Quote from: kryyst;359212The Wii does have good games on it.  Just not to the same core that 360 and PS3 deliver.  Inovation is also more then just waggle controls.  There are some Wii games that I can only ever imagine playing on Wii.  Boom Blox, Ghostbusters, Res4, Metroid, exercise games and a few party games.  They hugely benefit from the Wii Motion controls and were made to take advantage of the Wii's abilities not just ported to it.  That's a big difference.

Other games like No More Heroes - which is a good game.  The Wii motion controls don't help the game they just substitute for a button mash.

I like my Wii, it has it's purposes.  But I picked up a 360 because overall it's just got more engaging games.  But it really depends on what you are looking for.

That was one of my points. Games made with the Wii controls in mind seem to work fine. They just tend to be games I have no interest in. But any of the games I do like that get ported over just don't jibe from a control aspect. The Wii does have it's uses, but to declare it the King of Consoles, as KrakaJak did, is a bit ridiculous.

Quote from: IMLegend;359200I don't think anything "forced" (other than maybe a down economy in general) MS and Sony to monetize there platforms in other ways. I'm betting these were planned years ago and just coming to fruition recently. They were always intended to be multimedia machines.

That's my thought as well. I can't imagine they make more from selling multimedia than they do from selling games.

Seanchai

Quote from: IMLegend;359191The Wii outsells the other consoles because it appeals to a bigger demographic than the others, as well as being cheaper. It's not limited to the general "males aged 10-35" or whatever. People (and I'm talking general public here, not those who game regularly) think "Oh this will be great for the whole family. We can go bowling and never leave the house", or "Oh, that Wii fit will help me lose that pesky 15 pounds I've been working on". Those aren't the only buyers, but they expand the base quite a bit. That sure as hell does not make it a better machine for straight up gaming. Or a better supported machine for that matter. I still believe that among gamers, the 360 is considered more of a "standard" by which others are measured.

Dude, I'm not accusing you (or anyone) to be anything. I'm talking about my general experience around Internet: if it doesn't fit you, then assume I'm not referring to you. Sorry if I gave that impression, that's not what I meant. English is not my native language.

I agree with you, though, that most Wii ports suck gorilla balls, and I usually only buy games designed for the Wii. And again, I agree with you on the main reason for the Wii success being that is cheaper and easier to play with another persons in the same living room (casual gamers don't care too much about online gaming, I think). I feel that both PS3 and Xbox fail to acknowledge the importance of developing more games that you can play with your girlfriend or your friends when they come at your place, while the Wii has more titles oriented to that.

Finally, when I used the word loser I meant this: I have found that hardcore gamers often take as a personal offense that their favourite system (tha many times is worshipped fervently) is brutally outsold by a system that packs far less punch (technicaly speaking) and its played by a wider range of persons. In terms of sales, hardcore gamers perceive that they have lost to the Wii and this seems to enrage them. Again, I was not talking about you, so my apologies if I gave that impression.

Quote from: IMLegend;359217That was one of my points. Games made with the Wii controls in mind seem to work fine. They just tend to be games I have no interest in. But any of the games I do like that get ported over just don't jibe from a control aspect. The Wii does have it's uses, but to declare it the King of Consoles, as KrakaJak did, is a bit ridiculous.

King of Consoles is all about perspective.  It's king in terms of sales.  That's fact.  It's not a statement of quality to the unit or the games available for it.  The same argument circles with D&D.  Is it the best RPG ever, well best in terms of sales absolutely, best in terms of play...thats an opinion.  Obviously the fact that it's selling so well has something to do with a simple fact that some of those people do like it.  They aren't buying it out of spite.

So as far as the Wii goes yeah in some respects it is definitely the King of Consoles.  Can it compare game for game against the 360/PS3, well no.  But that doesn't in anyway negate it's validity.

Quote from: Seanchai;359230That's my thought as well. I can't imagine they make more from selling multimedia than they do from selling games.
 
Seanchai

The majority of early PS3 purchasers bought it strictly for a Blu-Ray player. Game attach rates are still really low for that console. Things are starting to look better for Sony though. Especially now that they have advertisements that don't have crying porcelean (sp?) baby dolls in them.
 
 

QuoteFinally, when I used the word loser I meant this: I have found that hardcore gamers often take as a personal offense that their favourite system (tha many times is worshipped fervently) is brutally outsold by a system that packs far less punch (technicaly speaking) and its played by a wider range of persons.

Yes, the hardcore gamer has been relegated to the vocal minority. Although speaking as an Old-School gamer, we called the current definition of hardcore gamers 'casual'. The guys who only play GTA and MoWar with there preference of cool cutscenes over gameplay were considered the 'casual' players in my day...
 

QuoteThat was one of my points. Games made with the Wii controls in mind seem to work fine.

I just wanted to make mention that there are plenty of Wii games that use regular dPad/button controls with no waggle or pointing to speak of.
 

QuoteThe Wii outsells the other consoles because it appeals to a bigger demographic than the others, as well as being cheaper.

The Wii is not cheaper than the 360, they're the same price ($200 for an 360 Arcade, $200 for the Wii). You're right that it appeals to a broader demographic though.

