Quote from: Elliot Wilen;243484The rehash of the poison'd controversy, and the "what's a swine game" put a cherry on top of it all.

I suspect Kyle may be onto something about the political stuff; at least it seems to have sapped the productive energy of the boards.

I'm less productive than usual due to a new campaign starting up, a new job and various serious family medical issues. Normality is starting to return, and the Dawnlands thread already has a new epic destiny up on it as a result. I have no interest in the Yankwank in November, so I'll be back up to speed within a week or two, I expect.

I gotta just ask, let me get this straight... I walked away 6 years ago from the industry, never really got on any web-forums or anything.. Peaked back in around 2005 for a few weeks and left again and here I am now ... and the same stuff and the same (please excuse) "snarky rhetoric" that sparked up back in 1997 and flamed up with GNS Theory is still going on? Is it always this much, or this as Kyle said, just an uptick and I happened to come back in the middle of one?
 
I remember original Three-Fold back in Usenet in the late 90's and how it was easily applied to any kind of game (did you tell a good story that everyone enjoyed, was their a challenge that was fair and balanced, and was the stuff you did proper for the gameworld you were running/playing in?). I walked away in '02 after my own company went dumbsizing the game I was just brought on to support and shot themselves in the foot to get a TV deal that never materialized. I came back in '05 and found the whole trad vs. indie thing going as strong as ever and even nastier in how it was debated...
 
So here I am today, I'm seeing some of this over at rpg.net and here (which are about the only places I've really been for RPG in the several weeks that I decided to come back and have a look around so to speak)... is this going on everywhere or do you guys believe this is something just localized or just a temporary upswing? I've briefly read up on the "new" stuff this Big Model thing and Immersion and ... wow. Some of it is just common sense, some of it seems like lots of wordy stuff to make RPG's into an artform or make them more socially acceptable to Ivy Leaguers so it can be talked about at college debates more academically. Some good stuff in there to be sure, but the presentation ... it reminds me of all the flame-war GNS stuff just expanded with more academic terms...
 
Anyway, I'm too old and not stupid enough (or is that smart enough) to just walk away again... I'm out of the industry and this is just hobby now (the game I'm working on is a freebie these days per the original designer's wishes) so it's not like I can take it all that personal any more...
 
But still, seriously, anybody able to tell me anything about where all this stuff stands these days? I'd love a third-party "state of affairs" quick summary without the whole "its evil, no your evil" thing... I've read through some of Pundit's stuff but I don't have that much time ...
 
So does anyone have a quickie one-two paragraph (this is generally the accepted here is what is going on) summary of where things are after the last six years?
 
-- Signed, back but still lost!

It's like the Heisenberg principle, I'm afraid. Or maybe Gödel's paradox. Any attempt to "sum up" the debates is just going to cause more debate, so you can't really sum it up.

It's really not as bad as it was back then, though.

himsati, fucked if I know. Who cares? Post your own stuff about rpgs along the lines of your interests. That other shit? Swamp it with your own.

There's no rpg war, no Swine War - but damnit, there is a war between the fucksticks who aren't really that interested in rpgs and just want to talk politics or some other bullshit, and the right-thinking gamers who game and want to talk about it.

And this is a war whose ammunition is threads. Make more ammo against the boring non-gamers! Swamp their GNS, US politics bullshit with game talk!

THIS MEANS WAR!

Okay, first: Sett, what the fuck?

Second: War?  War?!  Wars get people fucking killed.  They fuck up the survivors and they fuck up economies.  There is no goddamn "war" between Ron Edwards and The Pundit or trad and indie or dice and no dice.  At most, it's a stupid damn internet tiff -- and at that, it's one that wouldn't even fucking exist if there weren't sticks irrevocably jammed up certain asses.  This "Oooh, there's a SWINE WAR!!!!" shit is really fucking pissing me off, and as much as I ignore it, I'm getting damn tired of the fact that I have to.

Third: Nothing I say will change anything.

Quote from: Elliot Wilen;243526Any attempt to "sum up" the debates is just going to cause more debate, so you can't really sum it up.

You know it, baby.

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;243527And this is a war whose ammunition is threads. Make more ammo against the boring non-gamers! Swamp their GNS, US politics bullshit with game talk!

THIS MEANS WAR!

You mean we have to invade their territory (OT) with gaming talk ? Threadcrap about gaming....on a gaming site :hmm:

Regards,
David R

Quote from: David R;243597You mean we have to invade their territory (OT) with gaming talk ? Threadcrap about gaming....on a gaming site :hmm:

Well, I was thinking more like starting threads in the roleplaying subforums, as I did today.

But hey, derailing threads in Off Topic with rpg talk works, too. "Did you notice McCain and Palin look like those two characters on Battlestar Galactica? Is this a crossover from a parallel universe? Let's run it as a scenario."

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;243613But hey, derailing threads in Off Topic with rpg talk works, too. "Did you notice McCain and Palin look like those two characters on Battlestar Galactica? Is this a crossover from a parallel universe? Let's run it as a scenario."

This is known as "The Koltar Maneuver".  I'm starting to practice it as well.

Quote from: walkerp;243621This is known as "The Koltar Maneuver".  I'm starting to practice it as well.

Ooh....I like that.

No really - sometimes a decent idea is inspired by the stupid shit in Off Topic. When I spot one of those possibilitities I try to start a thread up in the RPG section.


- Ed C.

If nothing else, threads like this help illuminate folks new to the board the varied posters here; while some are very strident and terrible, there are also reasonable and interesting voices, too. Just have to strain your ears to hear over the hobo on the corner screaming obscenities mixed with bible verse.

As for the US election... yeah, probably. Every four years all my friends online piss me off and I start skimming a lot more. Left, right, nearly every poster talking about politics in the US is really fucking annoying and willfully blind, one way or another.

Quote from: Settembrini;242969I firmly believe TonyLB´s recent threadstarts are abusing this site, to promote and generate interest into Games that do not correspond to the Landmarks of theRPGsite. He´s not only WILLFULLY IGNORING the debates HE PARTICIPTAED in, about the VERY SAME ISSUES, he´s also just asking things so that he can inject names and links.

I firmly believe that you are a troll and a drama queen and are only posting this thread because you need attention.

Why I took your swine ass off of my ignore list I will never know. But you are going back on.

Quote from: Koltar;243627No really - sometimes a decent idea is inspired by the stupid shit in Off Topic.

And sometimes you use the RPG forum as a lame ass means to voice your Off Topic opinions.

!i!

This

Quote from: Dr Rotwang!;243574Okay, first: Sett, what the fuck?

Second: War?  War?!  Wars get people fucking killed.  They fuck up the survivors and they fuck up economies.  There is no goddamn "war" between Ron Edwards and The Pundit or trad and indie or dice and no dice.  At most, it's a stupid damn internet tiff -- and at that, it's one that wouldn't even fucking exist if there weren't sticks irrevocably jammed up certain asses.  This "Oooh, there's a SWINE WAR!!!!" shit is really fucking pissing me off, and as much as I ignore it, I'm getting damn tired of the fact that I have to.

Third: Nothing I say will change anything.

and this

Quote from: Mike S.;243922I firmly believe that you are a troll and a drama queen and are only posting this thread because you need attention.

Why I took your swine ass off of my ignore list I will never know. But you are going back on.

I can only add