) the spell automatically reaches the plane that soul dwells upon.

I should add to the spell that messages addressed to the guide always arrive.


I agree that there should be some guidance on getting a confused soul as opposed to a planar denizen, a charisma save against possession might come in handy here.


I'm quite opposed to having alignment play a part. As you noted, it makes the spell even more convoluted and I am already worried that it is to complicated for such a weak effect. In addition, there is no precedent. Even Planar Ally doesn't figure in the casters alignment.


Thank you for the feedback, time to rework the spell.

Good stuff!