Quote from: Tod13;889058Do you have an example of the bad perspective? (I actually think Christopher actually did mean proportion, not perspective, but I may have misunderstood. The other people responding seemed to actually mean proportions too. Too me, the proportions are "style" which seems reinforced as the historical paintings have a bit less of the chinless pug-face style.).

All right.  Picking on that image, the book shelf on the left of the image and the table on the right, nothing seems off to you?

And then there's this one:



The background book shelf, where's the vanishing point(s)?  It looks like an almost flat wall, almost.

And then there's this one.



And I want to clarify, his perspective issue is what affects his anatomy and proportions.  They're all tied together.

Last image, the blacksmith, he's got the proportions of a human until the waist then his legs are alike 30 inches long.  And his hands will rest at his knees.

Then, I'm assuming, the central focus of the image (another issue, what are you meant to look at?) the fighter, wizard and rogue (I'm assuming that's what they are, Pathfinder has a huge amount of classes) The Wizard behind the Fighter seems to be on the kids' high chair.  There's very little sense of height.

Which again, goes back to his lack of actual perspective skill.  And that's ignoring the entire Inn's common room...  Where are the vanishing points?

Quote from: Caesar Slaad;888515Yup. I think the investigative skill system works nicely, but I dislike the general approach of the General Abilities. Beyond problems like this, I also notice it can make players hesitant to act since they are afraid to run out of points. I sort of overcome this by slathering on extra general ability points and paying fastidious attention to the player's chance to refresh. So it can work, but I do sort of recognize that part of that is me working around the weaknesses of the system.

I've come to disdain systems that make you pay points from a pool entirely in lieu of static bonuses (which is also a big reason I disdain the Cypher system.)

So true. With resource management of pools, I just can't bring myself to spend now because it'll leave me worse off when I need those points in the future. I really like the setting and idea of Mutant City Blues, and want to like the Cypher games, but limited pools of resource points that are at least as important as the base ability or the roll are, for me, just an absolute psychological breaking point. I just can't.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;889115
Last image, the blacksmith, he's got the proportions of a human until the waist then his legs are alike 30 inches long.  And his hands will rest at his knees.

The "blacksmith" is the guy with dark hair and the cut across his nose? That one is a bit clunky. I think the attempt was to have the guy bent down to the other's level. That and trying to fit in a view of the sword messed up the proportions a bit.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;889115
Which again, goes back to his lack of actual perspective skill.  And that's ignoring the entire Inn's common room...  Where are the vanishing points?

Actually, he's using multi-point perspective. I had my wife and her sister look at all these too. Her sister said she didn't see anything wrong or anything that needed comment, until I told her we were discussing perspective. She immediately popped out with "He's using multi-point perspective".

I don't think there is anything "wrong" with the perspective from an artistic point of view. But I don't think everything needs to be done photorealistically.

At least I see/understand what bothers you about it now. It doesn't bother me.

First things first...Spoiler Tag the pictures.

Ok, the Sinbad Library...it's a mess, but pretty clearly intentionally a mess, a hazy backdrop meant to suggest a large, ancient, stacks-of-crap-everywhere-built-up-over-time fantasy library.

Working as intended.  (Well aside from how the supposedly Socially Just Paizo decide to have "Occult" adventures be those done by Sinbad Persians and Indians.) :cool:

The tavern...well what I see is...

• The orc/half-orc whose about to get some...
• Nope, the blonde gypsy assassin chick (is that Seoni?) is just using him as distraction while she's watching the guard.
• An asian half-elf, she's kinda hot.
• Holy Shit that Owl's looking right at me isn't it!
• That halfling's gonna steal everything before the night is over.  I ain't buying the "innocent kid watching stuff" routine.
• I don't know about you, but I wouldn't trust that barmaid as far as I can throw her.
• That Wizard's not fooling anyone with that map, he's totally checking out the LesbianStripperNinjaElf.
• Oh, yeah I forgot Pathfinder has the Islamic Cleric chick, she's probably my favorite Iconic, her or the kickass Paladin.
• Now that you think about it, having a Mongoose keep track of a key is probably a wise move, nothing on earth can catch it.
• Holy crap, the original cisheterowhitebogstandardfighter is still alive.  Good Times.

Get my point?  

Focus is completely on the characters.  

Reynolds Pathfinder work is not "Reynold's Style" it's "Reynold's Pathfinder Style".  It's focused on the characters, the iconic PCs and NPCs that make up Golarion.  I'm not a big fan of DungeonPunk, but the style is consistent and it does aesthetically capture the Pathfinder setting.

As far as the other criticisms...
Why would you expect a vanishing point where there is nothing there that would show one?  The far walls are too far and indistinct, and most importantly, the walls and ceiling that would give you linear perspective are outside the shot.

The blacksmith guy...ok yeah something weird going on there, but is he even human or is he half-dwarf or something?

Ezren (the Wizard)...well I mentally draw a line along the table edge, take that line and draw it along their heads, ok, then draw that line across where their asses should be and...yeah you're right, Ezren is sitting on a baby chair and he's taller than Valeros (the fighter).

Since I'm of course checking out Merisiel's (LesbianStripperNinja) waist and ass, I see that the empty stool next to her is fucked up too.

So yeah, definitely some angle issues, regardless of whether you like DungeonPunk, but I'm not schooled enough for them to scream out at me.

Dwarven Blackbeard FTW.

EDIT: I just realized something...how the hell did we get into an analysis of Reynold's art in a fucking Gumshoe thread?

Yeah the perspecta odd in that big tavern piece. Its not anything blatant. But like the Rules cyclopedia there are notable little moments where things dont quite connect. A certain lack of initial depth for one as noted before.

