So I just started watching it for the first time, having missed it completely the first time round. I wasn't sure what to expect, all I could remember were some wacky hairdos and lurid accents. With that said, I was pleasantly surprised to find a pithy and occasionally insightful bit of pulpish Saturday afternoon entertainment, not exactly well developed characters but a few flashes of potential.
The woeful CGI lets it down badly though, they would have been far better off to take a few pages from the book of the original Star Wars movies which have aged much better in terms of effects, despite being twenty years older.
All in all, its looking promising, every episode has a few original quirks which I haven't seen much of so far from other series. Game inspiration? 7 out of 10 to date, I've filled a couple of notebook pages with offshoot ideas. What I like most about it is it doesn't have the preachy moralism of DS9, with a lesson for the viewer at the end of every episode, something it holds in common with Firefly. Hopefully the graphics will mature a bit over the course of the show.
Just wrapping up season one now.
Ah jeez peacock hair just got caught, cheating at poker by stealing cards with one of his six penises. Quirky little show this. Did not see that coming.
Oh I love B-5, one of my favorite shows, it gets better than it is now for you.
Its fantastic and builds slow, but when it hit it can hit hard.
Quote from: The Traveller;548580The woeful CGI lets it down badly though, they would have been far better off to take a few pages from the book of the original Star Wars movies which have aged much better in terms of effects, despite being twenty years older.
The CGI was chosen to keep the special effects affordable and it was fairly state-of-the-art at the time. J. Michael Straczynski had started working CGI on the Captain Power (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M678PVOf5F0) show, and it of course improved over time as the technology improved. Babylon 5 was purposely designed to be an affordable show to make, since the cost on so many science fiction shows had budgets that easily got out of hand with special effects (for example, this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNO6EITIBVU) -- the discussed the millions spent on models and sets on the Today Show here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBMVAzIMl5A)). To keep costs down, it was set primarily on a space station, with sets that could be easily broken down and repurposed and, of course, CGI special effects which were cheaper than models and blue screen.
If you can enjoy Season 1 that much then you're in for a really pleasant surprise. Most people skip Season 1 entirely in the rewatching. It gets much better as it goes.
//Panjumanju
Babylon 5 is easily one of my favorite shows ever, and yes it gets SO much better. It's also one of the most quotable TV shows ever, at least if you like deep, philosophical quotes. :)
As to the effects, consider the time period - early-mid 90's, CGI was pretty novel back then. You'll find it less important as you get more into the story and characters anyway.
Quote from: Panjumanju;548692If you can enjoy Season 1 that much then you're in for a really pleasant surprise. Most people skip Season 1 entirely in the rewatching. It gets much better as it goes.
Its the originality that's keeping my attention so far, its rare to find many if any original ideas in TV shows, let alone every episode.
If you loved Season 1 of Babylon 5, you will fall in love with the rest of the Seasons.
And the movies.
And Crusade.
Quote from: The Traveller;548580The woeful CGI lets it down badly though, they would have been far better off to take a few pages from the book of the original Star Wars movies which have aged much better in terms of effects, despite being twenty years older.
Not really. The special effects required by the Babylon 5 story simply could not be done with models on a TV show's budget. Biting the bullet and being a major pioneer for CGI effects was the only way to make it happen. You'll find that the CGI effects (along with everything else) improve dramatically as the series progresses.
The CGI isn't that bad, certainly not for its time, and that it's on a TV budget.
A few years after it finished I decided I hated it. B5 is so cheesy in places (Mr Garibaldi in one scene actually says this "...because hell is coming five steps behind me"!)
However I've come to enjoy it more: mainly it's main sequence (seasons 2-4). It tells its story quite well and there are some interesting moments of reflection and philosophy. There is also the excellent G'Kar who is a superb character. Ok the Centauri look ridiculous, but again they have a culture of their own. Plus, Earth is far from a perfect culture and in many ways less advanced than it's peers.
Season 1 is worth the time so as to get to know the character of Jeffrey Sinclair. This becomes very important in season 3. The first season is just scene setting however.
It's interesting to me how the story shifts and changes with when the producers think they're going to be cancelled, literally every couple of seasons. So, every few seasons you have this massive interesting ending that ties everything together. Then poor J. Michael Stravinsky has to come up with wholly new plots, and it happens all over again.
