Quote from: obrynMan, I hope they combine Listen and Spot as they did in SWSE...  Sadly, it doesn't look like it from that card.

The speculation (that's pretty much all this is) is that they are actually combined. This would be just a further "specialization" to further differenciate certain creatures and characters. I guess it would make sense that some creatures or characters have one "super sense", or other focused skills but I could have lived without it.

Quote from: One Horse TownI nearly posted a link to this earlier, but didn't, because my initial thoughts were negative. It's great that the stat line is simpler. I'm all for that, but something about it doesn't jive with me. It might be irational, but the presentation of the two cards seems off for starters, before you even compare the two sets of stats. The 4e one just looks like it's been sucked of its flavour. No picture (like i said, a bit irational) for starters. I dunno, it seems more like a CCG card than the stat block for a meaningful opponent. I'm sure that the full entry in the MM will add bits of flavour, but i was sort of meh when i saw it. I wait to be proved wrong when the stuff actually comes out.

I agree a little. My biggest worry is that the 5 round idea will mean that the fun bits like ecology will get the short shrift, even in the MM.

OTOH, this slimmed down block will be even better if they decide to keep the template system alive. It's like having the stripped down body of a monster so if I wanna add spoilers and spinning rims on that bad body, the block will still be managable.

Quote from: Consonant DudeI'm not up to date on mini stuff, but isn't that what they currently do with 3rd edition?

Yes.  Nothing new here.

One side's mini game stats, the other side is RPG stats.

There's no sinister plan here.  Or at least, no more sinister plan than there was in 3e.

-O

You call that streamlined!  :eek:

That makes the back of a baseball card look like a forgie game.  I wasn't really expecting 4e to appeal to me, but I expected something a little easier than that.  I could probably fit the stats for an entire Savage Worlds adventure into the back of that card.

Thank god I have alternatives to D&D in my gaming life.

Quote from: walkerpYou call that streamlined!  :eek:

That makes the back of a baseball card look like a forgie game.  I wasn't really expecting 4e to appeal to me, but I expected something a little easier than that.  I could probably fit the stats for an entire Savage Worlds adventure into the back of that card.

Doubtful. A have the stat blocks for wolves and zombies for a SW adventure I ran and they are less detailed than these, but it's still a lot of information. Don't even get me started on the vampire. Maybe they've streamlined them comsiderably in further editions? I have the first one.

Quote from: walkerpThank god I have alternatives to D&D in my gaming life.

Good for you. Savage Worlds was not a hit with my group at all.

But this makes me curious. What does a stat block look like in Aces and Eights? I seem to remember you liked that game.

Quote from: walkerpThat makes the back of a baseball card look like a forgie game.  I wasn't really expecting 4e to appeal to me, but I expected something a little easier than that.  I could probably fit the stats for an entire Savage Worlds adventure into the back of that card.

The bottom card is from an older edition isn't it? The top card is certainly a vast improvement in ease of reference and isn't at all overwhelming.

What's up with the 'Bloodied' thing? Is D&D going to have wounds affect your abilities, now? Pretty interesting, if so (and a HUGE change).

Tim

Quote from: TimThe bottom card is from an older edition isn't it? The top card is certainly a vast improvement in ease of reference and isn't at all overwhelming.

Oh, it's two cards!  D'oh!  I thought the whole thing was the new stat block.   Well, that's not so bad then.  Though you have to admit that the one above benefits a lot from superior layout.  Still it does seem to be a bit more boiled down.  Not my cup of tea, but I take back my initial shock.

Quote from: TimWhat's up with the 'Bloodied' thing? Is D&D going to have wounds affect your abilities, now? Pretty interesting, if so (and a HUGE change).

Tim

That's what jumped out at me, too. I didn't see any alternate diminished stats for a bloody state, so I wonder what the effects are.

Quote from: HaffrungThat's what jumped out at me, too. I didn't see any alternate diminished stats for a bloody state, so I wonder what the effects are.

Good point. Maybe it will be some sort of across-the-board flat rate penalty. Or not!

Quote from: Consonant DudeUnless I don't understand what you mean, mathematically, it's impossible to get the same results. They probably wanted to avoid bigger numbers, especially with a 1-30 level progression.

I mean that if you've got a 14 strength and add +1 to your modifier every even level, isn't that the same as adding +1 to your ability score every level? So instead of a constant 14 with a +2 modifier at first level, a +3 at second, and a +4 at fourth, couldn't you just start with a 15 (+2) and go up one every level (+3  mod at second, +4 mod at fourth, etc.)

Or something like that.

Quote from: Consonant DudeI picked it up from ENWorld/RPG.net. It's apparently a card from some tournament event or something. This is the backside of a D&D mini card, which lists the roleplaying stats of a creature.

Link to source?  i.e. Who's claiming this is a real 4E card?

I'm not doubting it exactly, I just want to see exactly what it is.

From your travelling 4e simian, I bring the following:

That's almost certainly an accurate stat block - there's almost nothing on it we didn't know, though the +1/2 your level to stats thing is new and almost certainly for monsters only, to reduce the skill shopping element.

The D&D Game Day Mini is to be the Spined Devil, so I'm fairly certain that image is accurate.

A variation of 'Bloodied' appears in MM5; it's just 1/2 your HP, and certain effects or abilities are triggered by entering the Bloodied state, may only target Bloodied creatures, or has additional effects on Bloodied creatures. Some of this may be extrapolation from what's actually been said.

What i ideally want to see is not every creature having a single role statblock. All Spined Devils = 6th Level Skirmishers? or is the example that of a 6th level Skirmisher? With the smaller space required for each gribbly, can we expect a similar statblock for Spined Devil mooks, brutes, masterminds etc?

Barring that, i want information on how to alter the creature statblocks so as to alter their role. Templates would be the easiest way to do this, i guess. But the thought of each monster entry only fulfilling one role sort of gets my back up. I really hope there is at least advice on how to change the roles. You could do this at the beginning of the relevant sections. There's loads of Devils. If you started off with advice on how to change the roles, with typical powers added etc, they become customisable. I don't think this will happen though, which is a shame.

Over in games like Microlite 20 and Castes & Crusades, characters and critters get a nearly-global attribute check bonus based on level or hit dice.  

I think that's a brilliant idea.  It's fast, it's simple, it makes a kind of "Okay good now roll!" sense.

That's not to say, "Well, C&C already HAS that, blah mwah snark feh blaaargh".  On the contrary, seeing it applied to D&D rules is very, very cool.  

Because it's NEAT!

Mmmm...: