Stipulated!

Yeah you have to pick and choose. But that's exactly what I want - options. Of course it only gets better - this is only 1st level. The sad truth of Pathfinder and D&D3e is that it only gets comparatively worse.

Feat taxes kill the non-caster classes. They're lackluster, don't really give you mechanical combat options - quite the opposite, you're forced into one style of play with relatively weak results. But we'll see this together.

Definitely liking the Fantasy Craft version of the Spartan more than D&D or PF. D&D shields just suck spectacularly and they treat the spear like trash, when in reality the spear is one of the most effective melee weapons there is, which is one of the they were used so broadly historically. FC also seems to give you a lot of extra feats through your Specialty, which helps bridge the gap for this concept by awarding you all the basic abilities you need to fulfill that role, kinda like a AD&D 2e kit on steroids.

Some this stuff still goes over my head a bit, though, cuz FC includes a lot of unique elements I don't know how they work in this game, such as Reach, or the Armor Piercing and Keen qualities mentioned in the Shield Mastery feat description.

I'm also not sure how using a spear one handed would improve reach, since you would need to hold it around the middle to wield it effectively, but using it two-handed gives you greater control of length IRL. You can even use the whole length of the weapon when making thrusting maneuvers two-handed if you skewer the shaft and push it forward with your back hand while holding the pole near the end.

I'm also not sure how holding it two-handed gives you Bleed but one-handed doesn't, it would seem to me a spear would make you bleed regardless (but then again I don't know how Bleed works in this game). Some of these benefits seem arbitrary.

Quote from: VisionStorm;1143612Definitely liking the Fantasy Craft version of the Spartan more than D&D or PF. D&D shields just suck spectacularly and they treat the spear like trash, when in reality the spear is one of the most effective melee weapons there is, which is one of the they were used so broadly historically. FC also seems to give you a lot of extra feats through your Specialty, which helps bridge the gap for this concept by awarding you all the basic abilities you need to fulfill that role, kinda like a AD&D 2e kit on steroids.

Yep. But honestly - in FC you can make nearly any weapon deadly in your hands. That's one of the best parts of the system.

Quote from: VisionStorm;1143612Some this stuff still goes over my head a bit, though, cuz FC includes a lot of unique elements I don't know how they work in this game, such as Reach, or the Armor Piercing and Keen qualities mentioned in the Shield Mastery feat description.

It's not dissimilar than 3.x/PF. Reach is merely the 1"/5-ft demarcation of how far you can use melee-actions in combat. There are no Attacks of Opportunity like in 3.x/PF for entering or leaving an opponents Reach as part of the core rules of combat. However there are abilities - Tricks and Stances that will give you special abilities when opponents are within Reach. For example - having Polearm Basics let's you make free attacks on any opponent that moves into an area adjacent to you - which is redefined by Reach as per normal combat rules, as adjacent is anything you can reach.

Keen basically extends your weapon's damage on a Critical strike. So if, for example, you have a Shortsword that does 1d8 with Keen 4 - and a threat-range of 19-20, and you roll a 19, and hit. You blow an Action Die to confirm the Critical strike. You weapon is now doing 1d8+4 (and any other bonuses for Strength, Feat, etc.) against your opponents Wounds (which is usually their Con. score). This is extremely lethal, but welcome to Fantasy Craft crits.

Quote from: VisionStorm;1143612I'm also not sure how using a spear one handed would improve reach, since you would need to hold it around the middle to wield it effectively, but using it two-handed gives you greater control of length IRL. You can even use the whole length of the weapon when making thrusting maneuvers two-handed if you skewer the shaft and push it forward with your back hand while holding the pole near the end.

I'm also not sure how holding it two-handed gives you Bleed but one-handed doesn't, it would seem to me a spear would make you bleed regardless (but then again I don't know how Bleed works in this game). Some of these benefits seem arbitrary.

Well it's a combination of things - anyone can use a Boar Spear, it has Reach +1. But the assumption is by training with that weapon, and gaining Spear Basics - you're learning how to effectively thrust with it as needed. Much like a fencer learns to leverage fantastic range beyond the normal reach of his weapon with a lunge. The system isn't trying to be "realistic" as much as it's trying to give mechanical weight and be cinematic. However you want to abstract it is up to you, of course. Fighting with spear and shield is a time-honored and ridiculously optimal load-out on the battlefield that has stood the test of time up until the advent of gunpowder. RPG's have generally shit all over that style of fighting and never gotten it right.