The series certainly benefits from the fact that J. Michael Stravinsky wrote every episode but, I think two - both of which were written by original Star Trek writers like D. C. Fontana.
Although I am a devoute Star Trek fan, I much preferred Babylon 5 - although I didn't see it all, and not consistently - to Deep Space 9, which was "Rick Berman does Babylon 5 (and Gene Roddenberry disapproves)".
//Panjumanju
Babylon 5 was a real pioneer when it came to multi-season story arcs. Seasons 1-4 form a complete arc. You'll find characters from season 1 transform throughout.
B5 was a true pioneer when it came to CGI. They used Amigas with early 3D software to do things previously not possible in television. A lot of it looks not so hot now, but it was something back then.
I never gave this show credit when it was first on and I only got some of it through re-runs; stupid me.
The Narn-Centauri back story, the actors involved (particularly G'Kar's and Mollari's), the less-than-savory aspects of damn near all species involved and the way the story lines actually went somewhere. Also, that spaceships seemed to work via actual physics - minus the Mimbari, I think - was a big, big "wow," in my book.
Yeah they've stepped up the graphics in season two, much less dodgy now. Other observations, the commander's fiancee is a little hottie, and one ambassador looks like she's been glued to the wall by the world's largest spitball. Not in and of itself an unduly worrying development, except her aide de camp doesn't know what its all about either. Actually I liked his moves in the barfight in the penis poker episode, authentic looking martial arts.
This is a great show. I'm not surprised it ran as long as it did.
I loved it while it aired, but I tried to re-watch it recently and it failed to hold my attention.
I watched it first time around and loved it, although I missed a whole host of Season 4/5, so I bought the boxed set last year and watched them back to back over a few days. They were even better the second time around. B5 is definitely my favourite SciFi show.
The best quite "My shoes are too tight, but it doesn't matter as I've forgotten how to dance" which made me change my lifestyle.
If your watching on dvd the main reason the ffects suck is that warners stupidly deleted all the high quality film it was originally shot on so they had to use the low res vhs versions which stands out something rotten, apparently strazynski has been working on a deal to completely redo the effects for a future blu ray release now that he owns the full rights again so in time no doubt there will be a remastered edition.
Quote from: Broken-Serenity;555246If your watching on dvd the main reason the ffects suck is that warners stupidly deleted all the high quality film it was originally shot on so they had to use the low res vhs versions which stands out something rotten, apparently strazynski has been working on a deal to completely redo the effects for a future blu ray release now that he owns the full rights again so in time no doubt there will be a remastered edition.
There goes more of my future paycheck....
Howlin' mad Murdoch just made an appearance! And he's still howlin' mad! And now I can't get the A-Team tune out of my head.
Quote from: Panjumanju;548866It's interesting to me how the story shifts and changes with when the producers think they're going to be cancelled, literally every couple of seasons. So, every few seasons you have this massive interesting ending that ties everything together. Then poor J. Michael Stravinsky has to come up with wholly new plots, and it happens all over again.
The series certainly benefits from the fact that J. Michael Stravinsky wrote every episode but, I think two - both of which were written by original Star Trek writers like D. C. Fontana.
Although I am a devoute Star Trek fan, I much preferred Babylon 5 - although I didn't see it all, and not consistently - to Deep Space 9, which was "Rick Berman does Babylon 5 (and Gene Roddenberry disapproves)".
//Panjumanju
Interesting note:
JMS originally pitched B5 to Paramount, but they turned it down. Then, shortly after B5 started, DS9 was put on the air.
http://www.firstones.com/wiki/Similarities_between_Babylon_5_and_Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine
QuoteSimilarities
Both series are named after a space station name with a single-digit number
Both series premiered in 1993, and were set aboard space stations that were hubs of interstellar trade and politics.
Both stations were located beside portals to distant places. (B5 is near a hyperspace "jumpgate"; DS9 guarded the mouth of a wormhole.)
Both series originally featured a shapeshifter character; however, Babylon 5 dropped that element before filming, replacing it with occasional characters using various illusory and camouflage mechanisms.
Both started off with unmarried commanders haunted by a recent conflict.
