Quote from: TheHistorian;532506It seems to me that the concept of crowd funding is already straying from the original intent.

I think the idea was to help get a company off the ground, not every project forever.  So you crowd fund for the first project, on which you will earn little to nothing, but hopefully create something that increases your reputation to the point that you can privately create the next thing, for which you will make money (and really start your company going).

Now it seems like people want to use the process repeatedly, or companies want to use it (basically) as a pre-order channel.

There isn't necessarily anything wrong with the shift, in fact it might even be a good thing, but the idea that with zero reputation you can make a successful project happen is a bit unlikely.

Nothing wrong with that at all, and in respect of rpg's, setting up a company isn't really a practical option.

One thing that is important to think about is the future sales of a project made possible with Kickstarter. The numbers here aren't generally public (one awesome thing about KS is that it makes much of the data visible, enabling invaluable analysis like the OP's) but Evil Hat is a laudable exception. Comparing the KS for Do: Pilgrims of the Flying Temple and the subsequent sales numbers suggests that a successful project on Kickstarter will go on to sell more units than were provided as backer rewards. Considering PDFs alone that is certainly proving true for Adventurer Conqueror King; the books will be in stores on May 18th, and available at Preview Nights stores sooner, so we'll see whether it's so for hardcopies as well.

Quote from: harpy;532289The big thing I'm taking away from it is that as an amateur I'll have to start small and build up a portfolio of projects.

Well, this just makes it like every other industry, and grounds it in reasonable expectations. Thank you for all this data, it's wonderful to go over and gain real perspective on the current market.

//Panjumanju

I think this is very interesting information.  Crowdfunding seems like its going to one day be a very important way people make money with intellectual property in the post-filesharing future. This is an interesting guide to do it right, essentially.

RPGPundit

This is my take on the emergence of crowdsourcing. If I had the time and energy, I'd expand it into a full essay with links and stuff. I don't, so you're going to get the shortest version I can manage.

Crowdsourcing is the rebirth of the Patron model of art. See: the Pope and Michelangelo. At one point, this was the prevalent model of supporting the arts. A sculptor, painter, composer would get a noble that would pay their bills. In return, the noble got bragging rights to the latest masterpiece.

"Sponsors" are patrons, paying money so that a product they desire will get produced. For this, they get benefits that lower-contributing patrons don't get, and that later customers (people who buy after the product is completed) don't get.

This idea is more democratic than the old patronage system, in that it depends on multiple contributors contributing varying amounts to the product. Hence the "crowd" part of crowd source.

This ties into, variously, the "1000 true fans" idea, blogged about by Jerry Pournelle, and the "ransom model" of RPG development, developed by Greg Stolze and Daniel Solis. It also ties into the "Long Tail", which is probably an incorrect model but applicable in this case. (And PBS fund drives, as well.)

What it means is: your book may be worth nothing to most people, $5 to a few hundred, $50 dollars to a dozen, and $500 dollars to one guy. Crowdsourcing allows those people to pay what the product is worth to them, to ensure that it is created at all.

(What this isn't is an investment system. People aren't buying a piece of future profits, they're paying to get the work made at all. That's patronage, not venture capitol.)

That's why sweat equity is so important: you have to build the base of people who trust you enough to give you money, sight unseen. (Those 1000 true fans, alluded to earlier.) Enabled by the Internet, crowdsourcing may be a fad (as was said earlier) or it may prove an interesting way for niche products (which all RPG's are) to connect with would-be patrons.

Personally, I hope it continues to be a viable model of producing RPG's and other works of art. As a fan of niche products, if this is the only way stuff I love will get made, then I'm willing to pony up. And have done so, on three separate occasions.

Great analysis, OP. Good to see what works and what doesn't.

Quote from: RPGPundit;532640I think this is very interesting information.  Crowdfunding seems like its going to one day be a very important way people make money with intellectual property in the post-filesharing future. This is an interesting guide to do it right, essentially.

Yeah, I can see this as a possible solution to the whole issue of filesharing.  Once a creator has an established reputation in the marketplace they can use crowdfunding as either an overt random model, or a partial ransom model where enough of an upfront profit margin is factored into the campaign and any sales afterwards are just seen as "long tail" sales.  At that point, filesharing becomes a primary marketing vector.

Quote from: TheHistorian;532506It seems to me that the concept of crowd funding is already straying from the original intent.

I think the idea was to help get a company off the ground, not every project forever.  So you crowd fund for the first project, on which you will earn little to nothing, but hopefully create something that increases your reputation to the point that you can privately create the next thing, for which you will make money (and really start your company going).

Now it seems like people want to use the process repeatedly, or companies want to use it (basically) as a pre-order channel.

There isn't necessarily anything wrong with the shift, in fact it might even be a good thing, but the idea that with zero reputation you can make a successful project happen is a bit unlikely.

