Rocks on toast.

The graphics, mechanically etc... are all good and do what you would expect.  The augmentation (xp system) gives you lots of options on how you want to round out your character.   Combat is deadly, you need to watch you ammo, enemies react when they hear gun shots and it feels fairly alive.

What I'm really enjoying about it though is the story and the exploration.  The game has a main story but has lots of side quests that criss-cross all over.

For example, I ran into an informant that gave me a lead on how to get into the weapons store at the police station.  So I sneaked into the police station (no small feet) found the weapons stash and looted it.  But during all of that I hacked into some computers and that found out some other information to look into.

Then as I was following another lead I ran into an undercover cop from my past that I agreed to help take down a dirty copy.   Which I had inadvertently already dug up some info on.

It's a far more focused and concise game then say Oblivion/Fallout.  Yet still gives you that sense of reward for exploration without those elements becoming a total distraction.

So far, I am really happy with it (I have just arrived in the second city today, after a lot of gameplay). My only problem so far has been the fact that there are unavoidable, hard bossfights, which isn't ideal when your character is built as a stealthy hacker who prefers to avoid combat. But otherwise, it is a success both in its own right and as a Deus Ex prequel. It is also remarkably well-written, a rarity in computer games.

Some of the reviews for thsi game are complete hype.
I'm getting near the end now and it's starting to sag. A lot of repetition and frankly the upgraded cloak is just stupidly overpowered.
The boss fights really spoil the game.

To be fair though you hate just about everything.

Quote from: kryyst;476617To be fair though you hate just about everything.

Yes, he's hard to please, but all that means is that one got to tone his posts a bit to read them aright. Do that, and you'll frequenlty find a worthwhile observation or two buried in his posts.

In the case at hand, I'd say Ghost Whistler thinks Deus Ex HR is one of the better games to come out this year, and it's only after prolonged exposure that the first signs of boredom appear (which can't be said for most releases). Also, he confirms the problem with boss fights raised by Melan; but for all we know he thinks it's a marginal irritation, nothing to get venomous about.

Seriously, the absence of bile and 'I wasted my money and sold off the game' mean the game comes with a (comparatively) high recommendation on his part.

I think one has to parse certain review(er)s like that, e.g. Yathzee, to derive something that's useful for one's own judgement re: whether or not to invest in a game. Negative reviews are actually nearly the only ones I derive useful feedback from when it comes to gaming (RPG, board, and PC). Positive reviews only help me to heighten extant enthusiasm I have for a game, and very rarely contain any amount of insight or critical evaluation. For instance, your OP doesn't convince me one bit to try out the game, whereas Melan's post (Melan, of all people, a guy with a serious academic day job, blowing spare time on a fragging computer game) gave me quite a pause.

Fair enough.  But I also wasn't really trying to give a review in my OP, just a statement of enjoyment.  After all I wouldn't feel right giving a review based on a game that I haven't even come close to finishing.

Though I do want to comment on the boss fights.  I haven't really run across any hard ones yet, mind you I'm still early into it.    My character's aug's are between hacking and movement, I haven't modified anything to improve combat specifically, except for the fact that I can throw a dumpster but that's only useful a fraction of the time.

Now could be I haven't run into the hard boss fights your talking about, which I'm betting are all story scripted.  But other significant fights I've been able to deal with on my terms and haven't been a problem.

Quote from: kryyst;476617To be fair though you hate just about everything.

I hate you.

And your mum.

Quote from: Windjammer;476634Yes, he's hard to please, but all that means is that one got to tone his posts a bit to read them aright. Do that, and you'll frequenlty find a worthwhile observation or two buried in his posts.

In the case at hand, I'd say Ghost Whistler thinks Deus Ex HR is one of the better games to come out this year, and it's only after prolonged exposure that the first signs of boredom appear (which can't be said for most releases). Also, he confirms the problem with boss fights raised by Melan; but for all we know he thinks it's a marginal irritation, nothing to get venomous about.

Seriously, the absence of bile and 'I wasted my money and sold off the game' mean the game comes with a (comparatively) high recommendation on his part.

I think one has to parse certain review(er)s like that, e.g. Yathzee, to derive something that's useful for one's own judgement re: whether or not to invest in a game. Negative reviews are actually nearly the only ones I derive useful feedback from when it comes to gaming (RPG, board, and PC). Positive reviews only help me to heighten extant enthusiasm I have for a game, and very rarely contain any amount of insight or critical evaluation. For instance, your OP doesn't convince me one bit to try out the game, whereas Melan's post (Melan, of all people, a guy with a serious academic day job, blowing spare time on a fragging computer game) gave me quite a pause.

Thanks. It isn't a bad game at all. The setting looks stunning even if the in-game cut scenes don't (the same couple of poses and some dodgy lip sync). The boss fights really don't belong and really stuff up stealth based play.