Commanders of each station had lost their wives before the series started. (Sisko and Sheridan)
Both men's wives reappeared during the series under the control of a more powerful race. (Sheridan's wife returns in person under the control of the Shadows, while the Prophets speak through Sisko's wife in visions.)
Both commanders had a girlfriend who was a freighter captain, Carolyn Sykes for Commander Sinclair and Kasidy Yates for Captain Sisko.
The commander of each station eventually became a religious figure who fulfilled a prophecy, advised by enigmatic aliens who were regarded as spiritual beings.
Both commanders (Sisko and Sheridan) "ascended" to become noncorporeal lifeforms in the series finale.
In both series the spiritual beings (the Vorlons, the Prophets) had an enemy (the Shadows, the Pah Wraiths) generally viewed as evil spirits by other races, with whom they had been at war for millennia.
Both series build up to a war between Humans and a militarily powerful, hard-to-detect enemy (the invisible Shadows, the shapeshifting Founders).
Both series had a sarcastic, cynical but dedicated head of security who started out as perceptive and extremely competent, but later succumbed to insecurity and compulsion (Garibaldi's drinking, Odo's link with the female Shapeshifter)
Both series had an idealistic young doctor with a hidden secret (Bashir's genetic enhancement, Franklin's involvement with the Underground). Both doctors also had strained relationships with their fathers.
Both series involved the use of genetically engineered diseases, designed to work against a specific group (Changelings, Markab, Human and Narn Telepaths, others) as a means of control or genocide.
The second-in-command of each station was a woman with a hot temper who had lost a family member in a war.
Central to each series were two alien races, one of which had until recently occupied and oppressed the home planet of the other. Furthermore:
The oppressed race was a deeply religious one.
The oppressors in both series were later manipulated by a powerful alien race to achieve its goals.
This manipulation occurred via a regular character in the series belonging to the oppressor race, who vacillated between 'good' and 'evil' through the course of the series, ultimately being taken over completely by powerful evil forces, which eventually led to their untimely deaths.
The plot of each series eventually centered around a war against the oppressors and those who manipulated them.
These wars resulted in the devastations of the former-oppressors' homeworlds.
Each series includes a sinister organization working within the humans' government: DS9's Section 31 and B5's Bureau 13, not to mention Psi Corps and Nightwatch as well.
Each series had a male character named "Dukat" (though B5's is spelled "Dukhat") and each series had a female character named "Lyta" (although DS9's is spelled "Leeta").
Each Station was administered by an Earth based government (Earth Alliance in B5, the Federation in DS9) but was not in that government's territory.
While each stations was administered by Earth, that administration depended upon the sufferance of a second, deeply spiritual, race. (Minbari in B5, Bajorans in DS9)
Comparison
Some Babylon 5 fans contend that DS9 plagiarized elements of the premise and details of B5. J. Michael Straczynski approached Paramount Pictures, the studio which produced DS9, with the idea of producing B5 and had given them a copy of the series "bible" in 1989, several years before production on either series began.
Straczynski has been quoted that DS9 was not developed until about 1991/1992 on the JMS message archive, and it is documented that DS9 was not announced by Paramount until nearly two months after the announcement of B5 by Warner Bros./PTEN in November 1991. Straczynski does not think that the producers of DS9 (Berman and Piller) borrowed the B5 concepts but the borrowing was done by the Paramount executives who had been given the series "bible" who directed the development of the series.
Quote from: Ghost Whistler;548784Season 1 is worth the time so as to get to know the character of Jeffrey Sinclair. This becomes very important in season 3. The first season is just scene setting however.
When the show started, I thought Sinclair was dull as dishwater. And by the time I finally started to like him, Michael O'Hare quit. :o
JG
Quote from: nightwind1;555858Interesting note:
JMS originally pitched B5 to Paramount, but they turned it down. Then, shortly after B5 started, DS9 was put on the air.
http://www.firstones.com/wiki/Similarities_between_Babylon_5_and_Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine
Spoilers! Yikes. :/
Dear god, man! THe series ended 15 years ago!
Also: In Gone with the Wind there is a big fire. THe Wizard of Oz ends with Dorothy in Kansas since it was all just a Dream, and the Terminator is a robot from the Future.
