Point buy you've explained, but why not stat array?

Dont know about Pundit. But for me array has the same inherint problem as point buy, only worse. Too easy to end up with cookie cutter characters. With array that is magnified as theres not even the variance of different point buy approaches.

The problem with pointbuy is minmaxing.

Stat array stops that at least.

Every method can have that.

5es point buy I actually like as the more you max the less overall you have in the end.

Point buy and array are taking a design/authorial perspective towards character creation. Rolling attributes is "this is what you are born with, see what you can do".

My preferred method is to just let the players pick whatever the hell they want.  They can roll, they can point buy to whatever total they want, they can use an array, they can draw cards, read entrails, and even just write down the exact scores they want (the usual choice).

Lots of people here say don't play with jerks.  So I trust my players not to be jerks.  Since doing this I have never had a player pick all max scores using this method or anything like it.  In fact, people tend to make surprisingly interesting characters, with strengths and weaknesses based on a reasonable concept.  At worst I have had a couple make me give them a point total and let them point buy to that total.

I am ok with point buy. But I warn the players that if it looks like they are min/maxing rather than creating a character then they may well end up rolling 3d6 in order instead. And I wont be as merciful as OD&D and let you shuffle points.

Though with 5es system Im more lenient.

Quote from: Brander;883182My preferred method is to just let the players pick whatever the hell they want.  They can roll, they can point buy to whatever total they want, they can use an array, they can draw cards, read entrails, and even just write down the exact scores they want (the usual choice).

On the way to the store to purchase some tripe right now. Cannot WAIT for chargen! :-)

Here are 6 cups. Here is a pitcher of water. You can pour however much you want into each cup. But any spilt is lost.

Quote from: cranebump;883255On the way to the store to purchase some tripe right now. Cannot WAIT for chargen! :-)

Sounds like you would fit in well with some of my group :-)

Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;882962Point buy you've explained, but why not stat array?

Controlled, predictable character creation tends to create controlled, predictable characters.

Quote from: RPGPundit;883511Controlled, predictable character creation tends to create controlled, predictable characters.

What do you do if someone rolls all high or all low? Just let them deal with it?

Quote from: RPGPundit;883511Controlled, predictable character creation tends to create controlled, predictable characters.

And that's what makes it superiour to me.  Because that way everyone can focus on their class' strengths.  Rather than look at the fact that one character has all 7s in his highest stats, some other player has four 18s.  The rest of them can't break 12.  So you end up with a player who's Doc Savage, and the rest of them are his sidekicks, with Mr/Mrs. No. 7 being the pet monkey.

If your crew can handle that, I salute them.  But for me?  I want my team to be somewhat equally competent for their field of chose (Like a Fighter will focus on Strength and Constitution, the Wizard on Intelligence and pick one.  So on and so forth.)

Quote from: RPGPundit;883511Controlled, predictable character creation tends to create controlled, predictable characters.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;883553And that's what makes it superiour to me.  Because that way everyone can focus on their class' strengths.  Rather than look at the fact that one character has all 7s in his highest stats, some other player has four 18s.  The rest of them can't break 12.  So you end up with a player who's Doc Savage, and the rest of them are his sidekicks, with Mr/Mrs. No. 7 being the pet monkey.

My solution (back on page 2 of this thread) was random (to address concerns like RPGPundit's) but balanced (to address concerns like Christopher Brady's).

(You roll 3d6 for your first three stats as per usual, but write down the nine numbers you rolled in a grid, then write down 7 minus these numbers and then add up to generate the three remaining stats which all add up to 63. It's a bit mathsy but you retain the same chance of rolling a 3 or an 18).

I'm surprised not to see more solutions like this, for example a list of 100 stat arrays, roll d% to see what you get.

Personally if the stats are 3-18 then I like to generate the stats using my first method because that keeps you rolling 3d6 and so it feels like D&D. If only the bonuses matter, I ditch the 3-18 and use the second method.

Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;883552What do you do if someone rolls all high or all low? Just let them deal with it?

In everything except O and BX D&D the chance of getting alot of really high or really low numbers are low. Jan is the first I have ever seen of someone rolling more than one 3 for a stat. And even in the other two you can opt to shuffle. And in at least 5e you get points to add on at key levels so theres a mitigating factor there too.

As repeatedly noted. A player getting really low rolls can ask to re-roll. Most DMs are ok with it. Some even demand it. But some players are perfectly fine with giving such a character a whirl.

Good stats are not a must have.