Quote from: J Arcane;251993BR has all the 5th Ed rules and all the rules needed to run the miniatures included, plus well over double the cost of the box set in minis.  The only thing missing from the rulebook is fluff, it's still a complete game.  

It's a good deal, the best box set they've ever put out.

But it's my understanding that the rules within aren't ALL the rules, just those releveant to BR. And I'm not really that interested in Orks and Space Marines.

I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying that I don't want it.

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;252011But it's my understanding that the rules within aren't ALL the rules, just those releveant to BR. And I'm not really that interested in Orks and Space Marines.

I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying that I don't want it.

You do realize that the rules for ALL the armies are in separate books anyway right?  BR includes some simple stats for most of the armies, but you're never really supposed to use them, much like you're never really supposed to use the army list included in the full sized standalone rulebook.

For $50 you can get a rulebook and almost $150 in minis, and the opportunity to find out if you actually like the game before you go plunking down hundreds of dollars for a proper codex and army.  If you decide to keep playing, you can always eBay the minis you don't want or sell them off to someone locally, and you'll likely be able to easily recoup the cost of the box set and you'll still have a perfectly good core rulebook left over.  

I'll put this pretty plainly:  The game itself isn't really very good, and you really owe it to yourself to try it in some cheaper form first before you go off and spend a bunch of cash on it only to find out that toy soldier Yahtzee isn't really that fun.

Quote from: J Arcane;252015You do realize that the rules for ALL the armies are in separate books anyway right?  BR includes some simple stats for most of the armies, but you're never really supposed to use them, much like you're never really supposed to use the army list included in the full sized standalone rulebook.

For $50 you can get a rulebook and almost $150 in minis, and the opportunity to find out if you actually like the game before you go plunking down hundreds of dollars for a proper codex and army.  If you decide to keep playing, you can always eBay the minis you don't want or sell them off to someone locally, and you'll likely be able to easily recoup the cost of the box set and you'll still have a perfectly good core rulebook left over.  

I'll put this pretty plainly:  The game itself isn't really very good, and you really owe it to yourself to try it in some cheaper form first before you go off and spend a bunch of cash on it only to find out that toy soldier Yahtzee isn't really that fun.

Was there really any point to this post? I already said that i had played Assault on Black Reach and, categorically, that I don't want it.

I'm not sure I want to trust the advice or opinions of someone who blatantly and utterly dislikes the game. Nor do I understand why saying it's shit is in anyway helpful.

And yes I know about the army books.

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;252027Was there really any point to this post? I already said that i had played Assault on Black Reach and, categorically, that I don't want it.

I'm not sure I want to trust the advice or opinions of someone who blatantly and utterly dislikes the game. Nor do I understand why saying it's shit is in anyway helpful.

And yes I know about the army books.

Did I say I "blatantly and utterly dislike" the game?  I don't recall saying that.

My point was, 40k is a pretty simplistic, "turn your brain off" sort of game, and that's fine for some and not fine for others.  If you're expecting deeper strategy, you will be disappointed, because most of the actual gameplay amounts to rolling fistfuls of dice.  It's also very frustrating at times because many of the armies are rather unfairly balanced despite the conceit of the point system supposedly ensuring a level playing field.  

The game isn't exactly a cheap buy-in for that sort of simple, beer-and-pretzels play style, and so I generally advise people to play it first in some fashion other than a sales-rep run demo game before they decide to buy in and find themselves disappointed with the actual depth of the game.  

If you've got the kind of cash to throw around, by all means, don't let a bunch of faceless nerds on an internet board stop you, but I really am trying to be helpful here.

Quote from: J Arcane;252031Did I say I "blatantly and utterly dislike" the game?  I don't recall saying that.

My point was, 40k is a pretty simplistic, "turn your brain off" sort of game, and that's fine for some and not fine for others.  If you're expecting deeper strategy, you will be disappointed, because most of the actual gameplay amounts to rolling fistfuls of dice.  It's also very frustrating at times because many of the armies are rather unfairly balanced despite the conceit of the point system supposedly ensuring a level playing field.  

The game isn't exactly a cheap buy-in for that sort of simple, beer-and-pretzels play style, and so I generally advise people to play it first in some fashion other than a sales-rep run demo game before they decide to buy in and find themselves disappointed with the actual depth of the game.  

If you've got the kind of cash to throw around, by all means, don't let a bunch of faceless nerds on an internet board stop you, but I really am trying to be helpful here.

No, you said it was 'toy soldier yahtzee' which amounts to the same thing.

You don't like it, fine. I just don't get why you feel the need to tell me this. I'm capable of deciding for myself and don't really want this thread bogged down by people's criticisms of the game.

Perhaps you could suggest a better game? If you want to be helpful, then try adopting a more helpful tone.

anyone know what the major UK online forum for 40k is?

J Arcane: Acording of my theorethical knowledge, complexity of warhammer probably depends on amount of "terrain" you have on your table... on flat table it is quite possibly just "danger managment" game, where all the complexity stems from deciding what is most dangerous to you at said turn and shooting at it.

How expensive, is the average (if there is such a thing) 40K army?