How I see things now is that crowdfunding is going to likely take over a lot of the traditional business model for RPGs.  It makes sense in that the traditional approach has a huge cash flow risk attached to it.  Now any company can greatly mitigate their risk.  A big shift in the company is developing the most efficient and effective ways of running a crowdfunding campaign, which will drain some resources and brain capital, but the leverage is just too good not to invest in this new science.

One thing though that is interesting in this transition phase is the concern over what happens when all the major companies move towards crowdfunding.  I get the feeling that there is some afterglow of the traditional business model where the publishers are the primary gatekeepers into the marketplace.  What's happening now is that the marketplace is overtly becoming the gatekeepers and so it is less likely that crowdfunding will end up being used in just one manner.

Instead, crowdfunding really just becomes a tool that can take on varied forms.  It could be a grassroots patronage, a pre-order or a ransom.  The market isn't likely concerned with how it's being used, just what is being presented.  With the market as the gatekeeper one of the last choke points an amateur has to overcome is their own ability to communicate compelling ideas to an audience.  

I believe it was Daniel Solis who wrote a piece on the secondary market that is build up around Kickstarter.  I could easily see a new "publisher" category of business being created where they are simply a marketing firm that knows how to take a product and sell it well on a crowdfunding site.  They just take a cut from the funding raised and then move onto the next project and leave the creator with their end product and audience.

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;532654This ties into, variously, the "1000 true fans" idea, blogged about by Jerry Pournelle, and the "ransom model" of RPG development, developed by Greg Stolze and Daniel Solis. It also ties into the "Long Tail", which is probably an incorrect model but applicable in this case. (And PBS fund drives, as well.)

Heh... ninja'd!

With most crowdfunding being a de facto pre-order system, I'm not at all surprised that people want an existing body of work. This isn't charity, and people want to know what they're buying.

Nice couple of articles so far. Can't wait to see number 3.

Yes, it should prove interesting.  A question to ask though would be if the type of RPG being sold has any effect on success or failure.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Daddy Warpig;532654Crowdsourcing is the rebirth of the Patron model of art. See: the Pope and Michelangelo. At one point, this was the prevalent model of supporting the arts. A sculptor, painter, composer would get a noble that would pay their bills. In return, the noble got bragging rights to the latest masterpiece.

"Sponsors" are patrons, paying money so that a product they desire will get produced. For this, they get benefits that lower-contributing patrons don't get, and that later customers (people who buy after the product is completed) don't get.

This idea is more democratic than the old patronage system, in that it depends on multiple contributors contributing varying amounts to the product. Hence the "crowd" part of crowd source.

That's quite insightful, so thanks for writing it!

I realised the other day that I'm more comfortable "funding" RPG Kickstarters than I am computer game ones, purely because with an RPG project I'm likely to get the product before I've forgotten about paying for it, whereas most computer game projects seem to be predicting delivery over a year away.

I recently funded an ACKS book, and I believe there may well be something already in the mail for me on that one (international shipping so I won't see it for weeks). Similarly another RPG Kickstarter I pitched in for closed this week and says I should get the book in June.

Quote from: RPGPundit;533128Yes, it should prove interesting.  A question to ask though would be if the type of RPG being sold has any effect on success or failure.

Yeah, my general impression is that content is crucial to the success from looking over all of those projects.  There are several factors that play into success and failure, but I suspect in particular for projects that were very successful a huge contributor was simply tapping into the zeitgeist of the current market.

Examples would be:

Do: Pilgrims of the Flying Temple - If I had a nickle for the number of times I've seen "Last Airbender RPG?" on forums, I'd have... well, a couple of dollars maybe, but that's a lot of nickles!

Monsterhearts - With Twilight, Vampire Diaries... and all the rest.  Just make an RPG focusing on that and you're set.

Tephra - Steampunk all day, every day is what people want right now.

Going by the pulse of talk on forums right now, if someone is looking for a license to print money then they'd assemble a team of artists and put out an RPG that is Mass Effect with the serial numbers filed off.  As long as the campaign is properly organized it should net 10K easily, if not far more.

After awhile I was a bit surprised not to see a Harry Potteresque project.  Now I suppose it's going to be a race to create a teenage dystopia that looks like Battle Royale/Hunger Games.

On the flip side, with unsuccessful projects there were plenty which failed and in part it was due to being essentially just another heartbreaker, or simply someone's home campaign setting.  The ones that were like this that did succeed at their funding levels were able to communicate a specific twist or spin well enough to capture an audience.

Overall, I got the impression that there is a lot of conceptual low hanging fruit out there right now in the marketplace which if you happen to be one of the first few to take the idea and run with it then you can get a decent reward from crowdfunding.

Fascinating. So do you think that knockoffs of popular licensed properties are the ones with the crowdfunding edge?

What about OSR games? Or storygames? How do they do?

RPGPundit

This is one of the more interesting threads I have seen for some time.  Quite excellent Harpy!