The problem is that it just starts to sag. You are essentially doing the same thing over and over. Sure there are different ways to go through the game, but during that game you will do things the same way: if you're stealth you'll go through an area the same way each time. If you aren't built for combat you will die otherwise, and quickly.
The augs are half decent and half redundant - and there really isn't a huge variety. Supervision is cool and always useful, being immune to electricity is highly contextual. Even immunity to flashbangs is (very very rarely have I had one thrown at me, or even chosen to use them). The energy management is poorly done. It does the job, but it forces you to stock up on cybercandy (how you regain energy - eat chocolate) but it's hard to find and the clinics sell very very limited supplies. In fact all the vendors have very very limited stock - even though you're the sec chief for a huge tech corporation!
It's fun enough, but i'd recommend it as a rental. Space Marine comes out next week and I brought the game knowing I'd trade it in quick. That's how I consume games.

I like how all the main-story related terminals and computers have to be ranked at 1 so that everyone can get through them, and then in side missions you start running into things ranked at 3 or 4 :rolleyes:.

The bosses certainly can give you a hard time if you aren't geared for some heavy combat, though I got past the first one after he walked into his own grenades. The second one gave me a headache at first, but I did beat that one too after several tries.

The energy system sucks IMO and most of the "stealth gameplay" is just staying behind cover until you can knock someone out / find a vent but hey, it works. And knocking out two random civilians at once is always fun, as is burying people under a giant mountain of fridges.

I didn't find the bosses particularly hard, and I avoided the heavy-hitting augments like the typhoon.  They can all be overcome fairly easily with a quick observation and applying some technique.  Though there's something to be said of the original DX and being able to run right past a boss and slam a door, as Yahtzee Croshaw points out.

Overall, fairly tight game, though, and IMO, much better designed than anything Bethesda has put out.  Combines the best aspects of action and RPG without letting the sacred cows of either hold it back.

Now, I don't think it's perfect.  I can't quite put my finger on it, but I still felt it a bit lacking in areas even though it's only one of four games I've had enough motivation to beat the first week I've had them.

Quote from: Ramrod;476666I like how all the main-story related terminals and computers have to be ranked at 1 so that everyone can get through them, and then in side missions you start running into things ranked at 3 or 4 :rolleyes:.

The bosses certainly can give you a hard time if you aren't geared for some heavy combat, though I got past the first one after he walked into his own grenades. The second one gave me a headache at first, but I did beat that one too after several tries.

The energy system sucks IMO and most of the "stealth gameplay" is just staying behind cover until you can knock someone out / find a vent but hey, it works. And knocking out two random civilians at once is always fun, as is burying people under a giant mountain of fridges.

I noticed that about the terminals. Also a lot of the computers are there simply to be hacked for xp. I find reading the entries difficult and they aren't remotely relevant. If you are a combat monster you can usually find passwords on mobs as opposed to sneaking and hacking, but you won't get the rewards or xp as if you hacked. What's more annoying is (SPOILER) Captain Penn's computer is level 2 and you can't get a password afaik. You need to stock up on a device first.

The first guy throws grenades through walls and around corners. It's very annoying. Fiddingling about with the hud to target the munitions scattered around while trying not to be chaingunned by this invincible behemoth was most annoying. Especially when you find your inventory is too full and you need to target the right piece of ammo. Killing the bosses doesn't count against the no-fatalities achievement, obv.

Some of the vents are a bit too easy. You can avoid entire areaas of mobs if you find the right vent. It's a bit much.

SPOILER!!!


Wow, the third boss is beyond the pale.

What a disappointing way to design this game. All the attention to detail, all the intricacy of the environment and the story (such as it is, it is detailed though), and then this.

I don't think i can be bothered. Here's a guy that's invisible, when he appears he fires his one shot kill weapon and looks exactly like the manequins that fill the arena you fight him in (basically a hall of mirrors). When you die (when not if) you have to load the save prior to the cutscene that introduces the battle and go through the tedious load times and skipping the scene. What a chore. On top of that your bionics have gone tits up and they dont' work, non lethal ordnance is useless (as usual), and you can barely see the screen because the optical effects representing the interference makes it go wibbly wobbly.

Good work Eidos.

SPOILER



























I thought the biochip recall was a fairly obvious ploy to fuck you over, mate.

That said, you don't need any augmentations, and every single bossfight in the game has lethal ordinance littered around like candy.

1.  Boss appears.
2.  Take as many potshots as you can take without dying.
3.  Hit sprint and run round the outside of the area until you regain enough health to repeat 1 & 2.


Seriously, I thought the people on this forum would enjoy this sort of stuff.  The ideology spouted here has my back.  I mean poorly designed, arbitrarily difficult boss fights are a hallmark of vintage video-games!  It's a feature, not a bug!  It's real challenge!

Wow, I was thinking about picking it up but I hadn't decided. GW is a harsher critic than rotten tomatoes. I might go for it now.

Quote from: Cranewings;476967Wow, I was thinking about picking it up but I hadn't decided. GW is a harsher critic than rotten tomatoes. I might go for it now.

Much better than any of the Mass Effect games, IMO, in terms of attempting to combine action and RPG elements.

Also, adding third-person cameras for cover was the best thing they could've done.  The extra awareness it gives you keeps the stealth play interesting and fun rather than frustrating.  It also allows you to really scope out rooms during combat to help you plan an approach.  

I know some hardcore "immersion" dudes (Warren Spector himself, possibly, since he made comments to the effect of "I wouldn't have done that") may dislike it, but the first-person perspective in shooters is really much more limiting for spatial awareness than "real life" anyway, so adhering to the perspective as some sacred doctrine would've been a poor decision, IMO.