Quote from: blakkieWell that is likely to cull the herd.  You don't tend to play long at that level though with D&D, as there is a steep power slope to climb you get at it pretty quickly. Which is likely for the best since defeat, and therefore death, tends to come very quickly when you drop them into standard D&D fair.

That's the whole point. At that level, you don't fight the beast in a Charge of the Peasant Brigade. You have to find some kind of cunning plan to defeat the evil beast -- after getting over your fear first. Playing at this level is best done if you take a hint from fairy tales. There wasn't that much sword-slinging in Hansel & Gretel. Collapsing the cave, driving it over a cliff with a herd of sheep, even just leading it on a exhausting chase so that you buy the village enough time 'til the good local knight can rescue it. Who might be a good patron for the beginning of the real adventure...

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaPrecisely.  Over the course of the adventure/campaign, the only combat skills they'll have will be self-discovered applications of skills that they already have.  Thus, we have The Smith who can crush a foe's head in with a good blow, but knows nothing about blocking or dodging a returned blow.  The Huntsman can shoot or lay traps, but again doesn't know anything about actual fighting.  The Herder is likely to be the one most likely to have gotten into a couple of tactical scraps, and that was probably against the likes of a small pack of wolves.What streets? I'm thinking of a real backwater village.  Any background that requires any degree of genuine sophistication (including even peripheral access to a market economy) is right out.  This is a self-sufficient po-dunk I'm imagining, pretty much in the middle of nowhere.

!i!

Yeah - I've played in one of these, many years before. Russian peasants in a little village near the bend in the Don, nothing around but forest, back in the days of the Kievan Rus. An apprentice smith, a Gypsy boy, a farmer's daughter, a young hunter, and the like. It was a blast.

-clash

Hrmm, going through the list I'll toss out a few more I haven't noticed yet.

Pilgrim (religious, able to walk a lot ), Groom (horse riding/handling), Peddler, Runner (fast runner), Serving Wench (social skills, possibly a parttime thief ), Conscript (was voluntold for the army, managed to learn to hide when the fighting was on so he survived), Barber (someone that actually knows about slitting throats), Apiarist (beekeeper),....

Quote from: SosthenesFor an adventure, I'd suggest the usual cliche of the monster which settled in nearby. It may be old and somewhat tired, but it gets all the stuff across the players will be facing later in their life as adventures. You might as well double up on the cliche and use a standard monster but don't tell that to your players.

Something I was thinking of was the use of a MacGuffin -- the threat seems to be coming from an obvious source nearby, but is really from another source entirely.  Going after the obvious (but incorrect) target will only stir up further troubles for the village, while the real problem continues unabated.

I'm beginning to think of a scenario something along these lines.  The setting is a small forward colony, something very much like the Norse colonies in Vinland (modern Newfoundland/Labrador).  Using the Vinlanders as an example, the obvious (and, again, incorrect) threat would be a perceived incursion of Skraelings (natives), and the problem should be something truly dire for their survival, like the kidnapping of precious infants.  Now, unjustly pissing off the Skraelings will be devastating to the colony.  Furthermore, the real problem -- a Grendel-like monster on a nearby island -- is a common foe to Vinlander and Skraeling alike.  So, there's a tense opportunity to possibly even enlist the aid of Skraeling warriors to defeat their common foe.

Now, one problem that I have with the above scenario as written is that I can't imagine a colony -- especially a Viking colony -- being established without at least two or three seasoned veterans in place.  Perhaps something bad happens to the veteran soldiers.  Maybe they've fallen ill or died, or perhaps they've already blamed the Skraelings and fallen in battle while mistakenly trying to rescue their children.

!i!

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaNow, one problem that I have with the above scenario as written is that I can't imagine a colony -- especially a Viking colony -- being established without at least two or three seasoned veterans in place.  Perhaps something bad happens to the veteran soldiers.  Maybe they've fallen ill or died, or perhaps they've already blamed the Skraelings and fallen in battle while mistakenly trying to rescue their children.

Fallen or not, the people that normally handle the bashy-bashy for the village headed a month or more ago and have not returned.  Which is why this pack nobodies has decided to step up and try do something.

That's got some real opportunity there.  EDIT: But isn't a Grendel a bit over the top?

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaNow, one problem that I have with the above scenario as written is that I can't imagine a colony -- especially a Viking colony -- being established without at least two or three seasoned veterans in place.  Perhaps something bad happens to the veteran soldiers.  Maybe they've fallen ill or died, or perhaps they've already blamed the Skraelings and fallen in battle while mistakenly trying to rescue their children.

As I read through this, I thought smallpox.  The "viking" villagers are immune to it, having already survived.  (And, mind you, it doesn't have to be smallpox, it can be something else.)

This would also give you the opportunity to curtail enlisting a lot of help from the skraelings, who are, perhaps, already pissed off that the outlanders brought them sickness and disease.  And perhaps it is the sickness and disease that originally attracted the "Grendel."  You know how they love sickness and decay!  However, upon finding the tasty morsels of the healthy, hearty veal-humans, he chose other dining fare...

