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[Hot War] is awesome

Started by The Butcher, June 18, 2010, 02:15:49 PM

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Jason Morningstar

Do look into David Peace, he's a great writer and has written two books set in immediate (46-48) postwar Tokyo. Absolutely harrowing. Somebody is adapting one of them (Occupied City, which I have not yet read) into a film.

It'll be interesting to see how you do the divided loyalties and multiple factions thing in Japan, whose occupiers were not as "diverse" as Germany's.
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Malcolm Craig

#106
Quote from: Jason Morningstar;394425Do look into David Peace, he's a great writer and has written two books set in immediate (46-48) postwar Tokyo. Absolutely harrowing. Somebody is adapting one of them (Occupied City, which I have not yet read) into a film.

It'll be interesting to see how you do the divided loyalties and multiple factions thing in Japan, whose occupiers were not as "diverse" as Germany's.

I'll certainly look out for those books. Thanks for the recommendation.

As regards the divided loyalties/multiple factions/national agendas, yes there will be quite a few differences between the situation in Red Sun and straight-up Cold City. The way I'm looking at it at the moment, given the nature of the occupation, it's going to be less about national agendas* and more about factional in-fighting. In this way, it would be similar to Hot War.

So, you'd have, for example, the MacArthurite faction within the occupying forces, a faction with great power and influence. But as is well known, MacArthur wasn't universally liked, so there might be factions within the American forces opposing him and his lickspittle coterie of senior officers. The USSR will obviously be implanting agents like crazy, agencies from back in the US will be keeping an eye on things, etc. There are lots of opportunities for exciting play!

That being said, it's something I've yet to sit down and sort out in any great detail. Sketches and scribbles are where its at at the moment!

Cheers
Malcolm

*In that the vast majority of the power lay with one nation.
Malcolm Craig - Contested Ground Studios
Hot War, available now! You can also buy the PDF from DTRPG.
Cold City v1.1 - available now!  
Find our stuff on Indie Press Revolution and The Collective Endeavour
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Ghost Whistler

Quote from: RPGPundit;394343From the "Are Storytelling Games RPG's?" thread, CRKreuger finally answers the questions I had originally asked on here about Hot War, that no one else seemed very willing to answer straightly.

I will repeat what I said there: are there ANY Hot War fans who are going to come along and argue that the above DESCRIPTION of mechanics is inaccurate in the game?? I don't want to hear arguments about how this should really be considered an RPG, it ISN'T. The ONLY rational argument you can make here to save Hot War's status as an RPG is to state that CRKrueger got it wrong in terms of how the game actually works.

RPGPundit
Who are you to say whether the game, that you had no involvement in producing, is NOT an rpg? You play a role in it, ergo....

The mechanics may not be to your taste, and you are merely exposing your prejudice. Grow the fuck up.
"Ghost Whistler" is rated PG-13 (Parents strongly cautioned). Parental death, alien battles and annihilated worlds.

TrekkieKT

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;394478Who are you to say whether the game, that you had no involvement in producing, is NOT an rpg? You play a role in it, ergo....

The mechanics may not be to your taste, and you are merely exposing your prejudice. Grow the fuck up.

It's Pundy's forum, it's his call to make, regardless of how it appears to others. If you disagree with his position, ignore him, he's the best troll on these boards. Please, can we keep to discussing the Hot War awesome here.

Personally, I love both Hot War and Cold City, I like the way the character traits shape the story and how they work in play. Well done Malcolm. What else is in the pipeline?

Peace, Love and Wombats.
TrekkieKT

Imperator

#109
Quote from: TrekkieKT;394649It's Pundy's forum, it's his call to make, regardless of how it appears to others. If you disagree with his position, ignore him, he's the best troll on these boards. Please, can we keep to discussing the Hot War awesome here.

Personally, I love both Hot War and Cold City, I like the way the character traits shape the story and how they work in play. Well done Malcolm. What else is in the pipeline?

