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Orcs removed from the D&D 6E Monster Manual?!

Started by weirdguy564, January 31, 2025, 09:29:02 PM

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weirdguy564

January 31, 2025, 09:29:02 PM
I saw the latest video from ClownFish channel on YouTube.  The topic was the removal of Orcs from the Monster Manual for current day D&D.


I'm ok with this.  It will drive fans away, and D&D has had too much of a monopoly on the tabletop RPG industry.  Go play other games.

Free games: Olde Swords Reign, Mini-Six Bare Bones, Pocket Fantasy, Basic Fantasy, Castles and Crusades 7th printing.

Paid games:  Shadowdark, Old School Essentials, Kogarashi/True D6 Printable Edition, Dungeons and Delvers Dice Pool edition.

Just, for the love of all that is normal, don't play D&D from the current idiots.
I'm glad for you if you like the top selling game of the genre.  Me, I like the road less travelled, and will be the player asking we try a game you've never heard of.

Ruprecht

#1
January 31, 2025, 10:45:09 PM
Weren't the Mexican orcs in one of the 2024 books? How can they get rid of half-orcs and Orcs and still have that picture?
Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing. ~Robert E. Howard

Man at Arms

#2
January 31, 2025, 11:16:10 PM
Quote from: Ruprecht on January 31, 2025, 10:45:09 PMWeren't the Mexican orcs in one of the 2024 books? How can they get rid of half-orcs and Orcs and still have that picture?


"Because they're stupid", for the win!!!

The Mexican Orcs, are in the 2024 PHB.

krillin

#3
January 31, 2025, 11:41:00 PM
Didn't they just move the stat blocks for a bunch of humanoids (like Orc) to a big "humanoid" section?  Like now we have a whole slough of blocks for Orcs where as before we had like 3.  Not sure what all the fuss is about if new DMs are given 30 different flavors of Orc to send at PCs.

Tristan

#4
January 31, 2025, 11:44:43 PM
Orcs are considered a playable humanoid race, and so removed. I believe Drow and Duergar are gone as well.  Most of the former humanoid creatures are now something else (Fay, Aberrations, etc.) (and how is Aberration not a 'problematic' phrase?).
There is a generic humanoid stat block now.

Oh and liches have Spirit Jars not Phylacteries.

 

Chris24601

#5
February 01, 2025, 12:11:03 AM
Quote from: Tristan on January 31, 2025, 11:44:43 PMOh and liches have Spirit Jars not Phylacteries.
To be fair on this one at least, unless it's literally two leather boxes containing parchment with Hebrew scripture and strapped to the forehead and left arm for morning prayers... Spirit Jar is probably a more accurate term given that in D&D since at least 3e the device could be practically anything and was rarely if ever actually carried by the Lich.

I think all the humanoid races should have their own entries though, just because they're playable doesn't make them universally allies. Look at how much we humans seem to love going at each other.

jhkim

#6
February 01, 2025, 12:39:08 AM
Quote from: krillin on January 31, 2025, 11:41:00 PMDidn't they just move the stat blocks for a bunch of humanoids (like Orc) to a big "humanoid" section?  Like now we have a whole slough of blocks for Orcs where as before we had like 3.  Not sure what all the fuss is about if new DMs are given 30 different flavors of Orc to send at PCs.

Quote from: Chris24601 on February 01, 2025, 12:11:03 AM
Quote from: Tristan on January 31, 2025, 11:44:43 PMOh and liches have Spirit Jars not Phylacteries.

To be fair on this one at least, unless it's literally two leather boxes containing parchment with Hebrew scripture and strapped to the forehead and left arm for morning prayers... Spirit Jar is probably a more accurate term given that in D&D since at least 3e the device could be practically anything and was rarely if ever actually carried by the Lich.

I think all the humanoid races should have their own entries though, just because they're playable doesn't make them universally allies. Look at how much we humans seem to love going at each other.

Right. And there has never been a generic stat block for "human". And as of 5E (2014), we also didn't have separate stat blocks for "elf", "dwarf", "halfling" and so on. Instead, we had stat blocks for different types of NPCs based on profession like "bandit", "cultist", "guard" - and it was noted that the GM could add racial traits to them.

krillin suggests that now there are multiple humanoid stat blocks. How many are there? Does this mean that there are humanoid templates like "soldier", "scout", "captain", "war chief" similar to NPCs in the 2014 rules? I can see the sense of having more variety that way.

Ratman_tf

#7
February 01, 2025, 02:39:46 AM
Quote from: jhkim on February 01, 2025, 12:39:08 AM
Quote from: krillin on January 31, 2025, 11:41:00 PMDidn't they just move the stat blocks for a bunch of humanoids (like Orc) to a big "humanoid" section?  Like now we have a whole slough of blocks for Orcs where as before we had like 3.  Not sure what all the fuss is about if new DMs are given 30 different flavors of Orc to send at PCs.

Quote from: Chris24601 on February 01, 2025, 12:11:03 AM
Quote from: Tristan on January 31, 2025, 11:44:43 PMOh and liches have Spirit Jars not Phylacteries.

To be fair on this one at least, unless it's literally two leather boxes containing parchment with Hebrew scripture and strapped to the forehead and left arm for morning prayers... Spirit Jar is probably a more accurate term given that in D&D since at least 3e the device could be practically anything and was rarely if ever actually carried by the Lich.

