Quote from: Shipyard Locked;918517As an alternative balancing measure, I've also been thinking about stunning the druid for 1 round when he's reduced to 0 in an alt form. It still leaves him with tons of HP, but it's less intrusive than my first proposal, he'd at least feel less invincible and the party would react accordingly.

Thoughts?

If it works for your group and your players are fine with it, go for it. But I'd never play a druid with that limitation. The druid in my party has already almost completely abandoned wild shape for now because she's in one of those lulls where it's become nearly useless, especially for what we're doing. Her attacks aren't magical, so almost everything we fight takes half damage or is outright immune to her animal-form strikes. And her strongest combat forms get taken out in two hits because of low HP relative to our level and abysmal AC. She likely won't use the ability much until 6th level, which is still many sessions off. So for what I've experienced, I'd say absolutely not to any sort of outright nerf to the druid's shifting ability. I maintain what they really need is a more evenly leveled power curve since being amazing at level 2 and incredibly weak at 5 is silly to me.

But for you? Maybe that works for your campaign. All you can do is suggest it and see what your players think about the issue.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;918513You mean the ones who claim their games are the way it was 'meant to be played'?

Why all the Nvidia hate?

Quote from: CRKrueger;918563Why all the Nvidia hate?

I take umbrage against anyone who claims there's badwrongfun, and those people who tout that their game is how it's 'really meant to be played' are shouting "MY WAY IS THE RIGHT WAY!  YOU'VE BEEN DOING IT WRONG!" to me.

Which is pretty much the antithesis of what Mr. Gygax has been purported to say about D&D.

Quote from: Brand55;918395This is where you see a big difference in builds and choices within a class. You might have one fighter who just doesn't look overly impressive, yet beside him is another at only level 6 who dishes out six attacks doing 100+ damage the first round thanks to Sentinel/Polearm Master/Great Weapon Master. And hiding behind the wizard is the halfling rogue fires twice every round with a hand crossbow for respectable damage thanks to Sneak Attack, Sharpshooter, and Crossbow Expert.

A Barbarian can take the same Feats a Fighter can, Fighters only get slightly more. Eg my Barbarian used Polearm Master & Great Weapon Master with Reckless Attack for ridiculous damage, and attacking from 10' then stepping back meant I'd get a free attack on enemy closing so I rarely even got attacked.

Quote from: KingCheops;915531I've also traveled to

On a jet plane, right?

Quote from: Christopher Brady;918564I take umbrage against anyone who claims there's badwrongfun, and those people who tout that their game is how it's 'really meant to be played' are shouting "MY WAY IS THE RIGHT WAY!  YOU'VE BEEN DOING IT WRONG!" to me.

Which is pretty much the antithesis of what Mr. Gygax has been purported to say about D&D.

It's OK to be in the wrong again, darlin', as long as you don't make a habit out of it. Besides, you just precious when you're all pouty! "Umbrage!" Oo-ee, like a schoolmarm fixin' ta flounce on outta here!

/poke... poke, poke

Quote from: Opaopajr;918579It's OK to be in the wrong again, darlin', as long as you don't make a habit out of it. Besides, you just precious when you're all pouty! "Umbrage!" Oo-ee, like a schoolmarm fixin' ta flounce on outta here!

/poke... poke, poke

Uh?... Chris is right you know on both counts. Moreso on the second point.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;918564I take umbrage against anyone who claims there's badwrongfun,

Good thing I have never seen anyone actually claim that then.

Quote from: Omega;918581Uh?... Chris is right you know on both counts. Moreso on the second point.

I, as OSR Pontifex Maximus and Grand Mufti, denounce your rank heresy and demand satisfaction! Badwrongfun! Stone the idolater! lalalalala!

Quote from: Opaopajr;918599I, as OSR Pontifex Maximus and Grand Mufti, denounce your rank heresy and demand satisfaction! Badwrongfun! Stone the idolater! lalalalala!

Does Pundit know you're laying claim to his title?

Quote from: S'mon;918567A Barbarian can take the same Feats a Fighter can, Fighters only get slightly more. Eg my Barbarian used Polearm Master & Great Weapon Master with Reckless Attack for ridiculous damage, and attacking from 10' then stepping back meant I'd get a free attack on enemy closing so I rarely even got attacked.

Sure, that combination works great. But the fighter will get that combination faster unless you restrict yourself to playing a variant human. Even if you do pick the human, the fighter can grab Sentinel faster (a lot faster, depending on your race choice), and that Feat is fantastic with Polearm Master because it can stop an enemy outside of its melee range and allows great control of the nearby battlefield. He won't need to leave himself vulnerable (especially from ranged attacks and spells) by recklessly attacking and can use Precision Attack to hit just as often with GWM's extra damage.

Both classes have their advantages and can be absolutely brutal in combat. And they can both be utterly screwed in the wrong campaign if the GM is stingy with magic weapons and starts throwing the right sort of enemies their way.

Another thing we discussed was allowing advantage to attacking forms that are classed large or up since as is in 5e there is no penalty for being a bigger target. (except vs the Hunter path Ranger)

Quote from: Brand55;918647Sure, that combination works great. But the fighter will get that combination faster unless you restrict yourself to playing a variant human. Even if you do pick the human, the fighter can grab Sentinel faster (a lot faster, depending on your race choice), and that Feat is fantastic with Polearm Master because it can stop an enemy outside of its melee range and allows great control of the nearby battlefield. He won't need to leave himself vulnerable (especially from ranged attacks and spells) by recklessly attacking and can use Precision Attack to hit just as often with GWM's extra damage.

Both classes have their advantages and can be absolutely brutal in combat. And they can both be utterly screwed in the wrong campaign if the GM is stingy with magic weapons and starts throwing the right sort of enemies their way.

I played Variant Human of course. I was going to take Sentinel but another PC did so I focused more on massive destruction. If anything I wanted enemies to come at me since I was ridiculously durable as well as massively destructive, so in the end I often got close to encourage them to attack me instead of the squishies. But it was my choice.

Found this selection of possible changes to Wild Shape:

http://nevinera.net/5e-wildshape-variant/

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;918909Found this selection of possible changes to Wild Shape:

http://nevinera.net/5e-wildshape-variant/

QuoteYour forms can be entered and left as an action (bonus action for Moon druids), and have no time or frequency limits. Their HP are persisted for each form, and are recovered like player HP (spend their HD to recover health during short rests unless unconcious, recover HP and dice during long rests). Conditions are also persisted, but are removed with even a short rest.

Way too abusable.

QuoteForms with HP less than 4x druid level may use that as their HP instead.

Uh. No?

QuotePhysical skill bonuses are optionally recalculated using your proficiency and the shape's stats. If the beast has a higher skill bonus than that, you may keep theirs instead.

Uh... Hell no?

QuoteMoon druids may choose to use their spell attack bonus instead of the form's attack bonus, and may choose to use their spell DC instead of the form's ability DCs. Note: you can leave this change out to reduce complexity, or possibly make the option available starting at level 8 or 9.

Also no.

QuoteIf a Druid of the Moon casts Barkskin on themselves, they may choose to cast it on one of their forms instead, even while they are not using that form.

uh. Fuck no?

And so on and so fourth freaking no.