Why? Simplicity and ease of use.

QuoteIn a broad way, game designers use armor as an absolute avoidance value system (it decides whether you get hit or not, period..armor class is a perfect example), or as a protective value ( the armor stops a certain amount of damage, Tunnells and Trolls is a good example). There are a few other ideas, but 90% of the systems start here.

Good summary for most systems, though, again, there is a 3rd approach of 'armour as extra hit points'--which is what you get when armour stops damage the overwhelming majority of the time + you have ablation.
I don't like the approach particularly - I don't think armour should disappear when you hit it - but the approach is there.

The funniest example of armour ablation is in Palladium Fantasy I think - the weakest armour there (either padded or leather, I can't remember) has about 5 SDC --so if someone with no modifiers hits you with a punch (and assuming you don't dodge) there's about a 75% chance they bypass your armour entirely for full damage, a 20% chance its a wild swing and they miss, and a 5% chance that they hit your armour and destroy it (so that it falls off, leaving you naked ).

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;373039Good summary for most systems, though, again, there is a 3rd approach of 'armour as extra hit points'--which is what you get when armour stops damage the overwhelming majority of the time + you have ablation.
I don't like the approach particularly - I don't think armour should disappear when you hit it - but the approach is there.

The funniest example of armour ablation is in Palladium Fantasy I think - the weakest armour there (either padded or leather, I can't remember) has about 5 SDC --so if someone with no modifiers hits you with a punch (and assuming you don't dodge) there's about a 75% chance they bypass your armour entirely for full damage, a 20% chance its a wild swing and they miss, and a 5% chance that they hit your armour and destroy it (so that it falls off, leaving you naked ).

You know, I added it in at first, and erased it as a seperate approach as it is sort of in the protection school...but I am happy to add it in...

I like ablative armors in theory.   In actual play, its another number to track and another pull from the immersion toward the mechanics.

In Tunnels & Trolls, we use "burning armor" as a player option.  Let's say you have 10 CON left (its your HP) and 7 AR chainmail.  If you take 20 damage, your would normally die.  But, we allow the player to destroy their armor for double the AR value, so the 20 damage destroys the chainmail and the character takes 4 CON left.  Bleeding, smashed, covered in broken armor but alive.

I am unsure if this was our houserule or something in the book.  

In my new RPG, I am considering just making Armor = + X HP while worn.  Like Fifth Element said, simplicity and ease.

Quote from: One Horse Town;372709There are plentiful real-life stories about a book or cigarette case taking a bullet, why isn't this factored into damage in games? How would you factor this into a game?

For me, that's the sort of thing I'd describe to a character's player as say a guy shoots at him, rolls, hits, and then, for his dodge attempt, the player rolls a critical success. Then, I describe how the movement was perfect etc... but the bullet hit him in the heart anyway.

The player then would go: "What the FUCK?"

Then, I describe that he realizes he is completely unscathed, and his cigarette case took the bullet.

Win.

It's all about interpretation, to me. The same way, the way a guy misses an attack roll during a 1 minute round doesn't mean he didn't hit his opponent, necessarily. He might have hit the opponent multiple times, but didn't actually do any significant damage. He didn't necessarily hit at all, however. It all depends on the flow of the game, how it unfolds, particular situations, etc.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;372712A lot of games factor armor into damage, as damage reduction. Even factoring it into the armor class, technically impacts the amount of damage you sustain, so you could argue it is being factored in there as well. I think including stray items on your person however, would get a little on the complex side.

Good point.  A higher armour class means you are hit less often, so the average damage over time is lower.  Not directly absorbing damage, but more like absorbing the kinetic energy behind the damage.

The original Deadlands (can't speak for the Savage Worlds version) had essentially three types of health:

Wind
Wounds
Poker Chips.

So a lot of hits just sucked the wind out of you, leaving you out of sorts but essentially uninjured.  

Then you got fucked up by a real hit that actually wounded you.

Which you could totally avoid by tossing a poker chip at the GM and saying 'hit my bong, dude.  I'm cool."