You can still fight with your spear Feats and use a Pike or longer weapon and do the things you're mentioning. I merely pointed out I used the Boar Spear as a satisfying middle-ground to represent the Spartan spear - the Dory. The stats are about what I'd park them on, and so I rolled with it. But you could go Pike and then have insane Reach and other options - without really changing your character's build at all. You're merely using another weapon in your wheelhouse that you designed your character to fight with.

Think about it - my core concept is a Spartan. I wanted a Shield and Spear fighter. But the system is actually allowing me to use Spears, Polearms, Staves - simultaneously and intermixed not only in the weapon used, but in HOW I use them. By allowing me to use their Stances and Tricks interchangeably, it's leveraging my concept and giving me more options on a round-by-round basis without penalizing me at all. In fact it's quite the opposite - I'm encouraged to use different varieties of weapons as I see fit. This is true of Sword, Axe, and Blunt weapons too. And even better - this is not limited by class. This is limited by player choice as an expression of how their character operates.

It's very elegant and might sound "fiddly" - in play, it's exactly what you want and choose in your PC and it's no different than 3.x/PF except it works.

Edit: in 3.x once you've chosen your "weapon" you're usually stuck doing that one thing with very little variety in how you use it. And god forbid you invest feats into it - and get a better weapon of a different type... ugh. Bland and mechanically weak

QuoteFantasy Craft gives you 36-points to build your character. All stats start at 10.

Hmm, 2nd edition pg. 8 has you starting with 8 attribute points.

-Don't want to derail-

I've bought Fantasy Craft just off the strength of this thread; I've found PCGen has FantasyCraft - and their NPC converter thing any other tools?

(I'm following along this thread, and want to build a few.)

Quote from: VisionStorm;1143612I'm also not sure how holding it two-handed gives you Bleed but one-handed doesn't, it would seem to me a spear would make you bleed regardless (but then again I don't know how Bleed works in this game). Some of these benefits seem arbitrary.

Ok, gonna admit that finding this was annoying. Went to the crafting section first because I remembered that a list of effects you can add to a weapon is there, but the description of Bleed didn't actually have any info. Also no page reference. Realized these were weapon Qualities, so used that to find another similar list a few pages earlier in the book that explained how Bleed works - if you damage the opponent, they have to make a fortitude save or start "bleeding." Again no page reference! And it didn't say what bleeding actually did. Figured that I'd call something like that a "condition," so finally had the right word to figure out what bleeding actually does. Page 212. So, bleeding causes you to take 1 subdual damage per round if you take no actions, or 1d4 lethal damage if you do take any actions. Basically a minor DOT effect, in video game terms.

It's just a way of being a little more effective without just adding extra damage to the attack itself. Some weapons can also entangle, poison, or do other things. Can't say they're any more arbitrary than any of the bonuses tacked onto D&D weapons(when D&D even bothers; you'll notice the FC gear list has a lot more variety in that respect). And at least in FC they try to make the default bonus effects(you can use the crafting system to make a lot of atypical gear, too) make sense given how the weapon works IRL. And to make different types of weapons, again by default, attractive in different ways.

You'll also notice that you can just add effects to weapons if you're willing to either spend the money or spend the materials and craft it yourself. So you can have a spear with Bleed without having to take Spear Basics. Or even be 2-handed. Having Spear Basics just automatically adds Bleed to any 2-handed spear in your hands that doesn't have it already. It's one of those things the GM is expected to oversee; but if the GM allows it, there's nothing keeping you from buying/making some really weird stuff if you want.

ETA: After Spellbound, the next book was supposed to be an expansion on the gear system. Or at least contain such a thing(I have trouble believing there's enough there for a whole book, especially considering how robust the options in the core book already are; but maybe I'm wrong). As much as I love the book series it's based on, I will forever refuse to buy any Mistborn RPG products because of how they neglected Fantasy Craft in favor of it. It doesn't help that Mistborn(at least the original trilogy) doesn't even make sense as an RPG in the first place. It's just not that kind of setting.

Quote from: GeekEclectic;1144035ETA: After Spellbound, the next book was supposed to be an expansion on the gear system. Or at least contain such a thing(I have trouble believing there's enough there for a whole book, especially considering how robust the options in the core book already are; but maybe I'm wrong). As much as I love the book series it's based on, I will forever refuse to buy any Mistborn RPG products because of how they neglected Fantasy Craft in favor of it. It doesn't help that Mistborn(at least the original trilogy) doesn't even make sense as an RPG in the first place. It's just not that kind of setting.

I don't mind waiting longer for Spellbound, since they're working on really important projects, like Dollars to Donuts.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/craftygames/dollars-to-donuts?ref=661fze&token=f367327b