There is depth there. But its all arranged such that it blends in too much. Like the Library piece. Theres depth there too. But it gets a little lost in the tones. I think Krueger is right that it is a intentional style.

Ok, you guys have me looking at this picture, now something is downright disturbing me.

Merisiel, the white-haired LSN Elf.

What in the name of all that's holy is that pinkish patch underneath her left row of knives?

Is that a cutout hole in the side?  If so, the flesh beneath looks mottled and diseased.  Maybe just scars I guess, Valeros is pretty chopped up too, which is cool, showing all the characters growing over time.  The wizard looks pretty road-weary as well.

Heh, and I hope they're the ones who drew the magic circle under their table, otherwise things are gonna go south pretty quick.  Guard coming in, barmaid acting weirdly, magic circle under the table.  This is about to turn into a Vulgar Unicorn or Maul in Shadizar level barfight.

Quote from: CRKrueger;889164Merisiel, the white-haired LSN Elf.

What in the name of all that's holy is that pinkish patch underneath her left row of knives?

Is that a cutout hole in the side?  If so, the flesh beneath looks mottled and diseased.  Maybe just scars I guess, Valeros is pretty chopped up too, which is cool, showing all the characters growing over time.  The wizard looks pretty road-weary as well.

That is what it looks like to me. Like that patch was cut away and theres scar underneath. If you zoom in you can see what may be ragged edges on the hole.

Quite a few are sporting scars. So doesnt surprise.

Quote from: CRKrueger;889164What in the name of all that's holy is that pinkish patch underneath her left row of knives?

Is that a cutout hole in the side?  If so, the flesh beneath looks mottled and diseased.  Maybe just scars I guess, .

That's one of the ugly little facts of dungeon-crawling that they don't show you in the Elmore paintings. Those cheap healing potions? The ones they sell to newbies right out of the 5e Player's Handbook? They leave scars. Bad.

That's why the experienced  'crawlers never touch 'em.

Quote from: Just Another Snake Cult;889176That's one of the ugly little facts of dungeon-crawling that they don't show you in the Elmore paintings. Those cheap healing potions? The ones they sell to newbies right out of the 5e Player's Handbook? They leave scars. Bad.

That's why the experienced  'crawlers never touch 'em.

Oh, I like that - for every cheap potion you down, you have a 25% chance of getting a -1 to your Charisma as nasty scars are left (which can't easily be covered by clothing or armor).  By GM's discretion, this can also be a bonus to checks to threaten or intimidate.

The pics very much say Pathfinder, I don't see how they could change them now; I like them for what they are (not a Pathfinder player).

Quote from: Tod13;889146Actually, he's using multi-point perspective.

I know about multi-point perspective, I've used it to varying effects (Not that good an sketcher anymore, sadly), I'm saying he's only got one vanishing point, and it's off to the left of the page (which is fine, vanishing points don't need to be on the art's page, just noticeable.)  If he's using others he's fooled me.

But that's the end of that.

My point is, for ME, it's the art that throws me, rather than the style of language used.

Although I personally wish more writers used They, Their, Them as neutral singular pronouns.

Going back to the thread topic, since combat seems to be a sticking point, what are some quick-fixes you'd suggest that aren't in some other splat book I don't want to pick up?

Honestly I don't mind combat being on the simpler side since the whole point of the system is to replace combat as the central activity with investigation, right? So what if combat gets relegated to the lesser development that skills usually get in other RPGs?

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;889239Going back to the thread topic, since combat seems to be a sticking point, what are some quick-fixes you'd suggest that aren't in some other splat book I don't want to pick up?

Well, Lorefinder - the GUMSHOE Pathfinder mashup - has Investigative skills for investigating and all the normal PF stuff for combat. With that sort of idea, it would be quite easy just to swap to CoC for combat scenes, driving or anything else where you think it's important that characters don't spend down their ability to succeed. The ToC book has CoC-to-ToC conversion notes so I guess they could be reverse engineered.

Pelgrane Press just posted the Enchiridion of Elucidation, which sounds like a Gygaxian magic item but is actually a collection of player and GM advice (and some house rules, several of which are inspired by later GUMSHOE games) for Trail of Cthulhu.

Quote from: ArrozConLeche;888692I agree. Making an issue of what pronoun is used is kinda overreacting. I remember a review for solipsist where the reviewer claimed he almost didn't review said game because of the use of pronouns:

QuoteIt's very unlikely that anyone will insist that if he games with miniature figures, they should all have enormous penises and wear bondage gear

Such a stupid thing to make an issue of. Heck, i didn't even mind that Shock made use of some made up pronouns like "hir", "ze", or whatever, as silly as I found that.

And I almost started laughing, because I immediately thought of Warhammer Dark Elves:D!

Quote from: Christopher Brady;889115All right.  Picking on that image, the book shelf on the left of the image and the table on the right, nothing seems off to you?

And then there's this one:

http://static1.paizo.com/image/content/PathfinderRPG/PZO1132-Wallpaper.jpg

The background book shelf, where's the vanishing point(s)?  It looks like an almost flat wall, almost.

And then there's this one.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-SxqwjFA2bxI/UmgCUrANFiI/AAAAAAAAArc/bGcxUZnjBXg/s1600/npc+codex.png

I agree with your points about the artist, but can you spoilertag those, please? You know, the square icon next to the one that says "php"?

Quote from: Just Another Snake Cult;889176That's one of the ugly little facts of dungeon-crawling that they don't show you in the Elmore paintings. Those cheap healing potions? The ones they sell to newbies right out of the 5e Player's Handbook? They leave scars. Bad.

That's why the experienced  'crawlers never touch 'em.

I like that. But how many people would you use such a houserule?
I mean, I would, but in my games you're lucky to even find a healing potion;)!