While I'm on the subject: Neither Santa Claus, nor the Easter Bunny are real.
i knew of some similarities between the two shows, but not the studio backstory and how many similarities there ended up being! :eek:
i consider myself a trek fan, but B5 beats ds9, hands down. think i'll hit netflix streaming and watch an episode or two right now, in fact :D
edit--dammit, netflix has taken the series out of the streaming rotation. guess i should finally pick up the box sets.
JG i think you win the "second wave" of avatar changes. blazing saddles is one of my all-time favorite films, a classic. :hatsoff:
Quote from: Spike;555918Neither Santa Claus, nor the Easter Bunny are real.
Also, they are lovers.
Quote from: Gib;555955Also, they are lovers.
Hardcore lovers.
B5 is not only my favourite sci-fi show, it is my favourite TV show ever. You are in for one of the greatest rides you could enjoy :)
Love Babylon 5, love Claudia Christian as Cmdr. Ivanova. It was an absolute genius move to purposely make it a 5 year arc.
Quote from: beeber;555953i knew of some similarities between the two shows, but not the studio backstory and how many similarities there ended up being! :eek:
i consider myself a trek fan, but B5 beats ds9, hands down. think i'll hit netflix streaming and watch an episode or two right now, in fact :D
edit--dammit, netflix has taken the series out of the streaming rotation. guess i should finally pick up the box sets.
JG i think you win the "second wave" of avatar changes. blazing saddles is one of my all-time favorite films, a classic. :hatsoff:
"They told us you were hung!"
"And they was RIGHT!"
Quote from: Spike;555918Dear god, man! THe series ended 15 years ago!
Also: In Gone with the Wind there is a big fire. THe Wizard of Oz ends with Dorothy in Kansas since it was all just a Dream, and the Terminator is a robot from the Future.
While I'm on the subject: Neither Santa Claus, nor the Easter Bunny are real.
I only wrapped up SG1 back in May! Another great show, that was just getting off to a good rebirth when they cancelled it. I've been busy for the relevant parts of the most recent millennia. Quite, quite busy. I think I'll stop reading this thread now for fear of further surprises.
Quote from: Marleycat;556042Love Babylon 5, love Claudia Christian as Cmdr. Ivanova. It was an absolute genius move to purposely make it a 5 year arc.
Susan Ivanova: Confirmed Survey 1. Upon arrival you will report for debriefing. And just one more thing, on your trip back I want you to take the time to learn the Babylon 5 mantra. Ivanova is always right. I will listen to Ivanova. I will not ignore Ivanova's recommendations. Ivanova is God. And if this ever happens again
[shouts]
Susan Ivanova: Ivanova will personally rip your lungs out! Babylon control out.
[to herself]
Susan Ivanova: Civilians.
[looks up]
Susan Ivanova: Just kidding about that God part. No offense.
Susan Ivanova: Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, Commander. Daughter of Andre and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance and the boot that is going to kick your sorry ass all the way back to Earth, sweetheart! I am death incarnate, and the last living thing that you will ever see. God sent me.
Sharing some love:
http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff2300/fc02211.png
(Its a nice little mostly "hardish" sci fi strip, and funny--but the end is appropriate to the thread.)
Plus:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=322007267887673&set=a.283248628430204.70587.178490865572648&type=1&theater
Yes facebook, look at the picture, then read a bit :)
Quote from: nightwind1;556197Susan Ivanova: Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, Commander. Daughter of Andre and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance and the boot that is going to kick your sorry ass all the way back to Earth, sweetheart! I am death incarnate, and the last living thing that you will ever see. God sent me.
After I watched that episode on DVD I rewound to this quote several times in a row. I'm quite sure that at some point I will have a video file on my computer of just that scene.
Ivanova was the bestest.
The best Ivanova line is from the first part of War Without End (SPOILERS - just to be sure).
They're all on the White Star and Sheridan is having a hard time accepting what's going on and they each comment in turn about whether they should go for it. Ivanova's last in line and just comes out with 'i'll be in the car'.
You had to be there, but it is funny. It is well timed.
the "day of the dead" episode is one of my favorites. amazing stuff, so well done. :worship:
I agree. Of all the episodes of TV that have ever remotely treaded on that sort of plot/theme, Bab5 did it lightyears beyond them all. I don't usually say that about B5 (which I do like, but so many of the episodes were trite and predictable...cliched).
