Quote from: beeberand could this please be moved to off topic?  really. . . .:rolleyes:

This is pretty funny considering that this thread was started to complain about the thread-police moving people's threads on another forum.

Quote from: JonAPedantic corrections from someone who thinks removing the g from the end of a  verb makes him look cool.

It's not meant to convey coolness, it's meant to convey the feel of everyday speech, I think this fits best for a forum discussing rpgs.

Quote from: JonANice to see you're still an ignorant twat Jim. This thread seems to be primarily made up of posts berating the split on RPGnet and my posts were pertinent to that. So please. Stop trying to be the hard man of the internet from your little basement. It really is pathetic.

You see? Isn't it refreshing to be able to speak plainly, without having to find some more sneaky way to get your anger across? Here, where you can freely call people on their bullshit - it's rather refreshing, isn't it? Stepping out of the damp and dingy claustrophobic basement of rpg discussion, into a freer air. Sometimes the breeze is rather nippy, but that's the price you pay for being in the fresh air and open, so pull up your collar and mix among the common crowd, it's a rough one but a happy one.

But be careful, though - sometimes at rpg.net you can get moderated for things you say to people on other websites. Of course, you will always be welcomed here. RPGPundit will probably attack you for no reason and try to drive you away, as he did Cessna. But I'd hope that you'd take heart from the rest of us telling him not to be a cocksmock, as we did then.

Cheer up, mate, it could be worse. At least no-one here's called you Welsh yet.

Quote from: hgjsThis is pretty funny considering that this thread was started to complain about the thread-police moving people's threads on another forum.

Eh, I guess.  Forum organization is a good thing.

Quote from: C.W.RichesonEh, I guess.  Forum organization is a good thing.

thanks, man.  that's all i'm asking

Quote from: JonAI am glad you're here actually Walker as I was in the process of replying to your thread in TT when the server went for a burton. Luckily I realised something was up so copied and pasted my reply and saved it to post when the site comes back up. But I'll do it here now to save me the bother. Hopefully Pundit and the rest of you don't mind.

Mind?? Certainly not. I think its astonishingly brave of you to be here. Of course, here is where we see if you're brave enough to actually address the actual questions people bring up to you: this isn't Trouble Tickets where you can just give a cheap quick answer and then close the thread and thus all opportunity for debate.

QuoteYes because I happened to have just come online at the time. You can't click your fingers and expect a staff member to appear out of thin air.

That's fair enough.

QuoteNow hang on. I haven't closed your threads. I've not edited them. I've not blasted them from existence. They continue to exist for anyone to post to. That isn't censorship. That is thread management in line with the forum structure. You are quite welcome to say what you want (within the rules) in the right forum. D20 as a forum may have a lot of threads (alright all of them) in which D20 games are discussed from a position of appreciation but we have at no time ever said you have to be complimentary or supportive of the D20 games discussed in the forum. If you want to post a thread announcing why you do not like D20 games then have at it - but it will still go into the D20 forum.

Then why the fuck wasn't Darren told that about the D&D thread he moved over INTO Open just because he wanted it to get more attention from the "right" people than what it had been getting in the D20 Ghetto?

QuoteThose kind of people post in D20 (btw - cold hard numbers which ShannonA can provide indicate that the D20 forum is growing leaps and bounds in readership and posting) are equally as well versed in the industry. In fact it is your belief above which leads to the incorrect statements that RPGnet is making a D20 ghetto. It most certainly is not and the increasing traffic in the forum bear this out.

Then why was Darren so eager to get his thread the fuck out of the forum?

And if its not just a D&D ghetto, why have you put threads about RC or 1e or 2e D&D (which are of course NOT D20) into that forum?

QuoteSorry but... well no. The game may well be a big release but it is still a D20 game, just like its predecessor was and whilst I don't doubt it will sell by the boat load, given the Star Wars tag on it, that still does not change the nature of the game one tiny little bit. D&D is the one, single, biggest and best selling game on the market bar none. If an when a V4 comes out it will be the next big thing. Guess where threads discussing it will go? Assuming the D20 forum still exists then (which the way things look will be highly probable - sorry).

Really? What if 4e wasn't D20? You'd still put it there?

QuoteI am sorry you feel this way Walker. As I said before - I understand your dislike of the new forum but I would ask that you at least respect RPGnet's managements decision to create the forum.

Why should he? Your own modclique members clearly don't.  The only difference is thanks to the double standard, they're allowed to put their D&D-threads on Open while he isn't.

RPGPundit

Quote from: One Horse TownWell, it's back up now, so everyone can piss and moan over there. Oh, hang on...

until they get banned.

which they will.

Surely, if you are going to moderate a site having a thick skin is mandatory?

