[Revised Living Land, pt. 1]

For the last... well, over a decade, I've been revamping Torg material for my own campaign, called Storm Knights. Rules and ideas have been posted to the Torg List, the WEG forums, and (most recently) Google Plus (#Torg).

Several of them seem like they'd be of use to Torg fans. I want to begin with revised Axioms and World Laws for the Living Land.

First, a critique.

Variety is the Spice of Life (But Missing From the Living Land)

Recently, I re-read the Living Land Sourcebook, cover to cover. I found some problems.

One of the adventure seeds has this line in Act One: "[The players] wander around for a while, hunting for food and fending off beasts - typical Living Land stuff." Then the entirety of Act 2 is "Traveling to New York. Monsters, fighting, food." That's an entire Act.

These two Acts illustrate the problem with the Living Land: the lack of variety. The Living Land is, according to the Sourcebook as written, intended to be repetitive. The same thing, over and over.

It's an endless series of die rolls. Example:

Every 15 minutes of travel, you make a direction sense skill check. If you fail, the GM records each check you failed, and in order to get anywhere, you have to make a single success for every single failure.

Let's say that, Deep Mist and dinosaurs be damned, you can make 60 MPH on a highway in the LL. The first sample adventure involves a trip from Detroit, MI to Liberty, OH. According to Google Maps, that's a 4 hour drive. Assuming you can go that fast, that's 16 direction sense checks. Sixteen.

It's a 226 mile journey. Humans can walk about 3 mph. Assuming 24 miles a day (a long distance), this means they're walking 8 hours a day, and will get there in 9 days. That's 32 checks each day, 288 checks in all.

288 skill checks — at a minimum, because you can't fail a single one — is not fun. I cannot believe that anyone would find this interesting or compelling, or that it provides the fast-paced "Die Hard" experience a Torg game should.

And that's just one rule! There's also the daily survival rolls. Then there's the food issue. Then there's the "you lose your stuff" issue. And the Deep Mist. And others, all of which are intended to affect every single scene of every single act set in the Reality.

Tedious. Repetitive. Not fun.

This problem springs from the cosm's inspiration. The reality was heavily based on only 2 books, "Pellucidar", about Tarzan traveling to the Hollow Earth, and "The Lost World", about Professor Challenger on a dinosaur filled plateau.

The things that happened in those books — getting lost, losing your stuff, and other frustrations — became the entirety of the Reality.

Modules in the Living Land are supposed to, by deliberate design, repeat the experiences of those novels over and over. Different MacGuffins, but the same exact experience repeated to infinity.

My thesis — since confirmed by everyone who's commented on it — was that those who loved the Living Land rewrote the rules. And they should have. It's the only way to make the Reality interesting and playable.

They changed the bad rules and concentrated on what could be fun and entertaining. The next message contains new rules, new World Laws, based on the following approach:

The Living Land: The Lost Worlds Reality

[Note: I'm not sure how often to update the thread. There's not a small amount of material, and I want to get it all posted, without overwhelming anyone reading. Right now, I'm updating twice a day, several hours apart. Let me know if that's too fast or too slow.]

[Revised Living Land, pt. 2]

So, the World Laws of the Living Land are boring and repetitive. How do we fix them?

We chuck all of the World Laws and replace them with new ones, beginning with the following.

The Perils of a Living Land

Takta Ker is a vast, untamed wilderness filled with dangers. To those traveling here, or even just trying to survive, the wilderness is a dangerous place.

These dangers are called Perils, and there are an awful lot of them. They are a constant challenge.

(Some examples are given below. Gamemasters are encouraged to think up new and unique twists on these Perils.)

This World Law states that, once per Scene a Peril will occur. This Peril can either serve as a distraction, as an additional layer of opposition, or it can provide the main opposition for a Scene or Act. The gamemaster should plan potential Perils ahead of time, and link them to the events of the module.

The setting of the Living Land provides a great many potential Perils. The party might get lost, and have to find their way back to familiar surroundings. There can be natural obstacles, such as a swamp, a river valley, a mountain range. Just traversing these areas is challenging.

Earthquakes and volcanic eruptions can occur, even in tectonically stable locales. Rockslides, mudslides, and avalanches are also possible events.

Inclement weather, like tornadoes, thunderstorms, or hurricanes can threaten the party. Beware the empty riverbed — a flash flood is likely not far off.