Peace, Love and Wombats.
TrekkieKT

I think that where does the Pundit put this discussion is irrelevant. If you use the "New posts" function, it will show you the thread regardless where is ubicated. So please, don't waste your time arguing with the Pundit about what is and what is not an RPG. These are his boards, so whatever he decides to be on topic is. And that's it. It's not a big deal.
My name is Ramón Nogueras. Running now Vampire: the Masquerade (Giovanni Chronicles IV for just 3 players), and itching to resume my Call of Cthulhu campaign (The Sense of the Sleight-of-Hand Man).

Ghost Whistler

Quote from: Imperator;394789I think that where does the Pundit put this discussion is irrelevant. If you use the "New posts" function, it will show you the thread regardless where is ubicated. So please, don't waste your time arguing with the Pundit about what is and what is not an RPG. These are his boards, so whatever he decides to be on topic is. And that's it. It's not a big deal.

Well, no. If you run a forum do so properly. If you, for what ever bizarre logic is at work here, want to marginalise certain games, then at the very least you need specific rules as to how games are going to be organised and an explicity set of forums to cater for them. Randomly deciding to stick rpg's in other games is not the way to go but at all. Hot War is made as an rpg, sold as an rpg and played as one...
"Ghost Whistler" is rated PG-13 (Parents strongly cautioned). Parental death, alien battles and annihilated worlds.

crkrueger

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;394802Well, no. If you run a forum do so properly. If you, for what ever bizarre logic is at work here, want to marginalise certain games, then at the very least you need specific rules as to how games are going to be organised and an explicity set of forums to cater for them. Randomly deciding to stick rpg's in other games is not the way to go but at all. Hot War is made as an rpg, sold as an rpg and played as one...

However, it's not a Traditional RPG, it's a Narrative RPG, aka a Storygame.  If you read the descriptions of the forums as Pundit defines them, Hot War belongs in Other Games, which is any type of game other then Traditional RPG, which he obviously want's to be his focus.

Why doesn't he put WFRP3 or 4e here then?  If you want him to, make the case.
Even the the "cutting edge" storygamers for all their talk of narrative, plot, and drama are fucking obsessed with the god damned rules they use. - Estar

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Imperator

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;394802Well, no. If you run a forum do so properly. If you, for what ever bizarre logic is at work here, want to marginalise certain games, then at the very least you need specific rules as to how games are going to be organised and an explicity set of forums to cater for them. Randomly deciding to stick rpg's in other games is not the way to go but at all. Hot War is made as an rpg, sold as an rpg and played as one...
If you run a forum you can do whatever the fuck you want to, as long as is a privately owned forum. The Pundit has the right to change the rules or whatever at random, because this is his place. Even if I disagree with him on this, which I do, I acknowledge that this is his place, and he has the right to change the rules every day if he sees it fit. If I get sick of it, I'll go somewhere else.

And again, seriously, is not such a big deal. Use the search for new posts function and it doesn't matter where the Pundit chooses to put the threads. Even if he creates a subforum called "Fucking crappy games that only a moron would play" you would be able to see them and take part on the discussions. And how the Pundit chooses to call things doesn't impact me in the least.
My name is Ramón Nogueras. Running now Vampire: the Masquerade (Giovanni Chronicles IV for just 3 players), and itching to resume my Call of Cthulhu campaign (The Sense of the Sleight-of-Hand Man).

Jason Morningstar

Malcolm, I haven't played - to what degree do you think the setting and situation are uniquely UK-oriented? With Cold City I felt the international angle was helpful to my players - the guy least familiar with the time and place played the American, and the guy who had a background in Russian played the MVD Colonel. Is a lack of familiarity with the UK going to present a problem?

When we played Graham Walmsley's A Taste For Murder, we really felt that there were a lot of cultural assumptions about behavior that we just didn't get, either because we weren't English in that case, or because none of us were familiar with the murder mysteries it draws from. The text offered no guidance in that case so we ended up winging it, and it felt off kilter. Would we have the same problem with Hot War?
Check out Fiasco, "Best RPG" Origins Award nominee, Diana Jones Award and Ennie Judge\'s Spotlight Award winner. As seen on Tabletop!

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D-503

Quote from: Scott Dorward;394317I'm planning on running a full length Hot War game at Dragonmeet, if that helps.

If I make it this year I'll definitely try and sign up for that.

Ghost Whistler, I saw that Star Trek episode for the first time on Saturday!  Cool avatar.