Quote from: C.W.RichesonEh, I guess.  Forum organization is a good thing.

its a good thing, but the d20 split is stupid... maybe if it was just D&D and other fantasy dirivitives (Iron Heroes, Castles and Crusades, Iron Kindgoms, etc..), then maybe, but as is it stands you have fantasy, super heroes, modern, horror, cyberpunk, wild west, pulp, sci-fi and from games that arent d20 in one forum, and you have fantasy, super heroes, modern, horror, cyberpunk, wild west, pulp, and sci-fi from games that are d20... talk about your department of redundancy department. the whole reason I go to Open is to get ideas, I dont care if a game is d20, BRP, Palladium, or whatnot, if its a Subject Matter Im interested, I can cherry pick out ideas from the threads, but Im not goig to wade through in what in effect is another "open" with the qualifier of what Die it uses to mine for ideas. The only way I go to the d20 forum now is if it shows up in my RSS feed and it looks interesting.

Quote from: RPGPunditMind?? Certainly not. I think its astonishingly brave of you to be here. Of course, here is where we see if you're brave enough to actually address the actual questions people bring up to you: this isn't Trouble Tickets where you can just give a cheap quick answer and then close the thread and thus all opportunity for debate.

Well I will answer those questions as a courtesy and try my best. Although I will mention that I am unlikely to forge a new world where you suddenly see our way of thinking and go "oh - RPGnet isn't that bad afterall, everything they do makes sense and the mods are a decent bunch of people." I very much doubt that day will come. RPGsite and RPGnet are both different beasts with different outlooks on how a gaming forum should run and should co-exists in their own corners of the internet to cater for gamers. I do find it amusing that you and many others here to aggressively posture about how evil RPGnet is and yet on RPGnet people don't do the same about RPGsite because they're not allowed to. It is ironic really and a fine example of why these sites are different and always will be. You won't change us. We won't change you. Move on.

I came here initially to respond to Walkerp due to a computer problem not allowing me to do so in original forum and I noticed he brought the subject up. So as opposed to ignore it I thought I'd give him a response.

QuoteThen why the fuck wasn't Darren told that about the D&D thread he moved over INTO Open just because he wanted it to get more attention from the "right" people than what it had been getting in the D20 Ghetto?

Actually I did wonder over that myself and it was expressed to him backstage. I originally retitled it (based on the suggestions of a number of participants in the thread) because the thread did drift and expand beyond the realms of the original post referencing mythology in D&D to mythology in all fantasy settings. Darren then clarified the re-title. However - Darren shouldn't have made the call on the move himself I agree. Had the thread not gone off D&D and started covering Warhammer, Eberron and various other fantasy worlds then it wouldn't (or shouldn't anyway) be moved. But I will admit that Darren should've left it for other moderator/s to manage that.

QuoteThen why was Darren so eager to get his thread the fuck out of the forum?

You'd have to ask him. As I said - the management of that could've been smoother.

QuoteAnd if its not just a D&D ghetto, why have you put threads about RC or 1e or 2e D&D (which are of course NOT D20) into that forum?

Because the forum is for:

Dungeons & Dragons, d20, and OGL (d20) such as B5, C&C, and M&M.
Plus older versions of AD&D, Basic D&D, and Original D&D.. This is said on the front page of the forums.

Also - the term "ghetto" for a forum which is seeing increasing viewings and postings day on day is becoming less and less valid.

QuoteReally? What if 4e wasn't D20? You'd still put it there?

Yes because it covers Dungeons & Dragons, d20, and OGL (d20) such as B5, C&C, and M&M. Plus older versions of AD&D, Basic D&D, and Original D&D.

QuoteWhy should he? Your own modclique members clearly don't.  The only difference is thanks to the double standard, they're allowed to put their D&D-threads on Open while he isn't.

RPGPundit

As I mentioned the thread expanded beyond dealing with D&D fantasy and mythology to fantasy in general. ShannonA in the threads in TT that if a thread crosses multi-systems, settings and/or genres then it should be posted in Open. The thread in question did expand beyond the setting originally referred to in the original post to other settings outside of the D20 library and thus I can see the logic of the move and re-titling of the thread. But I do think that it should've been handled by someone else than the moderator who created the thread. Whether this would've been acceptable to you or not is not really a concern of mine for the reasons I stated in my first paragraph. You run your forum your way. We run ours our way.

Quote from: JonAThe thread in question did expand beyond the setting originally referred to in the original post to other settings outside of the D20 library

right, it expanded, that wasnt the original goal of the message.  In the SW thread, its goal was to determine SWs impact on the whole  industry/hobby...

Quote from: NYTFLYRright, it expanded, that wasnt the original goal of the message.  In the SW thread, its goal was to determine SWs impact on the whole  industry/hobby...

Which is still a specific thread about a specific game. It really isn't that difficult to comprehend. There is, however,  now a thread in open which is more general about sci-fi licenses and their impact on the hobby (it talks about not just SW but Stargate, Star Trek, BSG, Serenity etc etc).