Jakatts or Rek Stalek worshippers can attack. Perhaps they encounter a group of hostile refugees. Or one of the many creatures of the Living Land can make an appearance. Or perhaps lethal plantlife. ("Poppies! Poppies will make them sleepy.")

They may lose important equipment, or find that it breaks down. They may run out of bullets or fuel. They can run out of food or water (or find either spoiled) and have to forage for supplies. They may become sick or poisoned, or may suffer from a broken bone or sprained ankle.

There are many different potential Perils — but only one per Scene.

The first rule of Perils is this: "Make them interesting". Pick something that adds to the spectacle of the Living Land, that reinforces the primitive nature of the reality, and also serves as a challenge. An example:

To get to their destination, the players must traverse an immense chasm. While they are doing so, the first winds of a hurricane begin to blow and rain falls, making the rock slick. And lurking in the chasm below is a thriving ecosystem of giant insects.

Having to cross a vast chasm, making climb checks (perhaps as a DSR), while a hurricane is approaching and the rain is making the rocks slick, while in the chasm below lurk giant insects, is visceral and exciting. All Perils should be interesting and exciting.

The second rule of Perils is "Don't repeat yourself." Always look for new things to use as Perils. Don't so the same thing every time. Even if you use the same Peril in succeeding Scenes or different modules, each time it appears it should have a unique twist.

The third rule is "Pick something challenging, but not overwhelming." The players should find it difficult to deal with, but not find it frustrating. If necessary, the gamemaster can combine two Perils to make it more challenging — such as a thick fog that hinders sight and serves as a cover for an attack by creatures.

Perils are supposed to add to the Living Land's sense of adventure, and are not supposed to be burdensome or boring. They should be unique and varied and seldom repeated.

Analysis

As written, the Living Land is boring. The same obstacles (mist, losing stuff, food, etc.) exist constantly and there is no variety. This single World Law takes all the constant obstacles and makes them into "when appropriate", occasional events. This is utterly necessary.

The chasm idea above is a cool idea, but having to do it each and every Scene in the Living Land is boring and burdensome. The same goes for getting lost, losing equipment, and other elements of the current World Laws. Rather than spicing up the adventure, they become burdens.

This World Law takes the burdens of the Living Land and transforms them into virtues. It introduces a panoply of possible Perils. But only one significant Peril per Scene or Act.

You will get lost... in one Scene. In the next, it may be a vast chasm, a tribe of Rek Jakutta, or a herd of rampaging herbivore dinosaurs being chased by fast carnivores.

The Living Land needs natural perils. It needs the feel of a difficult struggle to survive. Page 99, Sourcebook: "In the Living Land life is more savage, and unglamorous day-to-day survival is the norm."

That's fine. That's perfect. But the implementation in the Sourcebook sucks.

So take every single existing Living Land World Law and throw them in the trash. They are all smaller parts of "The Perils of a Living Land". This one World Law implements all of the features we know, in a way that enhances the variety of the Reality.

The next two parts add some new elements to the mix.

[Revised Living Land, pt. 3]

Two more World Laws, for a better Living Land.

Lanala's Love of Life

This is the Living Land, a place that is teeming with Life. The Goddess of the world, Lanala, wills life to thrive and her will suffuses the whole world.

1.) Giant creatures exist here, in defiance of the laws of physics. Both mammals and insects can grow to sizes impossible elsewhere.

2.) The verdant plants of this reality grow with incredible speed. In a matter of weeks, they can cover buildings with growth that would normally take decades. This can cause severe property damage. As well, what grows isn't the native plant life of Core Earth, but plants of Takta Ker. The Living Land terraforms invaded worlds.

3.) The climate of the invaded Realm changes to match the humid and hot jungles that cover most of Takta Ker. This has a great deal of effects on local wildlife.

4.) For worshippers of Lanala, surviving in this wilderness is far easier than its perils would indicate. All worshippers of Lanala gain 1 add in survival as soon as they convert. In addition, survival DN's in the LL are one step lower for Jakatts.

5.) Lanala abhors non-living tools. Jakatts who use dead tools have a -3 Bonus Modifier when they do so. Those who use living tools (such as a hrockt spear) have a +3 Bonus Modifier when they do so.

(These bonuses are inverted for followers of Stalek. Stalek loves non-living tools.)