Also I still think that Mordin was one of the best TV villains. Yet, he did so very little, which may be why he worked so well.
Quote from: nightwind1;556197Susan Ivanova: Confirmed Survey 1. Upon arrival you will report for debriefing. And just one more thing, on your trip back I want you to take the time to learn the Babylon 5 mantra. Ivanova is always right. I will listen to Ivanova. I will not ignore Ivanova's recommendations. Ivanova is God. And if this ever happens again[shouts]
Susan Ivanova: Ivanova will personally rip your lungs out! Babylon control out.
[to herself]
Susan Ivanova: Civilians.
[looks up]
Susan Ivanova: Just kidding about that God part. No offense.
Susan Ivanova: Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, Commander. Daughter of Andre and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance and the boot that is going to kick your sorry ass all the way back to Earth, sweetheart! I am death incarnate, and the last living thing that you will ever see. God sent me.
My favorite quote of the whole series, end of story, no pass go, no 200 dollars and no soup for you!!!
Quote from: Spike;556508Also I still think that Mordin was one of the best TV villains. Yet, he did so very little, which may be why he worked so well.
Bester.
Psi Corps Nazi Extraordinaire.
The fact that he was played by Walter Koenig was just icing on the cake.
Quote from: jeff37923;556562Bester.
Psi Corps Nazi Extraordinaire.
The fact that he was played by Walter Koenig was just icing on the cake.
Indeed. I think the show had some of the best villains ever.
Don't get me wrong, I liked Bester. I just like Mordin more. Though, honestly, I wouldn't like Bester if it weren't for the whole Chechov thing.
Quote from: Spike;556682Don't get me wrong, I liked Bester. I just like Mordin more. Though, honestly, I wouldn't like Bester if it weren't for the whole Chechov thing.
The Harlan Ellison cameo with Bester was priceless.
JG
Did anyone give Babylon 5/Traveler a shot (or the d20 based one)?
Quote from: Lynn;556745Did anyone give Babylon 5/Traveler a shot (or the d20 based one)?
The d20 version was OK, but there were some flaws so I ended up getting rid of my books.
I thought the
Traveller one was going to be awesome and was completely disappointed in it. I love me some
Traveller and think Mongoose did that game right, but I am not at all surprised by Straczynski pulling their license - the Traveller version was a rush job and it showed.
Quote from: Lynn;556745Did anyone give Babylon 5/Traveler a shot (or the d20 based one)?
I actually ran a campaign using the Babylon Project Rules, which pre-dated both. Which was o.k. Although, if I was to run it again (which I might, its a good setting for games IMO) I would probably look at picking up the Traveller version.
Quote from: Spike;556682Don't get me wrong, I liked Bester. I just like Mordin more. Though, honestly, I wouldn't like Bester if it weren't for the whole Chechov thing.
When he first appeared, I thought they shouldn't have cast "Chekov" in the part, then the second time he appeared, I completely forgot about Chekov. In fact, I watched Star Trek again after watching a couple of series of B5 and, for a moment, thought "Oh, there's Bester".
Quote from: soltakss;556984When he first appeared, I thought they shouldn't have cast "Chekov" in the part, then the second time he appeared, I completely forgot about Chekov.
From what I heard, Bester was not even a recurring character until JMS was so blow away with how Koenig played him.
Quote from: Spike;556508Also I still think that Mordin was one of the best TV villains. Yet, he did so very little, which may be why he worked so well.
To this day, anytime anyone really REALLY pisses me off, I'll just smile at them, and wave - just like this (wiggles fingers).
God I love that show. Molari is my favorite TV character just about of all time, but only because you can see his true, real, genuine feelings in "Day of the Dead" - he doesn't want to be where he is, doing what he is doing, but fate, and family, and duty has put him in the place where the future of the galaxy is to be determined.
And it cost him everything.
I can actually totally relate to him, in that regard. All I want is peace and the love of a good woman. But the universe won't let me have either, apparently.
the list of good supporting characters on B5 could take all week.
Londo is excellent on toast.
G'Kar is good, with moments of absolute brilliance
Bester, Ivanova, Delen's assistant, Morden... all brilliant.
