Why do so many people feel the need to apologize for AD&D?

Bren · August 23, 2015, 10:48:18 PM

Quote from: Phillip;850740HUH??? Roll for attack has the effect of determining whether any roll for damage is applicable in the first place (and, in combination with a parry roll, and/or perhaps a fumble or critical or impale result, applicable to what).

You are missing the forest for that one tree there.

By "effect," he meant the long wait while the guy got ready to roll the damage die, not that damage was inflicted no matter what the to hit roll turned out to be. And if you want to get really nitpicky, he didn't mention that the opponent's parry or dodge roll which might negate the need for a damage roll. He probably didn't mention any of that other stuff because it had nothing to do with the point he was making.

Phillip · August 23, 2015, 10:52:37 PM

I see, said the carpenter as he put down his hammer and saw.

Bren · August 23, 2015, 10:56:11 PM

Quote from: Phillip;850832I see, said the carpenter as he put down his hammer and saw.

"What's that you say?" said the deaf-mute as he danced with his one-legged wife.

Gronan of Simmerya · August 23, 2015, 11:05:19 PM

She was a moonshiner's daughter, but I loved her still.

Nexus · August 24, 2015, 06:12:46 AM

"Why do they put the shore so near the ocean?" asked the rastafarian minister as he twerked with his autistic wife.

What? I wanted to play too...

Shipyard Locked · August 24, 2015, 06:44:45 AM

I don't understand this joke.

Nexus · August 24, 2015, 06:52:31 AM

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;850916I don't understand this joke.

I was just being silly.

Shipyard Locked · August 24, 2015, 10:07:07 AM

Quote from: Nexus;850918I was just being silly.

And I was just blinking in neutral incomprehension at the past four posts.

Bren · August 24, 2015, 12:28:02 PM

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;850951And I was just blinking in neutral incomprehension at the past four posts.

They are plays on words that had a certain nerd popularity around the first part of the last quarter of the previous century.

Gronan of Simmerya · August 24, 2015, 01:10:35 PM

Quote from: Bren;850978They are plays on words that had a certain nerd popularity around the first part of the last quarter of the previous century.

Or with my grandfather circa 1962.

Bren · August 24, 2015, 01:20:19 PM

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;850980Or with my grandfather circa 1962.

Grampa Gronan, a man ahead of his time.

The Ent · August 24, 2015, 01:21:30 PM

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;850980Or with my grandfather circa 1962.

And here, I thought you were a grandfather by 1962...

Shipyard Locked · August 24, 2015, 01:34:17 PM

Now I get it.

EOTB · August 24, 2015, 04:00:16 PM

Quote from: TristramEvans;850431I just read those rules and...first off, its only 15 pages because of the incredibly bad formatting and citations on each page. Secondly it doesnt just cover initiative, it covers a ton of other stuff. Which leads to the third point: they rules arent actually that complex, there are just a copious amount of extra rules for very specific alternate situations that might come up.

So, going through it step by step...

Lets say a PC party and a group of snorks meet, parlay quickly breaks down, and a fight begins...

1. Determine if anyone is surprised.
Nope, optional rule that doesnt apply. So we skip pages 1 and 2.

2. Determine distance, if unknown, between the parties.
Nah, distance is known. Another optional step that can be discarded.

3. Both parties declare their intentions.
PCs say what they're going to do. Gm decides what monsters are going to do. Standard stuff.

4. Pre-Initiative Actions are Resolved
All optional special cases. Skip this as well.

5. Resolve Psionic Combat.
No Psions in the party. Skip.

6. Determine Initiative by rolling a D6 for each side.
So, this is just like FASERIP Initiative, in that one entire side acts at once, followed by their opponents. So far, this is actually faster than modern D&D Initiative systems.

So everyone uses the same Initiative, but if anyone has any Initiative penalties, these are applied individually. So even if your team goes first, you might go later if you're using a slow and clumsy weapon or are suffering from some disability. Makes sense.

GM has the option of choosing one exceptional monster from a group and rolling a d8 for its Initiative instead of d6. Can see where this might occasionally be useful, but doesnt apply to this situation so...

Oh, thats it. Thats the Initiative rules.

Or, thats your giant strawman up in flames, I should say.

Yes, exactly. Anyone who brings up the ADDICT document without providing any context (i.e., the vast bulk of the document is how to handle the corner cases) either didn't read it, couldn't understand it, or is deceptively insinuating that typical 1E combat requires 20 pages of rules.

Yes, 1E has lots of sub-systems for specific situations that occur only rarely. Your mind hurting is another person's flavor.

Omega · August 25, 2015, 01:28:34 AM

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;850820This was, I'm fairly certain, the major reason for Gary's reversing himself from his earlier "make up some shit you think will be fun" attitude. Once TSR Inc saw D&D tournaments as a major advertising source, it was necessary to serve that principle.

It also helps when moving from one gaming group to another. As the DMG says, "make your changes. But be aware that the more you change the harder it will be for some players used to less modded rules to ease into." which is just common sense.

And yeah. Its usually nice to sit down at a convention game and not have to relearn D&D because the host is running something so mutated it looks like Gurps. Small changes like "no level cap for demi-humans." or "No clerics." are things players can ease into relatively without pause. (unless they only play clerics...).