I did think the episode had some logical flaws:

"so far you've not commited any crimes" - well apart from stealing a space yacht and breaching Romulan space, no, I suppose not.

And the whole thing where the space hippies try to murder the entire crew in cold blood, which the crew then sort of forget afterwards while wishing the space hippies well, what the fuck?  There was a weird mix of Manson family vibe in that episode at times which I'm not sure was entirely intentional (or entirely unintentional, but when you try to murder hundreds of people you do kind of cross a line).
I roll to disbelieve.

Scott Dorward

Quote from: Jason Morningstar;394820Would we have the same problem with Hot War?
While most of the people I've run Hot War for are British, a few haven't been, and I haven't noticed any problems with them getting to grip with the characters or background.  And while I'm of British parentage, I didn't actually settle in this country until adulthood, so I don't always have the same cultural touchstones as many people here; I've managed to cope OK with Hot War by being familiar with a lot of the media inspirations, reading a bit of history and hitting Wikipedia to fill in gaps.  It seems to have worked so far.

Also, there is the option to play expatriate Americans or mainland Europeans, if you want to use your lack of familiarity with London as a strength.

Malcolm Craig

Quote from: TrekkieKT;394649Personally, I love both Hot War and Cold City, I like the way the character traits shape the story and how they work in play. Well done Malcolm. What else is in the pipeline?

Hey,

Thanks for the kind words about both games. Over this thread I've taked a little bit about future stuff for Hot War, Cold City, and other projects. For those such as yourself who are interested, this might be a good opportunity to round some of those up (and maybe introduce a few new things).

For Hot War, we've just launched the Hot War Transmission, our new quarterly mini-supplement. The first is dedicated to Nigel Kneale, the father of British SF/speculative TV fiction and a huge influence on Hot War (and Cold City, to be fair). The second issue (due out in October), will be themed around politics.

For Cold City, there's a couple of exciting things on the horizon for 2011. 'Monster of the Month' will run from January until December and will offer a free PDF download highlighting a new monster every month. It'll be presented in the form of an RPA report on the monster, and another sheet giving game stats, plot hooks, and so forth.

Then, there's the previously mentioned Cold City: Red Sun, which will allow you to transpose the action of Cold City to Tokyo in 1950. That promises to be pretty exciting, and there's been some great feedback and recommendations for source material in this very thread.

As for other projects, well, there are few on the go at the moment, all with vague release dates. Actually, there are no release dates at all, if I'm being honest.

Shipwreck! is something of a hyrbid RPG/boardgame (vaguely, kind of) all about creating shipwreck stories. The format will be a bit different to a lot of other games.

Okhrana is an ultra-ultra-niche game that uses variations on the Hot War mechanics. The setting is 1899 Paris and the characters are emigre radicals trying to forward their political manifestos and avoid the attentions of the authorities and, most of all, the Czarist secret police, the eponymous Okhrana. I did say it was a very, very niche product and I'm writing it because it's something that fascinates me and the only way I'll get a game about it is to write one myself!

Finally, the one that is closest to completion is Sunshine. Imagine if cyberpunk took place in 1975, with 1970s technology and an early to mid 70's design aesthetic. Well, that's Sunshine. We're planning on producing the game in full colour (but just as a little digest sized book). One thing that excites me (and it's something we did in part with Hot War) is that all of the setting information will come from in-game artefacts (posters, memos, adverts, flyers, etc) and from text in rules examples. Again, an ultra-niche game, but one that I'm really quite excited about.

So there you go! I should stop my rambling now.

Cheers
Malcolm
Malcolm Craig - Contested Ground Studios
Hot War, available now! You can also buy the PDF from DTRPG.
Cold City v1.1 - available now!  
Find our stuff on Indie Press Revolution and The Collective Endeavour
Keep up to date with our news on Facebook and Twitter

Malcolm Craig

#117
Quote from: Jason Morningstar;394820Malcolm, I haven't played - to what degree do you think the setting and situation are uniquely UK-oriented? With Cold City I felt the international angle was helpful to my players - the guy least familiar with the time and place played the American, and the guy who had a background in Russian played the MVD Colonel. Is a lack of familiarity with the UK going to present a problem?