One of the most quotable series ever.
Eet ees a good show, yes? I have to stop myself saying "yes?" after every sentence these days, marvellous actor that penis poker man. I'm a little disappointed they went with the hackneyed law versus chaos plotline, otherwise very courageous and well tied together as a whole. The shadows being beaten halfway through season five is a surprise. Veer got skinny, looks great on him, and Garibaldi went baldi, apparently due to some sort of criminal incident. This has been well worth my time so far.
Quote from: The Traveller;560061......VIR got skinny, looks great on him, and Garibaldi went baldi, apparently due to some sort of criminal incident. This has been well worth my time so far.
"VIR" had to get skinny - because the actor Stephen Furst discovered around that time that he had a problem with diabetes and he had to radically change his diet pretty darn fast and get healthy.
About six months after the series ended some friends & I saw him at a convention and he was talking about that. Incredibly friendly and nice guy compared to many other actors I've seen at conventions.
- Ed C.
"Zathras... Zathras... Zathras. See? Not the same."
I don't like the doc. I don't get any sense of human compassion from him. Dr Cox in Scrubs was a thundering dick, but you know you could forgive him because you got the sense that under it all, he really cared. This guy would do better in Robocop as a corporate sycophant. Still, loving the windup towards the end, I still think (HOPE) Garibaldi is doing an elaborate double agent routine rather than circling the drain.
Haha! Cap'n getting beat up in that Mars nightclub after being doublecrossed by Garibaldi reminds me of my own misspent youth. Ah the memories, or lack thereof. Nice to see mullets are still in fashion though, its a bit like seeing a frock coat these days.
Just keep watching the show builds. Like "The Walking Dead".:)
Have to tell this tidbit, Delen's assistant is Billy from "Lost in Space".
Quote from: Marleycat;560541Just keep watching the show builds. Like "The Walking Dead".:)
Have to tell this tidbit, Delen's assistant is Billy from "Lost in Space".
yeah, but even better is Vir is Flounder from "animal house"
'That Minbari who was in Allo Allo' was Lieutenant Hubert Gruber from 'Allo Allo'.
What! That alien that looks like dried leather gone wrong plucked out his eyeball and left it in the honeymoon suite. Just when I think I have this show figured out. Still, looks like everyone got laid anyway so alls well that ends well. Speaking of which, that Russian president woman is the spitting image of my last girlfriend, and has about the same attitude.
Brilliant last episode, really makes you think. Future archaeologists will probably sift through these and all other internet communications from the dawn of the information age, and try to analyse the posts. We'll be a fascinating glimpse of a time long gone. No doubt they'll even try to connect the online personas with the real people and build up a picture of life at the time like people do with ancient pottery today.
Quote from: The Traveller;560826Brilliant last episode, really makes you think. Future archaeologists will probably sift through these and all other internet communications from the dawn of the information age, and try to analyse the posts. We'll be a fascinating glimpse of a time long gone. No doubt they'll even try to connect the online personas with the real people and build up a picture of life at the time like people do with ancient pottery today.
The Season 4 finale was a very deliberate homage to "A Canticle for Leibowitz".
JG
Quote from: James Gillen;560979The Season 4 finale was a very deliberate homage to "A Canticle for Leibowitz".
JG
What was the disembodied eyeball on the shelf in the newlyweds bedroom an homage to?
Quote from: The Traveller;560982What was the disembodied eyeball on the shelf in the newlyweds bedroom an homage to?
Peeping Toms.
Quote from: jeff37923;560986Peeping Toms.
My first instinct was Larry Flynt, followed shortly by Sheridan declaring war on Narn after G'Kar's retirement plan is revealed.
Quote from: The Traveller;560982What was the disembodied eyeball on the shelf in the newlyweds bedroom an homage to?
The Drakh, IIRC.
JG
Quote from: The Traveller;560826Brilliant last episode, really makes you think. Future archaeologists will probably sift through these and all other internet communications from the dawn of the information age, and try to analyse the posts. We'll be a fascinating glimpse of a time long gone. No doubt they'll even try to connect the online personas with the real people and build up a picture of life at the time like people do with ancient pottery today.
