I'd like to know!
Rank and File. And I am assuming you meant to clarify that we are talking about medieval style war games, and not modern warfare with guns. You never specified that.
I'm still looking for a good rules lite rank-&-file game.
Two contenders are One Page Rules: Fantasy Regiments, or JuniorGeneral.ORG Battle of Agincourt scenario.
https://www.onepagerules.com/games/age-of-fantasy-regiments (https://www.onepagerules.com/games/age-of-fantasy-regiments)
https://juniorgeneral.org/agincourt/agincourt.html (https://juniorgeneral.org/agincourt/agincourt.html)
Any genre of game fits into the topic, but medieval games come to my mind first; This has me wondering what a modern R&F game with modern guns would look like, besides the basic Archer/Musketeer profile.
Do you enjoy rank & file for the emphasis on flanking and cavalry or do you enjoy seeing a massive pitched battle on the table rather than a small scrap or is it just preference?
I know Osprey's Oathmark is simple, but that doesn't always mean rules-lite, I wish I could contribute more!
I like both, which makes it hard for me to focus on any one kind of hobby/wargame.
Quote from: GiantToenail on December 11, 2023, 10:49:05 AM
Any genre of game fits into the topic, but medieval games come to my mind first; This has me wondering what a modern R&F game with modern guns would look like, besides the basic Archer/Musketeer profile.
Modern rank and file would probably be US civil war. Sure, it's mostly muskets, but you also have steam powered trains and ships, trench lines, and even machine gun Gatling guns.
Me, I lose interest outside 1066-1400 AD.
I like rank & file better, but I like skirmish well enough, too.
Skirmish! And sci-fi tactical/operational combat.
but also wwII etc: Axis & Allies minis, Avalon Hill,etc.
I like Wargames in general.
I love a good rank and file game. The three big ones I play are all Warlord: Hail Caesar, Pike & Shotte, and Black Powder. Granted 28mm isn't the best scale in terms of impressively sized units, it makes for fun painting. I recently painted up some battalions for the American Civil War.
That being said, I play more skirmish games since it's easier to put together a force and store them. The ones I play the most are Lion Rampant, Ronin, and the Lord of the Rings miniatures game.
I'm in the skirmish level sci-fi tactical camp. I do need to get Five Parsecs from Home to the (virtual) table. And, I still have a bunch of Aetherstream: Interceptor minis to paint.
Quote from: 1stLevelWizard on December 30, 2023, 09:15:41 PM
I love a good rank and file game. The three big ones I play are all Warlord: Hail Caesar, Pike & Shotte, and Black Powder. Granted 28mm isn't the best scale in terms of impressively sized units, it makes for fun painting. I recently painted up some battalions for the American Civil War.
That being said, I play more skirmish games since it's easier to put together a force and store them. The ones I play the most are Lion Rampant, Ronin, and the Lord of the Rings miniatures game.
I play for the tactics. I'm not a model maker.
My units are paper standup units printed on a PC printer, or even Jenga blocks.
Quote from: weirdguy564 on January 11, 2024, 06:41:26 PM
Quote from: 1stLevelWizard on December 30, 2023, 09:15:41 PM
I love a good rank and file game. The three big ones I play are all Warlord: Hail Caesar, Pike & Shotte, and Black Powder. Granted 28mm isn't the best scale in terms of impressively sized units, it makes for fun painting. I recently painted up some battalions for the American Civil War.
That being said, I play more skirmish games since it's easier to put together a force and store them. The ones I play the most are Lion Rampant, Ronin, and the Lord of the Rings miniatures game.
I play for the tactics. I'm not a model maker.
My units are paper standup units printed on a PC printer, or even Jenga blocks.
Honestly I get that. Modeling is essentially another hobby tacked onto wargaming, and in a lot of ways I've come to learn that the truly tactical games are like what you mentioned. I've recently gotten into the chit-based hex wargames such as Advanced Squad leader and a lot of Avalon Hill's games (i.e. Anzio, which is fantastic).
This is an apples to oranges comparison. Rank and File games are usually either medieval or fantasy wargames. Whereas a more granular Skirmish game is going to be more catered towards modern style warfare you'd see in science fiction. It's like you're asking which is superior between Warhammer Fantasy Battles or 40k. They're different games doing different things. Some people like both. Some prefer one or the other. I think 40k 10th edition is dogshit and the less said about Shitmar or The Artificially Scarce World the better. One Page Rules offers rules for lawyer friendly rank and file WFB and skirmish style 40k. And those rules are free and not dogshit. So I go with whatever flavour of OPR I'm in the mood for at the time. I might play Five Parsecs from Home if I'm in the mood for solo gaming too. I have absolutely no interest in historical wargaming due to it being completely the domain of boomers. It's just too old for me.
I don't think that's entirely true. Sure, rank and file usually is medieval/fantasy, there are several sci-fi games that would fit the description. Most notable would be Adeptus Titanicus/Space Marine, or the newer Legionis game GW dropped. There's also Flames of War and All Quiet on the Martian Front, which both use large units mounted on bases and moved in ranks.