I think the 360 has won this console generation, hands down in fact. The 3 is dead. Wii appeals to completely different people and isnt really part of this generation anyway.

Quote from: KrakaJak;359273The majority of early PS3 purchasers bought it strictly for a Blu-Ray player.

Right. Which is different than selling multimedia, such as downloadable TV shows. I don't doubt that when faced with a choice between buying a standalone a Blu-Ray player or a PS3, folks went with the PS3.

I have a PS3 and an Xbox 360, however, and the PS3 not suffering from just a dearth of game. Compared to the multimedia content on XBox's Marketplace, there's nothing in the Playstation Store.

Seanchai

I think it is odd that people say the PS3 is dead. I know almost as many people with a PS3 and they buy the same new games the 360 gets all the time. To me, it is literally the same shit.

Quote from: Cranewings;359438I think it is odd that people say the PS3 is dead. I know almost as many people with a PS3 and they buy the same new games the 360 gets all the time. To me, it is literally the same shit.

It is, really (dead that is, not odd). The ps3 is a better machine: it has better functionality and isn't built like a piece of shit like the M$ machine. Beyond that it's just not as slick in its interface; as has been mentioned the store is rubbish filled with rubbish. Though the games libraries are largely identical and though it's pure opinion as to whether one console's exclusives are best, the 3 just isn't cutting the mustard. Uncharted 2 is a technical feat that has been unequalled (i bet even ME2 isn't as technially impressive). But it's also a tired shooting game that lasts about 10 hours. I personally am not prepared to pay for gaming experiences like that. TBF it's not much different on the 360 - and you have to line M$'s pockets to access content you already own (ie play online) - and hope your console doesn't expire prematurely.

It's just poor show all round; no console is the real winner it's just the 3 failed IMO. Sony just haven't a clue these days, yet I remember the ps2 in the glory days (despite its rocky beginnings). Nothing could touch it. Now console gaming is homgenous, bland, and shallow.

Maybe i should buy Warhammer 3e. Having sold my ps3 i can now just about afford it!

Quote from: Imperator;359251Dude, I'm not accusing you (or anyone) to be anything. I'm talking about my general experience around Internet: if it doesn't fit you, then assume I'm not referring to you. Sorry if I gave that impression, that's not what I meant. English is not my native language.

I agree with you, though, that most Wii ports suck gorilla balls, and I usually only buy games designed for the Wii. And again, I agree with you on the main reason for the Wii success being that is cheaper and easier to play with another persons in the same living room (casual gamers don't care too much about online gaming, I think). I feel that both PS3 and Xbox fail to acknowledge the importance of developing more games that you can play with your girlfriend or your friends when they come at your place, while the Wii has more titles oriented to that.

Finally, when I used the word loser I meant this: I have found that hardcore gamers often take as a personal offense that their favourite system (tha many times is worshipped fervently) is brutally outsold by a system that packs far less punch (technicaly speaking) and its played by a wider range of persons. In terms of sales, hardcore gamers perceive that they have lost to the Wii and this seems to enrage them. Again, I was not talking about you, so my apologies if I gave that impression.

My apologies then if I was overly defensive. Perhaps this place has jaded me a bit. I'm beginning to almost expect personal attacks. And I do concede the bit about girlfriends/friends being able to share a game as opposed to watching someone play an FPS for example. Snoozefest. I guess I see the Wii as almost a different animal than a 360 or PS3. It's kind of apples and oranges, or maybe oranges and grapefruits.
Based on your definition of loser, I can see where my opinions could seem to fall into that category. However, my dislike for the Wii stems from the fact that I would like to like it. I really would, it just doesn't fit me and the kinds of games I prefer. Thus I feel let down and dissapointed, more than feeling like I've been beaten.

Quote from: IMLegend;359708My apologies then if I was overly defensive. Perhaps this place has jaded me a bit. I'm beginning to almost expect personal attacks. And I do concede the bit about girlfriends/friends being able to share a game as opposed to watching someone play an FPS for example. Snoozefest. I guess I see the Wii as almost a different animal than a 360 or PS3. It's kind of apples and oranges, or maybe oranges and grapefruits.
Based on your definition of loser, I can see where my opinions could seem to fall into that category. However, my dislike for the Wii stems from the fact that I would like to like it. I really would, it just doesn't fit me and the kinds of games I prefer. Thus I feel let down and dissapointed, more than feeling like I've been beaten.

No problem, I can see perfectly why you think that way. And I agree that the Wii is a different design aiming for a different experience than the other consoles. For me, that's the reason of its sales success.

Most Wii games are not for me, but I think they got something when they realized the importance of gaming face to face with the other people. Games like the Rayman Raving Rabbids are proof of that (I love them, by the way); people will choose to give a try at a game like those, or Mario Kart, with simple graphs and gameplay. Though I prefer my Xbox or my PC for gaming, the Wii allows me to share that with the missus, which is cool. Most Wii games I wouldn't look at them, but the few that do interest me are quite fun. And you're spot on on how the games designed with the Wiimote in mind work really well, while the others suck badly and long.

Curiously, the same thing you describe about the Wii happened to me when I tried the PS3 with Metal Gear 4. Until I tried the Uncharted games, which I found insanely fun, I wouldn' even consider the PS3 for the same very reasons.