I am on the other side of the fence on that episode. I like how JMS eventually parallels the past and future with the fairy tale like retelling of the story of B5 on ruined Earth. On the other hand, I felt like revealing a master timeline like that boxes in future stories too much (without a JJ Abrams like alt reality).
Apparently the world the humans are going to at the end of the episode is the Vorlon homeworld. Or something.
Ha! Crusade is also quite quotable
"I'm drowning in a sea of testosterone"
"That's okay, you have flotation devices"
PC is not this show's business. I'm a huge Gary "wears-collars-closed" Cole fan too, so its a win all round. Money well spent. Shame it never made it past one season.
Quote from: The Traveller;570180Money well spent. Shame it never made it past one season.
It was one of those shows that looked like it could have had promise, but was killed by to much interference from above.
Which should neatly bring you onto The Lost Tales (assuming you have done the films?)
You can blame burnout and network tampering for that. Strazynski got abit carried away and ended up writing every script around season 3 of babylon 5 which eventually took its toll and this coupled with TNT execs making stupid demands whilst he was filming season 5 and crusade(they wanted more nudity and less scifi amongst other stupid things), so what was originally planned as a 22 episode first season got trimmed down to what we got as strazynski having had enough basically told TNT to go fuck themselves and took his toys and went home. TNT would eventually change there minds about the nudity idea once the show started to air, but he had already wrapped the season and didnt want to work for them anymore(scifi channel eventually helped fund his last 2 babylon verse movies).
Quote from: jadrax;570183It was one of those shows that looked like it could have had promise, but was killed by to much interference from above.
Which should neatly bring you onto The Lost Tales (assuming you have done the films?)
Dont forget Legend of the Rangers(although maybe it should be forgetten lol).
Quote from: Broken-Serenity;570187Dont forget Legend of the Rangers(although maybe it should be forgetten lol).
Oh god, I totally had! And again it would be nice to see Traveller's views on it from a more modern perspective.
Quote from: jadrax;570183Which should neatly bring you onto The Lost Tales (assuming you have done the films?)
I haven't yet, there's a bewildering array of films once you get beyond the original series, apparently there's some dispute as to the chronological order of the movies? What should I watch next, and in what order?
Well beyond in the beginning and the pilot i think the others mostly slot into season 4 and 5 at random points, post series though only legend of the rangers and lost tales are important and Lost Tales is the ending of sorts being the most recent and probably last babylonverse movie(unless strazynski gets the itch again and finds funding for his long gestating telepath war movie trilogy).
Chronologically, *I think* it something like:
In the Beginning
The Gathering
Series 1
Series 2
Series 3
Series 4
Thirdspace (Actually takes place at some point in series 4, but no-one knows when)
Series 5
The River of Souls
A Call To Arms
Crusade
The Legend of the Rangers
The Lost Tales
- But as you did not do that, A Call To Arms is the prelude to Crusade so as you have just watched Crusade that might make sense to watch next.
Legend of the Rangers was awful. How sad considering that there were a lot of B5 fans (myself included) really hoping it would bring us a new series.
Lost Tales was a valiant effort, but the sets were gone and they tried to make up for a severe lack of budget with what I thought were over-scripted scenes.
The 'movies' were a real mix; mostly quite good, but River of Souls was about the worst thing Ive seen Martin Sheen in (how did that happen?).
And in episode eight, Gary gets his collar back. :D He already did the duster earlier so that's his two trademarks covered.
Hands up who wants to be a technomage in their next incarnation. I'd sign on the line for the duds alone.
Indeed. Technomages are cool, but you'd have to be bald.
Quote from: Silverlion;570400Indeed. Technomages are cool, but you'd have to be bald.
I can't remember if it was a boys only club also?
Quote from: Marleycat;570804I can't remember if it was a boys only club also?
I believe when they first appeared one of the main mages was a girl. She might have had hair, but I'm not sure--my memory is vague.
On wikipedia: It indicates that Galen's "wife" Isabella was a technomage as were others.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technomage
Quote from: Silverlion;570925I believe when they first appeared one of the main mages was a girl. She might have had hair, but I'm not sure--my memory is vague.
On wikipedia: It indicates that Galen's "wife" Isabella was a technomage as were others.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technomage
Ahh, good. I of course would be a technomage if allowed.:)