Jong, the Chick and I all went to see the movie Elizabeth last night.  Shit, what an absolutely brilliant demonstration that movie made of how England saved the world, and what giants its men of that time were: Drake, Raleigh, Dee, Walsingham, and of course Elizabeth herself.

England was the only thing that stood against the coming of a new Papist dark age.   Its nice to see a film that makes no qualms about telling it like it was, for once.

RPGPundit

Isn´t Walter Raleigh´s role totally overblown, "he killed Drake and took his stuff!" !

Yes, the movie wanted Raleigh to be the great explorer, love interest of the Queen, AND the great warrior all at once. Historically, of course, it was Drake who was the scourge of the Spanish ships.

But I'm willing to concede this bit of artistic license, they still made Drake really cool; like Jong said: "he only shows up for five minutes and he still manages to steal the movie".

Anyways, Raleigh is a hero all by himself; he went to the new world, and he brought Tobacco to western civilization!

RPGPundit

Drake was little more than an officially sanctioned pirate wasn't he?

Anyhow, nice that we saved the world. Those were the days...

Quote from: RPGPundit...and what giants its men of that time were: Drake, Raleigh, Dee, Walsingham, and of course Elizabeth herself.

I could be mistaken, but wasn't Elizabeth a woman?




Oh, c'mon!  You know someone was dying to make that comment.  Doofus remarks aside, I've been very interested in Elizabeth.  I'm glad to hear that it'll be worth taking in.

!i!

She's a man, baby!  

Elizabeth may have had the body of a weak and feeble woman, but she had the heart of a King... and an English one at that!

RPGPundit

And the stomach of a concrete elephant!

Not so sure about England being the only thing that stood against a Papal Dark Age - the Dutch might have a few things to say about that and although they received English help it was as often a hinderance.

Quote from: NiallSAnd the stomach of a concrete elephant!

Not so sure about England being the only thing that stood against a Papal Dark Age - the Dutch might have a few things to say about that and although they received English help it was as often a hinderance.

Without a doubt, the Dutch were of critical importance in their guerilla war against Spain; they practically bankrupted the Spanish state (that, and the sinking of the Armada).  But the Dutch were basically a rebel army, not a state, and England's resistance was key to inspire the whole protestant world.

RPGPundit

I liked it, though it was a bit messianic in style, a wee bit overblown.

And the actress certainly didn't look in her fifties, which Elizabeth I was at the time of the sinking of the Armada.

Looking at her in history, while full credit goes for standing up against Spain and establishing the Anglican church, I think it was wrong of her not to marry and provide an heir, or at least to decree one. A good leader provides for their country not only today but after them. Her failure to provide an heir by childbirth or by her decree certainly strengthened her personal power at the time, but could lead to chaos after her death. She knew that there was only James V of the Scots, but that Phillip of Spain would consider himself to have a claim; he'd been married to her predecessor Mary, and had sought marriage with her, and been basically told by the Pope to go take the throne of England.

This is a common sort of fault in absolute monarchs and dictators, to be so jealous of their own power that they fail to provide for a successor, so that the country has a prosperous time while they rule, but has trouble thereafter.

Quote from: RPGPunditAnyways, Raleigh is a hero all by himself; he went to the new world, and he brought Tobacco to western civilization!
RPGPundit

Heh - reminds me of my favorite Smothers Brothers bit.

Dick:  Tommy how can you say you're sore at the Indians for Custer?  The Indians helped us, the Indians saved us at Plymouth Rock.  They gave us food, they gave us shelter, they gave us tobacco...

Tommy:  Oh, yeah...they knew what they were doin'.  "White man smokum peace pipe with tobacco in....Rot your lungs!  We got a cart and a cartload out her for ya kid!"

Between that and Slithery D, they had me in stitches as a child.

Quote from: CallousShe's a man, baby!  

I love it when some silliness makes me laugh out loud.  Thanks.

Pete