Anyway. Now RPGnet is back up and running I'll be on my way. I came here to answer Walkerp as a courtesy to him. I've answered the questions leveled by Pundit and now you and I, personally, don't have anything else to say on the matter.

Quote from: JonAI do find it amusing that you and many others here to aggressively posture about how evil RPGnet is and yet on RPGnet people don't do the same about RPGsite because they're not allowed to.

Well here it's all about freedom of speech and all that stuff. More often than not when you read someone bitching about RPGnet you will also find folks defending the site (RPGnet). Mostly though, the majority are tired of the never ending obsession of some of our posters have for tBP.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: David RWell here it's all about freedom of speech and all that stuff. More often than not when you read someone bitching about RPGnet you will also find folks defending the site (RPGnet). Mostly though, the majority are tired of the never ending obsession of some of our posters have for tBP.

Regards,
David R

also if you talk about how evil RPG.net is over there, you will be on the short path to bandom...

of course, he says its funny about not being able to talk badly about TheRPGsite over there... but then he turns around and does something else he's allowed to do over there....

QuoteNice to see you're still an ignorant twat Jim. This thread seems to be primarily made up of posts berating the split on RPGnet and my posts were pertinent to that. So please. Stop trying to be the hard man of the internet from your little basement. It really is pathetic.

Quote from: NYTFLYRalso if you talk about how evil RPG.net is over there, you will be on the short path to bandom...

of course, he says its funny about not being able to talk badly about TheRPGsite over there... but then he turns around and does something else he's allowed to do over there....

Sure, no Mod who has ever come from RPGnet has denied himself the pleasure of spewing out a few PAs. That's okay it's what this site is sometimes about. I was just wondering why he felt he needed to respond to Walkerp...here of all places.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: JonAAnyway. Now RPGnet is back up and running I'll be on my way. I came here to answer Walkerp as a courtesy to him. I've answered the questions leveled by Pundit and now you and I, personally, don't have anything else to say on the matter.

Who was that masked man, Tonto?

Well JonA, I applaud your bravery in coming here, and your attempt to justify/clarify your actions to Walker.

Quote from: JonAI do find it amusing that you and many others here to aggressively posture about how evil RPGnet is and yet on RPGnet people don't do the same about RPGsite because they're not allowed to. It is ironic really and a fine example of why these sites are different and always will be.

I'd like to point out that anyone from RPG.net is welcomed to come here and they will be allowed to aggressively posture about the evil of RPGsite. You are right though, there is irony - If you want to be critical of RPG.net, you have to go to a different forum to talk about it. If you want to be critical of theRPGsite, you can post your criticism right here.

QuoteI came here initially to respond to Walkerp due to a computer problem not allowing me to do so in original forum and I noticed he brought the subject up. So as opposed to ignore it I thought I'd give him a response.

I noticed Walker started a thread in Trouble Tickets and a few people jumped in to talk about the issue of what type of thread belongs in what forum. Unfortunately, Shannon jumped in and locked that TT thread up quickly. It's downright shameful that users can't discuss issues in Trouble Tickets without someone locking the thread.

QuoteActually I did wonder over that myself and it was expressed to him backstage.

Well I'm glad to see someone making at least a little effort standing up and pointing out the hypocrisy and silliness of the situation.

QuoteBecause the forum is for:

Dungeons & Dragons, d20, and OGL (d20) such as B5, C&C, and M&M.
Plus older versions of AD&D, Basic D&D, and Original D&D.. This is said on the front page of the forums.

And the description for open is:

"General discussion about the roleplaying industry and where it's going, and other tabletop RPG topics."

Which still confuses me as to why a thread whose main theme is "How [this d20 game] will affect the industry" needs to get shuffled into d20. To me, the main target for discussion was the industry, rather than a particular game. Key points included marketing strategy and high profile setting licenses. There was little if any intent to discuss the d20 system.

The bottom line is that the author felt it to be open material, and has a pretty damn good reason as to why it's open, so what was really accomplished by moving it, other than upsetting people?

QuoteShannonA in the threads in TT that if a thread crosses multi-systems, settings and/or genres then it should be posted in Open.

Walker specifically started a new thread, and tried to word it properly so that it would meet whatever odd criteria are used, and yet still it got moved, along with a snarky reply. Moving the second thread and locking the TT thread seem like punitive actions rather than anything the least bit beneficial to the site as a whole.

QuoteThe thread in question did expand beyond the setting originally referred to in the original post to other settings outside of the D20 library and thus I can see the logic of the move and re-titling of the thread.

Sounds a lot like Walker's thread.

QuoteYou run your forum your way. We run ours our way.

Unfortunately, by locking threads in TT, the only resort people have to make  criticism about RPG.net is to post them here.