When we played Graham Walmsley's A Taste For Murder, we really felt that there were a lot of cultural assumptions about behavior that we just didn't get, either because we weren't English in that case, or because none of us were familiar with the murder mysteries it draws from. The text offered no guidance in that case so we ended up winging it, and it felt off kilter. Would we have the same problem with Hot War?

Thanks for asking Jason, that's an excellent question and one that I don't doubt many people have asked themselves. I'll agree that Cold City provides the more immediate 'hook' for people and a broader range of experiences that people can draw on to get into the game.

It has always been my hope with Hot War that the way the game is presented would help people understand the setting and milleu in a way that gets past the "I know nothing about Britain in the 1960s!" gut reaction. The majority of the game development actually took place while I was living in New Zealand, with great success. Although, it must be admitted that there are strong cultural links between NZ and the UK that still exist.

It's been my experience that people unfamiliar with the time period actually do have more of a grasp than they thought: the archetypes of 'Swinging London', the Beatles, even Austin Powers movies. Even these little associations with British culture of the early 60s are often present and can help form the basis for understanding.

To flick back to your initial paragraph, there is a certain 'Britishness' about the game and its setting. It is very firmly rooted in the work of J G Ballard, John Wydham, TV series such as 'Quatermass and the Pit', and films such as 'The War Game' and 'Threads'. All of these present a British view of the apocalypse, horror, SF, and the nuclear threat. Yet, many of these basic ideas are touchstones that we are all familiar with.

In the end, I don't think lack of familiarity would be a barrier to enjoying the game. I certainly can't seen any more difficulty than coming new to Greyhawk or the Cthulhu Mythos, for example (although, I'll admit that those are both setting which are far more exansively detailed and in-depth that Hot War!). Each group would, and should, create their own vision of the UK in post-apocalypse 1963. If that's a vision coming from Sean Connery era 'James Bond' movies rather than the nuclear brutality of 'Threads' or the new-wave stylings of Ballard, then that's far from a problem. Things like the Player's Primer in the back of the book should, I hope, give a fictional framework that people can hang things on. But, it's not proscriptive.

I feel I've rambled a bit here. Does this in any way answer your question?

Quote from: Scott DorwardAlso, there is the option to play expatriate Americans or mainland Europeans, if you want to use your lack of familiarity with London as a strength.

That's a very good point. Even with the fictional framing of the Special Situations Group, it's eminently possible to play nationalities other than British. It's something that I plan on addressing even more fully in future issues of the Hot War Transmission.
 

Cheers
Malcolm
Malcolm Craig - Contested Ground Studios
Hot War, available now! You can also buy the PDF from DTRPG.
Cold City v1.1 - available now!  
Find our stuff on Indie Press Revolution and The Collective Endeavour
Keep up to date with our news on Facebook and Twitter

Jason Morningstar

Thanks, that makes a lot of sense.

(I'm also sort of excited about Okhrana, but you'd probably predict that)
Check out Fiasco, "Best RPG" Origins Award nominee, Diana Jones Award and Ennie Judge\'s Spotlight Award winner. As seen on Tabletop!

"Understanding the enemy is important. And no, none of his designs are any fucking good." - Abyssal Maw

Joshua Ford

I must admit Malcolm, that is was The War Game and Threads that came to mind when looking at elements of the setting. Two of the most unnerving things I've seen - I wasn't even allowed to watch Threads after the first fifteen minutes when it was first broadcast but the Radio Times cover of an armed traffic warden intrigued me.

Anyway, whilst thinking about possible scenarios I remembered the following:

http://www.willys-mb.co.uk/rudloe.htm - Britain's Strategic Steam Reserve. I like the idea of a nuclear-powered sub but perhaps a group wants to acquire a number of well-maintained steam engines to avoid too much reliance?

Anyway, I don't think I should be thinking too deeply about this at the moment. Last night I managed to come up with a particularly unpleasant and vivid nighmare which consisted of finding myself on the outskirts of a nuclear attack and feeling the onset of radiation sickness. I ended up having to wake myself up. No more youtube vids for the moment.

Thanks for the PM by the way - it took me a while to notice I had one I'm afraid.