Quote from: James Gillen;872023Remember, kinky is using a feather.  Perverted is using the whole chicken.

JG

BAWK!!

Quote from: AsenRG;871975First, what Bren said, both on account of switching non sinonimous words, and on account of scenes not having a purpose.

Of course, Bren is being deceptive. There is no goal post shift, nor any implication that I am treating the two words as synonymous. You may agree with him, but you are not disagreeing with me. You are disagreeing with something he pulled out of his ass.

QuoteThat's an indie narrativist idea I never quite adopted.
To me, scenes have opportunities, not goals.

Again, what you're arguing against is not something I have said. Only willed beings have goals. A person utilizes scarce means to achieve those goals. This is the definition of action (as opposed to reaction). Actions have purpose--to bring about the end. Scenes likewise have purposes because playing them out is an action.

QuoteYes, though characters can have multiple goals as well.

Insofar as characters resemble real people, I would say it's safe to assume they have an infinite number of goals. However, at any given time, at the moment of action, or choice, there is a very specific prioritization of those goals.

QuoteSome schools of thought about roleplaying would totally disagree.

95% of all information, theories, schools of thought, journalism, etc in the financial industry is false. Once you've seen that, you realize it's probably true that 95% of schools of thought on just about anything is patently false. It's just that when it comes to games of make-believe, things are a lot more forgiving. Doesn't mean I should give a shit what they would disagree with.

QuoteNo, it's part of the premise of narrativist theory, so no, it actually is trying to confirm the parts that I disagree with.

Which narrativist theory? The one from Ron Edwards original article, or the one that shows up in wikipedia? The most frustrating thing about GNS theory is whenever you prove it dead from the neck up, someone goes and changes the definition. If we're talking about the old Ron Edwards verison of narrativist, the belief that N play can occur coterminous with role play is demonstrably false. If we're talking about the wikipedia version, then N play is role play, nothing more and nothing less.

Quote from: Lunamancer;872030Of course, Bren is being deceptive. There is no goal post shift, nor any implication that I am treating the two words as synonymous.

You claim I am being deceptive, but people can read what you wrote and decide for themselves.

Quote95% of all information, theories, schools of thought, journalism, etc in the financial industry is false. Once you've seen that, you realize it's probably true that 95% of schools of thought on just about anything is patently false.

Of course we are supposed to believe your sophomoric understanding of Aristotelian causation puts you in the 5%. :rolleyes: Typical.

Yeah I think there's a bit of slippage occurring with your use of the word "perversion". That implies a whole raft of judgement about erotic content. I'm pretty sure Bren is on the money here.

Quote from: Bren;872071You claim I am being deceptive, but people can read what you wrote and decide for themselves.

Okay, so everyone gets to decide for themselves... except for the guy who wrote it, and only after you decided to put your deceptive spin on it. Because it's not like you were just deciding for yourself what it meant. You were trying to dictate what it meant.

I don't care if you disagree with me. Your problem is you disagree with yourself.

QuoteOf course we are supposed to believe your sophomoric understanding of Aristotelian causation puts you in the 5%. :rolleyes: Typical.

And where did I mention anything about this?

Oh. That's right. I didn't. Except in peoples subjective imaginations I suppose. Because you're making shit up just for the sake of being a dick.

Quote from: Lunamancer;872088Okay, so everyone gets to decide for themselves... except for the guy who wrote it, and only after you decided to put your deceptive spin on it.

Of course everyone gets to decide for themselves what they think your words mean. But its not deceptive to point out the fallacy of your only one cause argument nor that you pulled perversion out of your ass to insert it into your...discussion.

QuoteI don't care if you disagree with me.

It seems like you do care. A lot.

QuoteAnd where did I mention anything about this?

It's my supposition of where you got your simplistic understanding of primary or first causes. I can't tell whether you got it directly from Aristotle or via some second-hand Scholastic or religious interpretation. Your combining it with a free-will argument leads me to suspect the latter, but its not like a freshman philosophy class is some obscure or unavailable source of knowledge.

Quote from: James Gillen;872023Remember, kinky is using a feather.  Perverted is using the whole chicken.

JG

I thought it was kinky is what turns me on, perverted is what turns you on?

Quote from: Nexus;872124I thought it was kinky is what turns me on, perverted is what turns you on?

Why can't it be both???

No, no, it goes "what I like is eroticism, what you like is porn! Shame on you and your prurient interests!"

Quote from: Opaopajr;872202No, no, it goes "what I like is eroticism, what you like is porn! Shame on you and your prurient interests!"

I like porn. "Eroticism" sounds like something they call 19th century paintings of naked women with weird boobs pointing to the sides. No extracurricular activities coming from that.

I remember when the joke was:  Porn is what men like.  Erotica is what women like.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;872196Why can't it be both???

Its the way of the world, like the difference between erotica and porn  

There's a great British word which y'all should use:

Smut.

Quote from: S'mon;872250There's a great British word which y'all should use:

Smut.

We have that word in the states as well.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;872256We have that word in the states as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pva35TFiBfI