Yeah, I vote for disease of some kind to kill off your warriors (or completely incapacitate them), stifle relations with the skraeling and draw the Grendel to the village.

I just did a bit of reading on the topic (Wikipedia to be precise, the entry on Vinland), and there's mention that only a couple of Viking leaders ("leaders" according to the article, not necessarily warriors) ever overwintered at the colony, so it seems that there might be certain times of the year when combat-hardened guards might be recalled to the main outpost and the settlers left largely on their own.

Quote from: blakkieThat's got some real opportunity there.  EDIT: But isn't a Grendel a bit over the top?

Well, I did say "Grendel-like".  Grendel is obviously too much, but a scaled-down threat fitting the Grendel role would be good.

!i!

Quote from: VellorianAs I read through this, I thought smallpox.  The "viking" villagers are immune to it, having already survived.  (And, mind you, it doesn't have to be smallpox, it can be something else.)

This would also give you the opportunity to curtail enlisting a lot of help from the skraelings, who are, perhaps, already pissed off that the outlanders brought them sickness and disease.

A disease would also provide a very credible reason for not being able to seek outside help -- quarantine.  The larger base colony refuses to send help, and will even stave off any attempt at contact from the backwater colony.

QuoteAnd perhaps it is the sickness and disease that originally attracted the "Grendel."

Would it be too cliché to suggest that it's the "Grendel" itself that brought the illness with it?  Defeating the real threat would end the disease for both the Vinlanders and Skraelings alike.

!i!

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaWould it be too cliché to suggest that it's the "Grendel" itself that brought the illness with it?  Defeating the real threat would end the disease for both the Vinlanders and skraelings alike.

No, I don't think it would.

In fact, I thought that shortly after I posted.  It's good to see that we're thinking in parallel.    And even if it is a little cliche, it's the kind that you can really sink your roleplaying teeth into...  

Well, it would also provide a very satisfying conclusion for the adventurers, particularly if they fell for the MacGuffin and initially went blaming the Skraelings.  It'd be a hat-trick.  They defeat the enemy that's stealing their children, they defeat the disease that's cut them off from home, and they can potentially smooth things over with the Skraelings by destroying their common enemy.

!i!

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaIt would also provide a very satisfying conclusion for the adventurers.  It'd be a hat-trick.  

Frankly, I really like it and may steal the idea, myself!    It's a great way to sew up all the loose ends.  However, I also love sequels, so might I suggest that they find evidence of off-spring from the Grendel-like thing, but no off-spring themselves?  

Maybe the Grendel-thing ate them?  Maybe they died?  Maybe they are lurking in the underbrush, ready to bring about the village's certain doom in the future!  :eek:

Quote from: VellorianFrankly, I really like it and may steal the idea, myself!

I liked the idea so much, I decided to write a Forge-style game designed specifically for this single scenario!

In keeping with this whole quasi-historical backdrop I've been working with, I'm trying to think of ways that the baby-stealing, disease-killing "monster" might turn out to be a mundane threat, one alien to both the Vikings and the Skraelings.  Perhaps an outcast, wandering, mad priest from far to the south.  South of the Skraelings, or south of the Norsemen?  A Mayan priest of Ah Puch, the god of the dead, or Camazotz, the bat god of the night and death.  Or, even more fancifully, a mad Moorish fakir from Morocco, exiled by the Caliph of Cordoba and blown across the ocean.

I can actually see this campaign taking on a very proto-Call of Cthulhu kind of feel to it.

!i!

So, if we settle on the Vinlander/Skraeling/unknown menace scenario, what 0-level characters do we have?

• The Woodsman - a sturdy outdoorsman with an axe
• The Smith - a massive stalwart with a hammer
• The Hunter - a cagey outdoorsman with a bow and arrow
• The Herder - an alert traveler with a sling and spear
• The Acolyte - a literate and semi-learned child/young adult

Any others?  Any twists or turns anyone can think of?

!i!

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaI liked the idea so much, I decided to write a Forge-style game designed specifically for this single scenario!

Going head to head with Burning Wheel? Seriously, this is so BW territory. First off BW deals very well with PCs failing at something, and there are a pack of noobs just looking for a place to fail.  They want to journey to the main colony to try convince them to help? Great, give it a shot. It'll likely just end up as practice for talking to the Skraelings.

Also this sounds like a 3 LP party, and that isn't even the lowerest starting character level.

Plus the whole senario just screams for BW, including the custom Grendal-lite monster.

Quote from: blakkieGoing head to head with Burning Wheel? Seriously, this is so BW territory.

I sense a certain undercurrent in your posts.  Actually, I'm glad that you threw the Forge comment back in my face by pointing out that there is, in fact, a Forge(y) game that handles open-ended scenarios.  That was a cheap shot on my part -- trying desperately to play to the crowd.

I'll confess that I've been eyeballing BW for a year or two now.  When cogitating this scenario, I had RQIII or HeroQuest in mind, using the RQ: Vikings supplement, but I was also fondly remembering my earliest Level 1 adventures with AD&D.  So...how cheaply can I get into Burning Wheel?

!i!