The Relics of Lost Worlds

The Living Land has invaded and conquered many cosms. In each cosm, the forces of Life inevitably overcome those of Death. Their buildings are torn down, their Dead things lost, and they themselves convert to worship of Lanala or die.

Lanala wishes all to be reminded of what happens to those who choose Death. By her will, a tiny remnant of the civilization is preserved, that her people can remember each victory and rejoice in the inevitable advancement of Life. Such relics are protected from the Perils of a Living Land and even the forces of Life (plants and creatures of the reality). Lanala wants this small remnant to survive.

As a result, the Living Land is filled with ruins and relics from those forgotten civilizations, including Core Earth. Here and there, Storm Knights will stumble across a strange building, obviously alien in origin, that has been engulfed by this reality. In such buildings they may find tools, pieces of artwork, or other remnants of the forgotten past.

The first civilization destroyed by the eidenos was the Ustanah, and Ustanah ruins dot Takta Ker. Due to this World Law, they can be found on Core Earth as well. As can buildings from the world of the Benthe, and many other cosms.

How does this happen? When the Living Land invades, Reality Storms transform Core Earth buildings and tools into those of destroyed cosms. And, when an invasion has finished, this World Law ensures that ruins of those destroyed civilizations appear on Takta Ker.

Part of the Lost World genre is discovering and plundering the ruins of ancient and forgotten civilizations. That includes scavenging Core Earth buildings that have been swallowed by the verdant plant growth of the Living Land. But it also includes ruins of the Ustanah, the Benthe, and many other cosms. And for those looking to "bake in" secrets for their game, the Ustanah ruins are a prime location to hide clues to those secrets.

[Revised Living Land, pt. 4]

Axioms and the Lost Worlds Reality

The last piece of the puzzle, in terms of revising the Canon setting, is to adjust the axioms. As with several other Realities, the axioms given in the material are very different from what is on display in the cosm.

For example, Tech. (All examples assume the R&E Tech axiom.) The Tech is listed a 7, which is the Bronze Age. Metal mining, metal smelting, a host of tools the Living Land just doesn't have. Axiom 5 is the Agricultural revolution, when people began planting fields of crops and harvesting them, which lead to the appearance of cities.

Neither are appropriate for the nomadic tribes of the Living Land and neither match what is on display in the Sourcebook. A "3" does.

Similar objections apply to the Social axiom as well. For those looking to reflect what exists in the cosm, the following axioms are a better match.

Magic: 0
Social: 5
Spirit: 24
Tech: 3

Using these axioms changes nothing, but it reflects the real Tech and Social of the canon Living Land.

I see what you're doing here. Pretty good. I like the revision. Certainly goes in the right direction.

Rewriting The Living Land: The Lost Worlds Reality

The World Laws and axioms presented thus far can be, and should be, used with the canon Living Land. (That is, the Living Land Sourcebook can be used as-is, without needing to rewrite anything.) They do entail changes, but the changes are for the better. But these World Laws don't go far enough in making the Living Land a playable setting.

This thread will cover a lot of suggestions for revamping the Living Land. In order to make it easier for GM's to do so, I've sorted them in increasing order of magnitude, separated into their own "series" of posts.

1. Revised Living Land — this series.

2. Rewriting the Living Land — changes to the religion and setting, to make it playable.

3. Amping-up the Living Land — adding new abilities and powers, to give players more options and to better reflect the Spirit Axiom.

4. Lifecrafting — a new FX system, that gives the Reality something unique.

5. Lost Worlds of the Living Land — a pretty radical addition, that makes the cosm something more than just "that primitive place".

6. Secrets of Takta Ker — a change beyond anything you'd imagine.

Staggered this way, GM's can choose which alterations to use (if any), and choose how radically to change the Living Land.

(Like I said, there's more than a few posts. I'll be making one or two a day, so as not to overwhelm people.)

Interesting stuff DW.

Quote from: Benoist;663037I see what you're doing here. Pretty good. I like the revision. Certainly goes in the right direction.

Thank you.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;663039Interesting stuff DW.

Thanks.

Honestly, I'm waiting to see people's reactions to the Lost Worlds idea (series #5). It's pretty out-there, even for Torg.

The Living Land: The Land of Lost Luggage

Quote from: James Gillen;663074The Living Land: The Land of Lost Luggage

Not any more.

(But yeah, that "you lose your stuff" rule was obnoxious in the extreme. Hated it. And I was the GM.)

