Are humans mandatory for a setting to succeed?

bat · April 04, 2025, 11:21:36 PM

Where exactly did he say this? I looked around and there is a huge variety of human races in the Lord of the Rings alone, (from the Dunedain to the Wild Men to the Wood Woses and many in between} which was written years after The Hobbit, which was a story written for his own children and presumably, not gone into such depth as later works even though a skeleton of The Silmarillion pre-dates The Hobbit, it was very rough. One thing Tolkien undoubtedly said was that he put no allegories into his writing.

Mishihari · **Today** at 01:29:45 AM

Quote from: bat on April 04, 2025, 11:21:36 PMWhere exactly did he say this? I looked around and there is a huge variety of human races in the Lord of the Rings alone, (from the Dunedain to the Wild Men to the Wood Woses and many in between} which was written years after The Hobbit, which was a story written for his own children and presumably, not gone into such depth as later works even though a skeleton of The Silmarillion pre-dates The Hobbit, it was very rough. One thing Tolkien undoubtedly said was that he put no allegories into his writing.

It was an interview. He said that hobbits are the quiet, stay at home nature of men, dwarves are the greedy part, elves are something else, and humanity in LotR is too complicated to explain right now. A quick google search didn't turn it up, but whatever, I read it a long time ago

bat · **Today** at 12:32:05 PM

Fair enough, not EVERYTHING is online.

RPGPundit · **Today** at 04:23:04 PM

If there aren't any humans in the setting, the setting will have a race that are all basically human.

Every other race is either a stereotype, or also human. Someone really creative might make a race that is truly and sincerely ALIEN; but then they would be unplayable, unless in actual play they get turned into a human stereotype, or just human.

D-ko · **Today** at 04:52:35 PM

It seems like there's a caveman rpg where you're literally not allowed to use words. I forget the name.

Trond · **Today** at 06:05:45 PM

Quote from: Mishihari on Today at 01:29:45 AM
Quote from: bat on April 04, 2025, 11:21:36 PMWhere exactly did he say this? I looked around and there is a huge variety of human races in the Lord of the Rings alone, (from the Dunedain to the Wild Men to the Wood Woses and many in between} which was written years after The Hobbit, which was a story written for his own children and presumably, not gone into such depth as later works even though a skeleton of The Silmarillion pre-dates The Hobbit, it was very rough. One thing Tolkien undoubtedly said was that he put no allegories into his writing.

It was an interview. He said that hobbits are the quiet, stay at home nature of men, dwarves are the greedy part, elves are something else, and humanity in LotR is too complicated to explain right now. A quick google search didn't turn it up, but whatever, I read it a long time ago

What I get from it is that elves are more what humans are not. Apart from languages and myth, Tolkien pondered a lot about death. One of the most interesting things about elves is that they are basically immortal.

Mishihari · **Today** at 06:47:19 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on Today at 04:23:04 PMIf there aren't any humans in the setting, the setting will have a race that are all basically human.

Every other race is either a stereotype, or also human. Someone really creative might make a race that is truly and sincerely ALIEN; but then they would be unplayable, unless in actual play they get turned into a human stereotype, or just human.

A lot of people share your opinion and it may be right, but it's one I like to challenge. The best counterexample I've found is CJ Cherryh's Compact Space books. She has a whole set of wonderfully fleshed out and believable alien races, and I think I could play most of them true to their nature, particularly the hani, mahendo'sat, and kif.

ForgottenF · **Today** at 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on Today at 04:23:04 PMIf there aren't any humans in the setting, the setting will have a race that are all basically human.

Every other race is either a stereotype, or also human. Someone really creative might make a race that is truly and sincerely ALIEN; but then they would be unplayable, unless in actual play they get turned into a human stereotype, or just human.

I agree with this. It's the reason I often don't bother with non-humans in my own settings, but it's also the reason I don't mind settings where non-humans predominate. In the end it's really all the same.