Of course, that meant the GM had a poker chip to use against the party later... but whatever.

The times I played the game it seemed that the poker chips were perfect. Maybe the GM was just Shit Hot about them (cause he sucked in many other ways...Can you said Plot Railroad? I knew you could....).   the Chips represented a bunch of shit, including your XP, so spending them SHOULD have hurt like shit, but we players tossed them around freely to avoid dropping out of fights, to do some crazy spectacular shit or whatnot, and we still had enough to 'progress' in game terms.

In Hero System, that would be Damage Resistance with some form of Activation Roll - Probably 8- or 9- on 3d6. Hit Location armour is a form of Activation roll.

Either that, or a special effect of your Luck roll.

Possibly, Body/Stun that's not added to your total, with an Activation Roll.

Or a really small Barrier (Mobile).

Hero System: More ways to skin a cat...

What if your bodily health is less important than what you're carrying and what's inside you? Sure, damage can impinge on your physical capabilities, but your equipment is your key to survival.

So damage progresses like this. The more damage taken, the further along the progression track the damage goes - Armour, Equipment, Physical, Internal.  

(* This is forked off from my Toys thread BTW

Quote from: One Horse Town;373083What if your bodily health is less important than what you're carrying and what's inside you? Sure, damage can impinge on your physical capabilities, but your equipment is your key to survival.

So damage progresses like this. The more damage taken, the further along the progression track the damage goes - Armour, Equipment, Physical, Internal.  

(* This is forked off from my Toys thread BTW

Bodily health LESS important?  you mean further 'downstream' in terms of the damage taken system?
and are you thinking an amount, a percentage?  and ablative, in this case?

Quote from: LordVreeg;373097Bodily health LESS important?  

Correct!

That battery charger, flashlight and shovel are the difference between life and death. Meanwhile, although a hindrance, getting a nasty gash in your rag-doll arm and losing some stuffing isn't. However, that power source inside you, next to your voice-box and internal amplifier, is your very life-blood.

Thus a damage track of:- Armour - Equipment - Physical - Internal.

Quote from: One Horse Town;373118Correct!

That battery charger, flashlight and shovel are the difference between life and death. Meanwhile, although a hindrance, getting a nasty gash in your rag-doll arm and losing some stuffing isn't. However, that power source inside you, next to your voice-box and internal amplifier, is your very life-blood.

Thus a damage track of:- Armour - Equipment - Physical - Internal.

OK. So I'm on it now.

How are you tracking health?  how lethal do you want this to be?  and this will help you get your numbers the rest of the way...

Quote from: LordVreeg;373119OK. So I'm on it now.

How are you tracking health?  how lethal do you want this to be?  and this will help you get your numbers the rest of the way...

I wasn't going to have health at all. Physical damage, although it'll have some mechanical effect can't kill you. Instead i'm going for your Power Source (whether that be clockwork, battery powered, or fuel cell) being your 'hit points'.

This does raise one bit of resource management that'll be a bit unusual - simply being active drains your effective hit points (ie your Power Source, your batteries drain down, you need winding up again etc).

Your Power Source will be intenral, so hardest to damage directly, but it's doable. 'Healing' will be charging up the batteries etc.

I think you just reproduced Starfire as an individual skirmish-level combat game.

Could be fun, actually.

Quote from: Elliot Wilen;373139I think you just reproduced Starfire as an individual skirmish-level combat game.

Could be fun, actually.

Similar.

Manikins RPG

Chargen - You select a 'chasis' which is what material you are made of, leather, cloth, plastic, porcelain, metal, and choose modules for what you are capable of. The other thought is just have ready to use characters like China Figurine, Rag Doll, Plastic Robot, Clockwork Chicken etc

It's supposed to be post-apocalyptic, so what started the apocalypse affects the game assumptions.

So far i have -

Manikins vs Robots!
Manikins vs Aliens!
Manikins vs Monsters!
Manikins vs The Third Reich!
Manikins vs Giants!
Manikins vs The Bomb!
Manikins vs Zombies!