Well, in retrospect, a lot of the problem is that The Living Land was the first of the realm books.  And it shows.  It didn't even have a format for World Laws, it just had stuff like the rule of lost luggage.

JG

Quote from: James Gillen;663093Well, in retrospect, a lot of the problem is that The Living Land was the first of the realm books.  And it shows.  It didn't even have a format for World Laws, it just had stuff like the rule of lost luggage.

Plus it was being written at the same time as the boxed set, the novel trilogy, and the first adventures were, on a very compressed timetable. (There was an excellent article in Journeys magazine talking about it.) The timetable problems also show with the artwork.

And there was vision problems, as the game being tested wasn't the one that got shipped. Scott Palter, the then owner of WEG and Publisher said "The creatives knew what they meant even if the book said something different." They playtested what was in their minds, and not what was on the page.

And there was no time to fix it. WEG's internal processes were a little dysfunctional. Palter: "[Senior staff had] little impact on the details of the products... there was a running joke between myself and the licensing manager that there was some magic eighth day of the week products finalized on. We would see details we didn't like and be told that as they didn't effect play why not fix them later. Then the magic eighth day would happen and any change however small would mean that we missed release date."

The time crunch, creatives not writing what was being tested, and dysfunctional culture all combined to produce one of the worst sourcebooks for Torg (not the worst, unfortunately), and a thoroughly uninteresting setting. (The least popular Reality, IIRC, based on a survey of Torg players.)

Rewriting the Living Land [pt. 1]

The first series was a revised Living Land — new Axioms and World Laws that make it a more playable setting. This series concentrates on actually rewriting the background of the cosm, to make it more playable.

This series is canon-friendly. Lanala and Rek Stalek are the only gods, and though the Living Land has new World Laws and axioms, no changes suggested in later series need apply.

Beginning

I like the Living Land. Despite that, the original sourcebook failed to deliver a compelling version of the cosm.

Of particular problem was the participation of edeinos characters in the war. The edeinos are the enemy, they mass murder with casual, cheerful commitment. The heat of battle gives them pleasure, and Earthers are Dead people anyway, walking corpses.

More, the religion mandates that Jakatts never use, never touch Dead things. It’s anathema. So any active participation outside the Living Land is pretty much a violation of their religion.

Walking along a street? Dead thing, morally wrong. Riding in a car? Dead thing, morally wrong. Flying to another Reality? Dead thing, morally wrong.

These are the kind of offenses edeinos kill others for, and yet to participate in the Wars, they simply have to do them. That’s a problem.

(I used to think their inhuman nature was a problem. I don’t any more. A couple of years ago I realized that, in the P-wars, people would quickly come to realize what edeinos were, and they’d be a known factor, not a scary alien. So just being a scale isn’t the problem I once thought it was. But the religion and culture of the Living Land is.)

So, to make edeinos characters playable, the religion needs to be rewritten, as do the cosm's cultural details. This series of posts is about both.

Great thread. I have a huge soft-spot for TORG. I love the system (I'm an old throw back who likes "model everything" RPGs), and if it wasn't so tied to the setting I'd use it in other games. One of these days I'll try MasterBook for myself, but from what I've read in the past the changes it made from TORG are ones I would disagree with.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;663118Plus it was being written at the same time as the boxed set, the novel trilogy, and the first adventures were, on a very compressed timetable. (There was an excellent article in Journeys magazine talking about it.) The timetable problems also show with the artwork.

Sounds like an interesting article. Is it online by any chance?

QuoteThe time crunch, creatives not writing what was being tested, and dysfunctional culture all combined to produce one of the worst sourcebooks for Torg (not the worst, unfortunately), and a thoroughly uninteresting setting. (The least popular Reality, IIRC, based on a survey of Torg players.)

I certainly wouldn't be surprised to see the Living Land come last of the original cosms, but I would expect it to put in a good showing against the later additions of Space Gods and Tharkold.

For me it was always Nile Empire. IIRC the adventure in the core box and the first adventures trilogy both leaned heavily on the Nile Empire, which then really bedded that in for me.

Quote from: Grymbok;663152Great thread.

Thanks.

Quote from: Grymbok;663152Sounds like an interesting article. Is it online by any chance?

Unfortunately, no. I had to buy back issues to get the Torg articles.

Quote from: Grymbok;663152For me it was always Nile Empire.

The Nile was the favorite cosm, by far. (IIRC.)