As for skirmish, there's a ton of fantasy and skirmish medieval games. Ronin, Mordheim, and Frostgrave all come to mind. Ronin is a good example of this since it gets into the swordplay aspects of man-to-man combat, and it's pretty detailed. There's also an Elder Scrolls skirmish game, which wasn't bad but it was really damn expensive.
Lately I'm preferring rank-and-flank, because it's a lot easier to get an entire army painted and on the table in 6mm.
Let me recommend To The Strongest! as a fast, rules-lite rank-and-file wargame. You can play out a largish battle in about an hour, so it's not for people who want deep, in-depth tactics. Where it really excels is when mated with a simple campaign system, as you can get an entire campaign done in a weekend.
Skirmish for me. Simply because I am new to war games and they seemed simpler to get into, I will like to go into larger stuff in the future.
I can enjoy both, but I've been preferring skirmish games the past few years. Mostly due to the size of things, I love the lower model count and that skirmish games usually require a smaller table. Additionally, skirmish games tend to utilize terrain features way way better than rank&file, which I find very immersing. There's nothing worse than playing on a boring flat board where a forest is just a flat green template, etc.
I should confess. I previously said rank and file. However, I actually like both, but for different genres.
Rank and File is the way to go for medieval and medieval fantasy games. I've found another game since this topic was first posted.
Hobgoblin by Planet Smasher Games.
Hobgoblin (https://planetsmashergames.com/hobgoblin/)
FYI, they're more famous for the skirmish game called Gaslands using matchbox and hot wheel cars in a post apocalypse setting.
Hobgoblin uses a single chart of 11 troop types to determine your dice rolls. Aka light infantry attacking heavy cavalry will hit on a 5+ using ten D6 dice, but hit on 3+ vs light ranged infantry.
However, I prefer skirmish games for modern or sci-fi settings. My favorite is BattleTech. That being said, the new and simple Alpha Strike rules is how I prefer to play these days. It's just faster. Alpha Strike is actually just an evolution of the old BattleForce rules.
Another skirmish game we play is called C.O.R.E. Mech Warfare. Its AI art implies it's BattleTech, but actually it's Gundam. You use Japanese 1:144 scale robots, aka Gunpla kits. It's very simple and fast. You can tell it was written by an amateur, but it works. For example, it says short range attacks are a -1, while a long range attack isn't a +2, but instead changes the dice roll to hit from a 4 or better to a 6. But, isn't that the same math as saying a long range shot is just a +2? Why do that? Like I said, it's written by amateurs.
These days, I only play skirmish games because they don't require me to pain nearly as many models. Most kill teams require less than a dozen models. For something like ACW or Napoleonics, you need hundred of models for rank and file games. I'm just not up for painting that many models any more. I would rather play something like Commands & Colors: Napoleonics than mess with it.
All skirmish for me. On tabletop, I've only been playing BattleTech (Total War and Alpha Strike) over the last two years, usually with 4-12 units per side.
Greetings!
I am definitely a fan of Bolt Action. So, skirmish-game style it is. The Rank & File games I can appreciate, though the interests of storage space for myself is a somewhat limiting factor. I do well having a dedicated hobby workshop, and a game-table for Bolt Action games. Creating an even larger game table for a Rank & File game--and dedicating God-knows how much shelf and storage space for large, Rank & File armies, plus appropriate terrain, just has me feeling ambivalent about getting into a Rank & File Historical wargame. Bolt Action itself, being a World War II Skirmish Wargame, takes up plenty of time, effort, and storage space as it is. *Laughing*
Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
A skirmish game I've also played recently is called CORE mech warfare.
It's actually Gundam. They even say that Japanese 1:144 scale mech models are good choices. The weapons certainly imply Gundams eithe things like beam rifles and beam sabers as choices.
The idea of using wood blocks as units has got me looking for rules that use them.
Hell, you could just use Jenga as your base by just getting blue and green Painters Tape and writing "archers" and such on the tape.
I found one set of rules that are free called Block Battles Sengoku on Wargame Vault (the wargame half of DriveThru RPG).
Free 1st Edition Block Battles Sengoku (https://www.wargamevault.com/m/product/399851)
Games like this are more my style.
I'm even thinking about making my own wargame using some RPG rules I like that involve more than just killing. Basically, a roll that uses margin-of-Success to push, stun, damage enemies.
Quote from: weirdguy564 on March 10, 2025, 03:03:57 PMThe idea of using wood blocks as units has got me looking for rules that use them.
Hell, you could just use Jenga as your base by just getting blue and green Painters Tape and writing "archers" and such on the tape.
I frequently use wooden bases for minis, but without the minis. I apply colored temporary labels to them to designate the unit. Works great, no expensive minis, and easy to build any army you like. You can't take that kind of setup to miniature wargaming events, but if you're more interested in gaming with your friends than in the miniatures/modeling/painting side of things then it's a great approach.