As of recently a slew of cheaply made Chinese products have been revealed to be hazardous to your health: Toothpaste, cough syrup, toys, pet food.

Their response?

"Yeah, well US soybeans are dirty and have bad weeds in em!"

Something about a government acting like a stung six year-old makes me laugh. :haw:

Quote from: JamesVSomething about a government acting like a stung six year-old makes me laugh. :haw:

Which part of "China is still a totalitarian communist government that has put down pro-democracy protestors with lethal force" do people keep forgetting?  Or did I miss the free elections and civil rights reforms?

You'd think they would at least remember the picture of the lone guy and the column of tanks.

By-the-way, contrary to urban myth - that guy is still alive. There was a recent interview with him somewhere in the press.

- Ed C.

Quote from: John MorrowWhich part of "China is still a totalitarian communist government that has put down pro-democracy protestors with lethal force" do people keep forgetting?  Or did I miss the free elections and civil rights reforms?

You didn't miss a thing, I just happen to find this particular reaction funny. Are infantile statements as public relations really a sign of a totalitarian state? Actually makes me want to ponder it. :hmm:

Quote from: JamesVYou didn't miss a thing, I just happen to find this particular reaction funny. Are infantile statements as public relations really a sign of a totalitarian state? Actually makes me want to ponder it. :hmm:

The Computer is no longer your friend citizen. He is taking his ball in with him and says you smell of wee.

Quote from: JamesVAre infantile statements as public relations really a sign of a totalitarian state?

Infantile statements, as public relations, are usually a sign of somebody that is not used to not getting their way, whether it's a spoiled celebrity or a totalitarian state.  Emotional maturity requires learning to deal with being told, "No!"

This isn't just whining, and it's not restricted to totalitarian states. Basically, countries and interest groups use trumped-up quality/safety issues as leverage in trade disputes; this is a sort of shot across the bow against overly punitive American reaction.

Try reading up on the "catfish war" with Vietnam to see how America can be just about as stupid and hypocritical as any other country, when special interests get their way.

While I'm no fan of China's government--and in fact my wife and I deliberately shy away from Chinese food imports--I could easily see the current series of cases being used as an argument for shutting down Chinese imports across the board even where the safety of competing American products is no better regulated. China wants American farmers to know that if there's a trade war, the pain will shared by producers on both sides of the Pacific.

Quote from: Elliot WilenThis isn't just whining, and it's not restricted to totalitarian states. Basically, countries and interest groups use trumped-up quality/safety issues as leverage in trade disputes; this is a sort of shot across the bow against overly punitive American reaction.

Try reading up on the "catfish war" with Vietnam to see how America can be just about as stupid and hypocritical as any other country, when special interests get their way.

While I'm no fan of China's government--and in fact my wife and I deliberately shy away from Chinese food imports--I could easily see the current series of cases being used as an argument for shutting down Chinese imports across the board even where the safety of competing American products is no better regulated. China wants American farmers to know that if there's a trade war, the pain will shared by producers on both sides of the Pacific.

You're not suggestion, Elliot, that the lead paint and the pets dying were trumped up for a trade war, are you?

Or is it that you're saying the soybean response is as valid - that there are serious health/safety problems with the food being sent from the US to chinese markets?

No, I'm saying that the soybean response is no less trumped up than the various excuses used for the protectionist anti-Vietnamese catfish measures. And it's almost certainly a proactive defensive measure against the possibility of American producers using the Chinese product scandals to push for "excessive" measures against Chinese imports. ("Excessive" of course from the perspective of China, but also conceivably from the perspective of American consumers, and not necessarily grounded in reasonable concerns.)

Despite all of the news about these products, I've concluded that warnings and hot air are the only things that will come of it. China and the US have entered a symbiosis of trade and I really don't see anything breaking it at the moment. They need our ag products, we need their manufactured goods. If one side really was trying to wor the other over, I'd think there would be more stories about the alternatives.

This is my favorite comment on the China/US trade relationship:

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/08/12/cnbcs-erin-burnett-we-need-chinas-toxic-food-and-lead-coated-toys-to-keep-economy-strong/

Can you word that any worse?

Quote from: KenHRThis is my favorite comment on the China/US trade relationship:

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/08/12/cnbcs-erin-burnett-we-need-chinas-toxic-food-and-lead-coated-toys-to-keep-economy-strong/

Can you word that any worse?

Sometimes the truth's a hurtin' thing.

Oh, I'm not denying that she had a point to make, nor am I denying it's the truth.  I'm not an idiot.  Just...horrible wording on her part.

Quote from: Elliot WilenNo, I'm saying that the soybean response is no less trumped up than the various excuses used for the protectionist anti-Vietnamese catfish measures. And it's almost certainly a proactive defensive measure against the possibility of American producers using the Chinese product scandals to push for "excessive" measures against Chinese imports. ("Excessive" of course from the perspective of China, but also conceivably from the perspective of American consumers, and not necessarily grounded in reasonable concerns.)

But wait.  The catfish war was over US protectionism of domestic catfish producers - a case the US won, BTW.  And no source I can find points to a claim by US officials or lobbyists that the catfish being imported was somehow unsafe. It was all a matter of using the anti-dumping and selling-below-cost-of-production rules to claim that Vietname was dumping catfish below cost in the US Market.

I'm not trying to be truculent or claim the US is pristine in it's dealings with other countries - I hardly believe that. I guess I'm just not sure how your comparison fits.  In fact, I think it supports JamesV's point. The logical thing for China to do would be to either pull the PR move of contrition and a promise to do better with some hand waving "government oversight" or, as a counter measure, make it an all out trade war and claim the US is dumping soybeans.

I have no problem with China bringing up the soybean issue as a matter of protectionism of domestic soybean producers. But that's not what's being done.  They did not try to claim that the issue was dumping soybeans below the cost of production to gain market share. Instead, we get the humorous/childish response provided: "There's lead paint in our toys?  Our pet food supplements are killing pets? Yeah?  Well, your soybean suxxors!"

The US didn't "win" the catfish case, AFAIK it never went before WTO adjudication.

And in fact one of the arguments deployed against the VN catfish was that they were tainted by Agent Orange.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B01EED7163FF931A15754C0A9659C8B63

I'm not defending China's ridiculous claims about American soybeans either (though I believe China has done the positive PR thing, too).

What I'm saying is that the ridiculous claim has little to do with totalitarianism/communism, nor do the tainted products themselves. (I'd say China is decades or even a century behind the US in overall consumer safety, regulation, and transparency...except that the US is still pretty spotty...but even if America was perfect today, you'd still have to acknowledge that there's a reason the FDA was created.)