Quote from: Daddy Warpig;506156I agree. A strangely structured RPG, but clearly an RPG. Opinions otherwise border on nuttiness. Moving the thread was an odd decision.

(Wait, isn't now when I'm supposed to get mad? Rage against the dying of freedom on the boards, vent contumely against the person of the Pundit, demand he do exactly what I want or he's just as evil as those other evil bastards on those other evil sites? That sounds like too much work. I decline.)

I understand Pundit's joke here (well, at least I hope he did the move as a form of a joke ), but it's needless fuel for the critics of RPG.site.

Quote from: Rincewind1;506161I understand Pundit's joke here (well, at least I hope he did the move as a form of a joke ), but it's fuel for the critics of RPG.site.

There is a joke involved, but Pundit himself is quite serious.

I thought you'd sloped off after being caught in a lie. Now, that's what i call a joke.

Quote from: Rincewind1;506161I understand Pundit's joke here (well, at least I hope he did the move as a form of a joke ), but it's needless fuel for the critics of RPG.site.

No joke involved. It may or may not be a "storygame" (I'm not who to judge that) but its clearly not an RPG if it breaks down in some of the most fundamental points of what an RPG is about and for.

RPGPundit

Quote from: One Horse Town;506181I thought you'd sloped off after being caught in a lie. Now, that's what i call a joke.

A lie implies intent to deceive.

Indeed it does, my good fellow. Indeed it does.

Well, it's ignorance then rather then lying, at best.

Quote from: One Horse Town;506201Indeed it does, my good fellow. Indeed it does.

Therefore no lie. An unintentional contradiction, fine. Daddy Warpig wins a point in teh gr8 interwebz war. Since i'm not interested in the war, he can have it.

Quote from: two_fishes;506210Daddy Warpig wins a point in teh gr8 interwebz war. Since i'm not interested in the war, he can have it.

What? Whoah! Don't drag me into this.

I wasn't trying to score a point. I just remembered that someone had claimed genre emulation.

I went back to re-read the thread, looking for who said it. I didn't know it was you. But it was.

Genre emulation was advanced as a defense of the mechanic, at least twice. (You, Peregrin.) So 1HT was perfectly on-topic to contradict that claim.

That's all I meant to establish. Which I did. It wasn't meant as, nor was it, a point against you.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;506224What? Whoah! Don't drag me into this.

I wasn't trying to score a point. I just remembered that someone had claimed genre emulation.

I went back to re-read the thread, looking for who said it. I didn't know it was you. But it was.

Genre emulation was advanced as a defense of the mechanic, at least twice. (You, Peregrin.) So 1HT was perfectly on-topic to contradict that claim.

That's all I meant to establish. Which I did. It wasn't meant as, nor was it, a point against you.

You better take a side, or else. We need no dissenters to break the line here.

This...is just fucking EPIC!

Quote from: Rincewind1;505182It's just cunts like you who claim it to be the God On Earth of RPGs

I did?

I don't remember saying that. Do you have any links?

Quote from: Rincewind1;505182And yes, I do consider it a RPG, and a decent one, except that whole "Thou Shall Play As Written" attitude

Yeah, didn't come across in your post for some reason. Go figure.

Quote from: Rincewind1;505205Fair enough indeed - as I said, I liked AW before I read Forge's commentary on it.

You do realize that this makes you the very definition of a pretentious hipster, don't you? How are other people's opinions more important than your OWN in what you like?

Quote from: Peregrin;505296If you've ever listened to Crane and Sorenson's "Game Design is Mind Control" talk,

Oooh yeah, THAT'LL go over well here

Quote from: Benoist;505304What I'm going to do instead is post about stuff like "how to make a Cthulhu adventure that isn't a railroad" at some point.

Excellent, because the main rulebook doesn't exactly provide a lot of guidance on this.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;505358Let's cut out all the back and forth and just go to the damn text. Even if we disagree on interpretations, these are real quotes from the real game.

Hmm, seems reasonable...

Quote from: Apocalypse WorldIt's not, for instance, your agenda to make the players lose, or to deny them what they want, or to punish them, or to control them, or to get them through your pre-planned storyline (DO NOT pre-plan a storyline, and I'm not fucking around).

It's not your job to put their characters in double-binds or dead ends, or to yank the rug out from under their feet. Go chasing after any of those, you'll wind up with a boring game that makes Apocalypse World seem contrived,

OK, lets say that the line has been crossed, and these are unreasonable demands to make to a GM who should have the power to decide what their agenda is. I for one know that I would NOT willingly play in a game where any of the opposite agendas held true, yet I have sadly participated in games where their presence wasn't made clear to me either by the rules or by the GM.

Honestly, does anyone find these rules to be unreasonable? Really? How exactly are they cramping the GM's style, or limiting their ability to create setting and character?

Quote from: Rincewind1;505388Of course, if you don't like the genius of AW, you must be a fanatic of Anti - Swine crusade, and not just spite pretentious story games, while still enjoying the good ones.

I'll bet you that if you ever did share your GMing advice that it would be very similar to the advice given in Apocalypse World, with the difference being that somehow you're not a pretentious hipster.

But seriously, bullet point what you do and do not do as a GM so we can see.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;505401Sex is a unique part of the setting, embedding it in a special character bonus makes it something that impacts all the character's choices. To use it or not. If you do, how to deal with the consequences. That's far more interesting than just sex.

Apparently, if you replace the word psychic maelstrom with sex it's just as correct. Weird.

Quote from: One Horse Town;505406I hazard a guess that sex isn't a resource. Salt, sure. Diodes? Absolutely. Fuck, wet-wipes. Perhaps.

You don't get out much, do you?

