I've recently restarted playing a few old games that I haven't played for a decade or two. For me, Telengard was too limited in choices and too hard to live long enough at first to get things going.
 
But NetHack sucked me in. You have lots of choices - equipment, magic, classes. It keeps you guessing because it doesn't automatically tell you what the equipment and monsters are - you don't know the name of a new monster until it attacks or you attack or do something with it - and there are lots of different monster types. It has all the optimization fun of an rpg. You come across odd items and don't know what to do. You have to take risks - do I eat the gnome or hope to find real food?
 
I can now see past the lack of graphics to see how much was accomplished with so little. Most newer games are a step down to me. Their cute cut scenes bore me quickly. Their extreme railroading annoys me. Their lack of options at any given moment frustrate me. What's the point of dialogue options if the guts behind them are really choose A, B, or C. NetHack is turn based, not real time but I prefer that - it makes it easy to stop at any time.
 
Sure, there are few ways it could be improved - multiplayer, a graphical interface for making choices, an overarching plot. But incrasingly bigger graphics that drive new pc sales are not for me. I want interesting play and the ability to just wander around.
 
What current/slightly old games offer as much rpg fun?
 
Don't believe me about NetHack? Try downloading it:
http://www.nethack.org/v343/downloads.html
It's a small program and runs on XP without problem.

Quote from: NicephorusYou have to take risks - do I eat the gnome or hope to find real food?

Hey, those gnomes are good eatin', especially down in the mines. Many's been the time my elven wizards have survived on a steady diet of gnomes and lichen. (Of course, it's a pretty terrible idea if you happen to be a gnome yourself.)

NetHack is a true classic among CRPGs in general and rogue-likes in particular.
If you enjoyed it and want to try something different, we have a thread about RLs where are other good ones are mentioned: http://www.therpgsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7347
I especially recommend the yet-to-be-finished AliensRL. DoomRL is also nice, but very lightweight in comparison to your usual RL.

In regard of older non-RL-CRPGs with re-play value, I enjoy Darklands for DOS. Less re-play value, but yet recommendable are among the older guard Shadowrun for Genesis and Secret of Mana for SNES (not unpopular, but yet one of the best games, and one of the few instances where German localization improved something).

I, personally, pine, mind you, pine for a worthy successor to Tie Fighter.[/B]

Stickin' it to those damn Rebs was never more fun or rewarding as it was with that gem.  Gotta get my kicks via SW Battlefront 1 and 2 nowadays.

p.s. No, there wasn't too much in terms of RPGness to this game, so I'm sorry.  I've zip to offer up for that genre specifically.  But damn, I loved that sim.

Quote from: DangerI, personally, pine, mind you, pine for a worthy successor to Tie Fighter.[/B]

Stickin' it to those damn Rebs was never more fun or rewarding as it was with that gem.  Gotta get my kicks via SW Battlefront 1 and 2 nowadays.

p.s. No, there wasn't too much in terms of RPGness to this game, so I'm sorry.  I've zip to offer up for that genre specifically.  But damn, I loved that sim.

I really, REALLY liked X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter.

OP: I agree qith quite a lot of what you're saying. I think Diablo 2 did a great job of balancing it all (Story, Art and playability). WoW is the same idea, except all the risk has been taken out of it.


Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic really makes you feel a part of the world and your choice really do change the story...which is pretty cool in my book.

Disgaea is a tactical RPG (For PS2) that has a very entertaining (but admittedly throw-away) story. It has an RPG statistical depth that goes deeper than any other game before or since (just imagine being able to bring a character to level 9999...and that only scratches the surface)
 and can literally be played for 100s of hours without doing everything there is to do in the game.

I'm more partial to Linley's Dungeon Crawl.  Very similar to NetHack, but a bit more streamlined.  I like the magic and skills systems...I just grokked it easier than NetHack.

The biggest time-sink in my life for the past year and a half or so would be Dwarf Fortress, however.  A sim-style fantasy roguelike that's just up your alley if you're an obsessive micromanager like me....

I'm looking into Vulture's Eye. Its Nethack, with a really nice graphical interface.

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