I think all the humanoid races should have their own entries though, just because they're playable doesn't make them universally allies. Look at how much we humans seem to love going at each other.

Right. And there has never been a generic stat block for "human".

https://archive.org/details/tsr02102mc1monstrouscompendium/page/n91/mode/2up

The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

Ratman_tf

#8
February 01, 2025, 02:53:09 AM
Quote from: krillin on January 31, 2025, 11:41:00 PMDidn't they just move the stat blocks for a bunch of humanoids (like Orc) to a big "humanoid" section?  Like now we have a whole slough of blocks for Orcs where as before we had like 3.  Not sure what all the fuss is about if new DMs are given 30 different flavors of Orc to send at PCs.

IMO "Humanoid" is too broad a category for the Monster Manual. Each entry should give stats, lore and ideas on how to use that specific monster in the game.
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

Kahoona

#9
February 01, 2025, 05:10:08 AM
Quote from: Ratman_tf on February 01, 2025, 02:53:09 AM
Quote from: krillin on January 31, 2025, 11:41:00 PMDidn't they just move the stat blocks for a bunch of humanoids (like Orc) to a big "humanoid" section?  Like now we have a whole slough of blocks for Orcs where as before we had like 3.  Not sure what all the fuss is about if new DMs are given 30 different flavors of Orc to send at PCs.

IMO "Humanoid" is too broad a category for the Monster Manual. Each entry should give stats, lore and ideas on how to use that specific monster in the game.


You fool. You've already spoiled the surprise! The future 6E edition "Profession Portfolio"!

Zalman

#10
February 01, 2025, 05:19:31 AM
Quote from: Chris24601 on February 01, 2025, 12:11:03 AM
Quote from: Tristan on January 31, 2025, 11:44:43 PMOh and liches have Spirit Jars not Phylacteries.
To be fair on this one at least, unless it's literally two leather boxes containing parchment with Hebrew scripture and strapped to the forehead and left arm for morning prayers... Spirit Jar is probably a more accurate term given that in D&D since at least 3e the device could be practically anything and was rarely if ever actually carried by the Lich.

Yeah, as a Jew I always found the use of the word jarringly incorrect, but never offensive.

What does offend me is some goy telling me that the word needs to be removed for my sake. Trust me, "some of that guy's best friends are Jewish."
Old School? Back in my day we just called it "School."

Melan

#11
February 01, 2025, 05:29:24 AM
"A coward dies a thousand times before his death, but the valiant taste of death but once. It seems to me most strange that men should fear, seeing that death, a necessary end, will come when it will come."

D&D fans only had to say "no" once to these screeching harridans. Only once. They will lose everything, and they will deserve it.
Now with a Zine!
ⓘ This post is disputed by official sources

Skullking

#12
February 01, 2025, 06:49:38 AM
Quote from: Chris24601 on February 01, 2025, 12:11:03 AMTo be fair on this one at least, unless it's literally two leather boxes containing parchment with Hebrew scripture and strapped to the forehead and left arm for morning prayers... Spirit Jar is probably a more accurate term given that in D&D since at least 3e the device could be practically anything and was rarely if ever actually carried by the Lich.

It is not that it has changed but the reason why. WotC may later hide behind the smokescreen that phylactery wasn't an accurate term but we all know the real reason why it was changed.

Mind you, given the current Jew hate on the left, I wouldn't have been surprised if they continued to call it a phylactery.

Exploderwizard

#13
February 01, 2025, 08:18:35 AM
It seems strange not to include the orc merely because it is now a playable race. Humans, elves, dwarves, gnomes, & halflings have always had a MM entry. Very strange and very stupid.
Quote from: JonWakeGamers, as a whole, are much like primitive cavemen when confronted with a new game. Rather than \'oh, neat, what\'s this do?\', the reaction is to decide if it\'s a sex hole, then hit it with a rock.

Quote from: Old Geezer;724252At some point it seems like D&D is going to disappear up its own ass.

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;766997In the randomness of the dice lies the seed for the great oak of creativity and fun. The great virtue of the dice is that they come without boxed text.

Chris24601

#14
February 01, 2025, 08:43:25 AM
Quote from: Zalman on February 01, 2025, 05:19:31 AM
Quote from: Chris24601 on February 01, 2025, 12:11:03 AM
Quote from: Tristan on January 31, 2025, 11:44:43 PMOh and liches have Spirit Jars not Phylacteries.
To be fair on this one at least, unless it's literally two leather boxes containing parchment with Hebrew scripture and strapped to the forehead and left arm for morning prayers... Spirit Jar is probably a more accurate term given that in D&D since at least 3e the device could be practically anything and was rarely if ever actually carried by the Lich.

Yeah, as a Jew I always found the use of the word jarringly incorrect, but never offensive.

What does offend me is some goy telling me that the word needs to be removed for my sake. Trust me, "some of that guy's best friends are Jewish."
I think it needed to removed for the same reason I don't like seeing claymore or zweihander or brigandine in fantasy equipment lists (unless it's literally historical Earth). In terms of the historic users and their languages they're 'Big Sword' and 'Two-Hander' and 'soldier's armor' (though for clarity I'd call it a 'coat of plates').

So to actually have the feel of a native in the fantasy society (where common isn't actually English except by convention for the audience) those things should be called what they would in the vernacular.

Spirit Jar just feels like what it should be called in a vernacular fashion.
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