Quote from: Peregrin;505423Relationships and sex in a world where your options are limited is definitely a driving force behind some subplots in The Walking Dead.

ARE YOU CRAZY!?!?!?! Zombies and Post Apoc are like TOTALLY different genres!

Quote from: BWA;505429A lot of people seem really upset about the fact that sex is a part of AW's rules.

Cause it's ICKY! >_<

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;505432That's gotta be a crime against sex itself. Sex should be sexy. (Not rape, not perversion, but sex.) Otherwise, what's the point?

You don't get out much do...

wait, I already used that one. Instead I'll just leave a link to The Walking Eye Actual Play Podcast.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;505436Both of these are hypotheticals, BTW.

Ya don't say. Coulda fooled me.

Quote from: One Horse Town;505446Let's get back to genre emulation, or lack of.

Because that is after all the premise of the thread.

No wait, it's the only point about this mess you were capable of arguing. Then by all means don't let me stop you

Quote from: Rincewind1;505830There was a dozen of words usable here, such as "magnifies", or perhaps "siphons" or "convey".

No. Those words are NOT synonyms for 'channel'. Also if you think the word 'channel' is pretentious...

...seriously, I can't think of a good metaphor for the level of crazy that is.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;505832I apologize, I didn't mean to vilify Kabuki.

This, is fucking hilarious, and is so going into a Dying Earth game

I think you are taking your offense waaaay too seriously though. Regardless, this thread becomes a HELL of a lot more fun when you imagine all the posters as Kabuki characters, trying to vilify each other.

Quote from: silva;506059You criticize the game for asking the reader to play strictly by the rules? That's it ?

Yes.

Quote from: two_fishes;506079In other words, the author and/or some friends of the author said something on the internet that made you mad so you don't like his game anymore.

Yes.

Quote from: RPGPundit;506080This thread is moved to "other games", since it is not discussing an RPG.

...

...bhwHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Quote from: RPGPundit;506082the type of "story" they're creating isn't really what 90% of the literary world would consider meaningful story.

So what? The situation is still far worse with traditional games and their linear adventures. But why do traditional games have so many adventures of that kind anyway? Seriously, it's endemic. There should be a rule against it.

Quote from: Benoist;506083What needs to happen isn't to castrate GMs even more and trap them in a structural clusterfuck of rules and procedures right out the gate.

So which set of RPG rules do this the 'least'?

Quote from: Rincewind1;506098"A good GM will  make the best even of worst of rules".

So why doesn't anyone ever say "A good player will make the best even of worst of rules"? No really, I wanna know.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;506224What? Whoah! Don't drag me into this.

Dude, you volunteered for the war the minute you started posting on theRPGsite. But stay focused soldier, and you'll make it through.

TL;DR version for those who want to save themselves their time:

I am better then you.

Putting words into my mouth, Chaosvoyager says:

Quote from: chaosvoyager;506268"Sex is a unique part of the setting, embedding it in a special character bonus makes it something that impacts all the character's choices. To use it or not. If you do, how to deal with the consequences. That's far more interesting than just sex."

Apparently, if you replace the word psychic maelstrom with sex it's just as correct. Weird.

That's a one sentence fail. Here's the one sentence: "Sex is a unique part of the setting."

Now, correct me if my biology is off, but humans reproduce through sex. Right? Intercourse, sperm, egg, implantation, gestation, birth? That's actually still how it works, right?

So, and follow this closely, any campaign world featuring humans is, by default, unless explicitly stated otherwise, featuring a species that reproduces by sex.

So, once again follow me closely here, sex cannot be a unique part of AW's setting. Which is your claim.

It's a part of every setting with humans, so can't be unique to AW.

Quote from: chaosvoyager;506268Sex is a unique part of the setting.

One. Sentence. Fail.

OTOH, the psychic maelstrom is (fairly) unique to the AW setting, and very under-described, and could do with some fleshing out. Hence my suggestion, to actually flesh out the unique aspect of the setting.

But you couldn't deal with that suggestion on a substantive basis, could you? You had to try and get clever. And in so doing, launched yourself into a One Sentence Fail.

The other snippets of quotes from me fail for much the same reason.

Quote from: chaosvoyager;506268seems reasonable

No, it actually was reasonable. But that wouldn't give you the chance to snark. That said snark was pointless and stupid... well, that's just your fault.

Quote from: chaosvoyager;506268Instead I'll just leave a link to The Walking Eye Actual Play Podcast.

So what? Other people in this thread (and in an earlier thread), defenders of the game, have already cited how the sex mechanic turned sex into boring game-speke. (Others, like DS, disagreed. I read their comments, too.) I was commenting on their reports of their own games.

But, apparently, they must be wrong. Because, you know, podcast.

Quote from: chaosvoyager;506268Dude, you volunteered for the war

The war of calling two_fishes a liar? Because that's what I was talking about.

How did I volunteer for the war of calling him a liar, just by posting on the site? The claim is idiotic.

I never called him a liar, never imputed or implied he was one. So, again, this is a One Sentence Fail.

That's four times you quoted me, each time you either misquoted me,  avoided talking about the substance of my position, or both. Next time, drop the superiority complex and deal with the substantive issue. Or don't include me at all.

Quote from: chaosvoyager;506268This...is just fucking EPIC!

Man, sometimes I miss a "like this post" button.

Quote from: chaosvoyager;506268So which set of RPG rules do this the 'least'?

You mean the least GM castration? I think I'd nominate OD&D (1974) for that, partly by design, and partly by accident and/or tradition (like the fact that it's linked to Chainmail and basically is predicated on the notion you will act as a wargames referee and house rule the game as you go).