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How to Fix Gurps

Started by KrakaJak, July 10, 2011, 07:23:41 AM

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1989

#195
April 23, 2012, 02:21:48 PM
Quote from: FrankTrollman;467542It's 2011, and if you're still on the roll-under wagon that is fucking pathetic.

-Frank

You're pathetic.

RPGPundit

#196
April 24, 2012, 02:37:20 AM
I don't think roll under has any particular inferiority to roll over, except for possibly a psychological element.

RPGPundit
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The Butcher

#197
April 24, 2012, 07:22:32 AM
Quote from: 1989;532859You're pathetic.

Wow, that's old. ;)

Frank's a smart guy, but he gets way caught up in minutiae which, IME, aren't always relevant to people's actual enjoyment of the game.

I stand by my previous assesment, BTW:

Quote from: The Butcher;467548I agree that adding comes easier to most people, than subtracting. I just think you're overblowing the relevance of this, in typical theRPGsite style.

Straight-up roll-under is just as easy as roll-over. The trick is applying modifiers to the target number, before rolling, rather than to the roll's results.

Claudius

#198
April 24, 2012, 08:56:41 AM
Quote from: The Butcher;533164Frank's a smart guy, but he gets way caught up in minutiae which, IME, aren't always relevant to people's actual enjoyment of the game.
Is he? After all he has said in this very thread about roll-over and roll-under, well, I don't want to call names, but frankly... :confused: . I may not be a genius, and haven't studied maths for a long time, and yet, I know that roll-under and roll-over are mathematically THE SAME FUCKING THING. It's like saying that 6+3 is better than 3+6. :confused:
Grając zaś w grę komputerową, być może zdarzyło się wam zapragnąć zejść z wyznaczonej przez autorów ścieżki i, miast zabić smoka i ożenić się z księżniczką, zabić księżniczkę i ożenić się ze smokiem.

Nihil sine magno labore vita dedit mortalibus.

And by your sword shall you live and serve thy brother, and it shall come to pass when you have dominion, you will break Jacob's yoke from your neck.

Dios, que buen vasallo, si tuviese buen señor!

Imperator

#199
April 24, 2012, 09:23:52 AM
Quote from: Claudius;533186Is he? After all he has said in this very thread about roll-over and roll-under, well, I don't want to call names, but frankly... :confused: . I may not be a genius, and haven't studied maths for a long time, and yet, I know that roll-under and roll-over are mathematically THE SAME FUCKING THING. It's like saying that 6+3 is better than 3+6. :confused:

But they are not exactly the same from the point of view of cognitive operations.

Particularly, I have used and keep using Frank's suggestions about making Cthulhu a roll-over system and it's been a complete success.
My name is Ramón Nogueras. Running now Vampire: the Masquerade (Giovanni Chronicles IV for just 3 players), and itching to resume my Call of Cthulhu campaign (The Sense of the Sleight-of-Hand Man).

Claudius

#200
April 24, 2012, 09:29:25 AM
Quote from: Imperator;533192But they are not exactly the same from the point of view of cognitive operations.
Please elaborate.

QuoteParticularly, I have used and keep using Frank's suggestions about making Cthulhu a roll-over system and it's been a complete success.
I'm not surprised, as I said mathematically there is no difference.
Grając zaś w grę komputerową, być może zdarzyło się wam zapragnąć zejść z wyznaczonej przez autorów ścieżki i, miast zabić smoka i ożenić się z księżniczką, zabić księżniczkę i ożenić się ze smokiem.

Nihil sine magno labore vita dedit mortalibus.

And by your sword shall you live and serve thy brother, and it shall come to pass when you have dominion, you will break Jacob's yoke from your neck.

Dios, que buen vasallo, si tuviese buen señor!

Rincewind1

#201
April 24, 2012, 10:40:02 AM
Roll - over is just a serious game. Roll - under is for children.
Furthermore, I consider that  This is Why We Don\'t Like You thread should be closed

The Butcher

#202
April 24, 2012, 10:47:48 AM
Quote from: Imperator;533192But they are not exactly the same from the point of view of cognitive operations.

Particularly, I have used and keep using Frank's suggestions about making Cthulhu a roll-over system and it's been a complete success.

I get that, man, and more power to you. I just don't buy into the anti-roll-under crusade, and the "objectively better" line of argument. It makes Frank look like an idiot savant of RPG rules-tinkering.

Géza Echs

#203
April 24, 2012, 11:08:48 AM
Quote from: Rincewind1;533222Roll - over is just a serious game. Roll - under is for children.

Honestly, no offence meant, but this has to be the most nonsensical argument I've heard yet since joining this board.

misterguignol

#204
April 24, 2012, 11:12:48 AM
Quote from: Géza Echs;533238Honestly, no offence meant, but this has to be the most nonsensical argument I've heard yet since joining this board.

I'm pretty sure Rince was kidding.  He's a WFRP fan, after all.

Rincewind1

#205
April 24, 2012, 11:16:19 AM
Quote from: misterguignol;533242I'm pretty sure Rince was kidding.  He's a WFRP fan, after all.

And I even used a cursive this time, in hope that a ":rolleyes:" would be unnecessary at the end of that post.
Furthermore, I consider that  This is Why We Don\'t Like You thread should be closed

Géza Echs

#206
April 24, 2012, 11:16:32 AM
Quote from: misterguignol;533242I'm pretty sure Rince was kidding.  He's a WFRP fan, after all.

I sure hope he was kidding! Still, my comment stands for the rest of the "argument" on roll-under versus roll-over throughout the thread.

Rincewind1

#207
April 24, 2012, 11:17:34 AM
Quote from: Géza Echs;533245I sure hope he was kidding! Still, my comment stands for the rest of the "argument" on roll-under versus roll-over throughout the thread.

Preference of mechanic, is, generally speaking, a purely subjective matter of opinion. And opinions are like assholes - everybody has one. Claiming "objective superiority" is ridiculous and both logically and in fact, philosophically flawed on so many levels, that it makes me wonder sometimes how people manage to get their shoelaces tied.

Then again, apparently some do have a problem with them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBBwKWSxoMI
Furthermore, I consider that  This is Why We Don\'t Like You thread should be closed

J Arcane

#208
April 24, 2012, 11:17:39 AM
Hulks and Horrors is roll-under and proud of it.
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Géza Echs

#209
April 24, 2012, 12:21:27 PM
Quote from: Rincewind1;533246Preference of mechanic, is, generally speaking, a purely subjective matter of opinion. And opinions are like assholes - everybody has one. Claiming "objective superiority" is ridiculous and both logically and in fact, philosophically flawed on so many levels, that it makes me wonder sometimes how people manage to get their shoelaces tied.

I have no problem if somebody were to argue that a particular mechanic were their personal favourite - that's cool. But claiming that one is objectively better than the other is flat-out dumb. Particularly, as someone pointed out upthread, that the difference is that of 3+6 versus 6+3.

QuoteThen again, apparently some do have a problem with them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBBwKWSxoMI

Rolfe's just being a comedian, though, which is cool. Love his work, for the most part.
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