Quote from: Silverlion;385842So Mr. Arcane, what makes you like the Decipher books over the LUG ones?

The system, while a bit disorganized, is pretty straight forward to learn for folks familiar with D20, since the basic mechanics are pretty much D20 with smaller numbers and the die changed to 2d6.  

The writing of the books, however, is what really sold me most.  Matt Colville and the rest of the crew and Decipher produced a book that is just chock full of inspiration.  I can't think of any book I've ever read that filled my head with so many ideas by the end of it, that I had to keep a notebook with me because the flood of game ideas never ceased.  

Normally I'll read a game, and even if I like it and think the ideas are cool, I'm often at a loss as to what to actually do with it, and it takes some amount of brainstorming to come up with runnable ideas.  but the DecTrek books the ideas just seemed to roll off the page.  It's the only game I've ever been unequivocally excited about running as a GM, something I generally don't do.

And I also really like the fact that it covers the whole series, and presents a core flexible enough to take on any of the periods in the setting without having to shell out for series specific sourcebooks.  The sourcebooks similarly focus on treating it like a single universe, and so cover things unilaterally.

To me, the LUG approach of treating each series as it's own game makes about as much sense as doing a Star Wars game where you have to buy separate books for the material in each movie.  The only one that stands out as appreciably different enough is the original series, but it's still not so different that it needs it's own game just to cover it.  

DecTrek feels like I could get away with only ever buying the two corebooks, and in fact I never did, though I've heard the sourcebooks are mostly pretty damn good.

Quote from: J Arcane;385848The system, while a bit disorganized, is pretty straight forward to learn for folks familiar with D20, since the basic mechanics are pretty much D20 with smaller numbers and the die changed to 2d6.

Is it similar to the Decipher LotR ruleset?  (I don't have the DecTrek books).

From skimming over my copy of the Decipher LotR core book, is does look like a d20 style system with smaller target numbers and the die change to 2d6.

Quote from: ggroy;385849Is it similar to the Decipher LotR ruleset?  (I don't have the DecTrek books).

From skimming over my copy of the Decipher LotR core book, is does look like a d20 style system with smaller target numbers and the die change to 2d6.

It is fairly similar, and shares the same basic mechanics.

I agree with J Arcane about having one system to cover all eras of play. That is certainly a major shortcoming of ICON. Plus we never got Voyager or Enterprise, not that we actually need them.

I would like to have seen Tellerites and Andorians placed into the DEC Player's Guide rather than a couple of the Voyager specific races that no one will want to play that much.

Like I said. Both of those Star Trek games have their good and bad points.

Quote from: PaladinCA;385869I would like to have seen Tellerites and Andorians placed into the DEC Player's Guide rather than a couple of the Voyager specific races that no one will want to play that much.

I remember talking to one of the developers at Decipher when I was playtesting and writing for their LotR line, and they explained that to the best of their understanding, part of the requirement for the license was that the books support all of the eras/shows equally.

Quote from: jdurall;385879I remember talking to one of the developers at Decipher when I was playtesting and writing for their LotR line, and they explained that to the best of their understanding, part of the requirement for the license was that the books support all of the eras/shows equally.

Ah, well we still could have used Andorians at the very least.

Quote from: Benoist;385820The remark doesn't really compute with me. When I think "Star Trek", I think Original Series, Kirk, Spok, Bones and Co. USS Enterprise, Star Date blablablah.

You, see. I think of TNG.

The series even requires the characters not to be heroes. Not that they are anti-heroes or villains. They are not meant to be exceptional individuals, they are typical representatives of a better humankind. Whatever the characters do or achieve on the grand scale is not attributed to them, but to how humanity has evolved.

At most you may be part of an exceptional crew, but that's it.

That's as different from D&D as you can get.

Quote from: 1of3;385906You, see. I think of TNG.

The series even requires the characters not to be heroes. Not that they are anti-heroes or villains. They are not meant to be exceptional individuals, they are typical representatives of a better humankind. Whatever the characters do or achieve on the grand scale is not attributed to them, but to how humanity has evolved.

At most you may be part of an exceptional crew, but that's it.

That's as different from D&D as you can get.

Huh? :huhsign:

First, you quote my first sentence, without answering the actual points that followed it.
Second your argument... doesn't make any fucking sense to me. Sorry.

But hey. You seem pretty sure of yourself. It's okay.

I've played in 2 lengthy Star Trek campaigns, and ran a few one-shots, All using the FASA system. I've skimmed through the LUG books I own, but would still use FASA.

FASA is easier for getting new players into the game (which I managed rather well), and character creation is genuinely useful and 'realistic'. It did elicit one remark from my players "they teach you a lot of crap at Star Fleet Academy".

Should I? SHOULD I?

Quote from: 1of3;385801Alright, I see your point. It's just this game is quite terrible.

Though I think 1of3 may have gone a bit hyperbolic on their last point, I think their questions are quite valid and have so far been unaddressed. So for efficiency, I ask them again here, only this time using BULLET POINTS!

• Why have stats for different species?
• Why have stats for starships?
• Why have a list of subspace phenomena separate from their function as a plot device?

Because see, a lot of RPGs tend to throw in lots of lists of things and numbers, and the feel of Star Trek is not captured in these. So I'm wondering what the Decipher books did that actually caught the feel of Star Trek, because all I got was a book that actively insulted my intelligence with its poor organization and lack of clarity.

Take your forgey bollocks to some other thread please.

We get it, you think actually having stats for things in a Trek RPG are bad.

Ok, go play Primetime Adventures.

I think clearly you need stats for starships, which are elements in the show as much as characters.  

One thing I'd agree with, though, is that I don't agree about having standard packages for races.  Since the original series, Star Trek aliens have been one-offs and/or unique individuals like Data, half-breeds like Spock or Troi, etc.  New alien races are introduced every other episode. So rather than having specific rules for each race, and only being allowed to make a character from one of the designated races, I think the game should just have rules for designing your own alien character.  

Games like this include Star Wars D6, Nexus, and the Angel RPG as well as generic sets like GURPS or the HERO System.

Quote from: CRKrueger;386036Ok, go play Primetime Adventures.

Or you could download and play Where No Man Has Gone Before, a Microlite 20 game that really gets the feel of the original series in a way that Decipher, and LUG, and even FASA never quite got right.  And it's even based on the d20 system for the sake of familiarity and functional adaptation.

And, to the point, no, I didn't like the Decipher Trek books, or the LUG books for that matter.  I liked the FASA series, but that was mostly because of the background and setting material they produced -- the mechanics always eventually stuck in my craw.

Quote from: J Arcane;385738Noble Knight was running a sale on all the books, so I finally replaced my lost copies of the corebooks for a mere $40 total.

Looking forward to reading them again.

Not to play them?  It all comes into focus...

!i!

Quote from: CRKrueger;386036Ok, go play Primetime Adventures.

I actually tried that for Star Trek. While it's fine game (and I had much fun playing other campaigns with it), its main strength is character drama, which isn't that central to Star Trek. Might be the reason why Star Trek is not mentioned in the PtA rule book.