Quote from: Mistwell on August 28, 2024, 04:51:21 PM

Quote from: blackstone on August 28, 2024, 02:42:28 PM

Quote from: Nobleshield on August 26, 2024, 09:07:15 AMThey just went back on it, it seems.

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1806-2024-d-d-beyond-ruleset-changelog-update

Mistwell,

Please care to explain the above link?

Sure, what do you want to know, and what does this have to do with the topic?

That WoTC went back from going full digital by delaying it for a year it seems.

Quote from: Mistwell on August 28, 2024, 04:52:46 PM

Quote from: blackstone on August 28, 2024, 03:23:15 PM...and yet you could have done the mature thing by contacting Pundit via PM and resolve things discretely, without fanfare or hostility.

He came after me, directly, in a video. The topic was raised to him by others in this thread. He continued to come after me in this thread directly. Why would it be on me to contact him discreetly to resolve it. Dude just started taking shots at me publicly, as a publisher and guy who runs this site, and it's on me to smooth things over?

I would LOVE to know what it would take for people to hold Pundit accountable for his asshattery here.

Pundit and my friend and associate of the Roll For Initiative podcast (Vince) has a bit of a misunderstanding about what each other was about a few years ago. I could have "called him out" in public. But I didn't. I'm PM'ed Pundit about the situation, they cleared things up, and everything was water under the bridge.

It was a big deal to me, because Vince is a good friend of mine, and I held Pundit in the highest regard. I now consider him a friend as well. Best friends? No. But a friend nonetheless.

So, I decided to do what mature adults do: talk to him about it personally, without fanfare and name calling.

With that being said, yes, it was incumbent upon you to "extend and olive branch" if you will. Instead you went right to scorched earth by using words like "liar", "weasel", "dumb", and "coward".

I'll just leave it at that.

Quote from: Omega on August 28, 2024, 07:41:37 PMMight b actually worse if it is a "reimagining" as that is the codeword for "we slapped the title of a known IP on this thing we had laying around."

This is what I am wondering as well. I really don't care what digital stuff WOTC wants to do or what physical products they want to publish. The important thing - is the product going to be super lame and wearing the skin of a beloved piece of D&D history? Based on track record alone the magic 8 ball says likely yes.

Quote from: blackstone on August 28, 2024, 07:52:57 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on August 28, 2024, 04:51:21 PM

Quote from: blackstone on August 28, 2024, 02:42:28 PM

Quote from: Nobleshield on August 26, 2024, 09:07:15 AMThey just went back on it, it seems.

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1806-2024-d-d-beyond-ruleset-changelog-update

Mistwell,

Please care to explain the above link?

Sure, what do you want to know, and what does this have to do with the topic?

That WoTC went back from going full digital by delaying it for a year it seems.

That announcement says nothing about delaying anything. It says people with the 2014 version of the rules will continue to be able to use the 2014 versions on D&DBeyond. Those who also get the 2024 version can access both versions.

There's no mention at all of this being time limited, delayed, nor requiring the VTT in that announcement.

Are you sure you linked to the right page?

Quote from: Mistwell on August 28, 2024, 02:03:19 PMDid the other remakes over the years not count too?

The only part of this argument between Mistell and Pundit that gets on my nerves is this part.

No. For me, they did not count. I believe that they were poorly done, and did not measure up well with the original adventures at all.

I know the crowd they were designed for gobbled them all up like hotcakes (or something), but I found them lackluster at best. I guess since I only have a weenie and not a weenie and/or vageenie and don't subscribe to the pronoun clowns or dye my hair multiple colors or claim to be a victim multiple times over, none of it resonated with me very deeply.

Lying, implies one KNOWS whatever one's saying is false.

Conversely one can make a claim/prediction and be wrong, fully, partially or by a matter of degree.

Quote from: Chris24601 on August 28, 2024, 08:41:25 PM

Quote from: blackstone on August 28, 2024, 07:52:57 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on August 28, 2024, 04:51:21 PM

Quote from: blackstone on August 28, 2024, 02:42:28 PM

Quote from: Nobleshield on August 26, 2024, 09:07:15 AMThey just went back on it, it seems.

https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1806-2024-d-d-beyond-ruleset-changelog-update

Mistwell,

Please care to explain the above link?

Sure, what do you want to know, and what does this have to do with the topic?

That WoTC went back from going full digital by delaying it for a year it seems.

That announcement says nothing about delaying anything. It says people with the 2014 version of the rules will continue to be able to use the 2014 versions on D&DBeyond. Those who also get the 2024 version can access both versions.

There's no mention at all of this being time limited, delayed, nor requiring the VTT in that announcement.

Ok, that's fair.

Quote from: Mistwell on August 28, 2024, 04:54:18 PMMore details from the Starter Set, reinforcing this isn't just some reprint:

"Heroes of the Borderlands (working title) makes it easy to start playing D&D in minutes with a quick-start guide; intuitive, component-centric character creation; and a modular, introductory adventure. It reimagines B2: The Keep on the Borderlands—a classic introductory D&D adventure—for use with this boxed set by splitting the adventure into three self-contained booklets: the Caves of Chaos, the Keep on the Borderlands, and the Wilderness. Each booklet includes a short tutorial to help new and returning players learn as they go. A how-to-play video will also accompany the release."

Yeah, that's a new publication.

Gee, it sounds like they're taking the same material as before and just converting it to 5E.

"Reimagining" is a lazy term for "we're creatively bankrupt, cheap, and can't come up with any new material that's good"

sort of like how Star Trek was recently "reimagined".

There's nothing in this announcement that contradicts what I've been saying. I said from the start that they were publishing the new edition books because they know that's an instant cash grab (and WotC desperately need instant cash grabs). I even added that if the books sell extremely well (beyond pre-orders, that is, people have a chance to look at the books and decide they're actually worth it) they may put out more publications than they otherwise would. I also said that if the VTT turns out to be a disaster (which it could be), there's a chance that they might try going back to books (though there's an even bigger chance they might just farm out the D&D IP in the form of a license).

The basic set is part of that initial publication cash-grab, and the Forgotten Realms product was almost certainly planned from the start (that is, two+ years ago) when they may not even have been sure if they were going full digital as a strategy. It may even have predated Cynthia Williams. There may have been other books planned, which were dropped when she called for going all-in on the VTT, dumping their distributor, and firing most of their writers. But it makes sense to keep the FR set because if anything has a chance of making money, it's selling the first new FR set in decades to FR fanboys.

Quote from: blackstone on August 28, 2024, 09:37:56 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on August 28, 2024, 04:54:18 PMMore details from the Starter Set, reinforcing this isn't just some reprint:

"Heroes of the Borderlands (working title) makes it easy to start playing D&D in minutes with a quick-start guide; intuitive, component-centric character creation; and a modular, introductory adventure. It reimagines B2: The Keep on the Borderlands—a classic introductory D&D adventure—for use with this boxed set by splitting the adventure into three self-contained booklets: the Caves of Chaos, the Keep on the Borderlands, and the Wilderness. Each booklet includes a short tutorial to help new and returning players learn as they go. A how-to-play video will also accompany the release."

Yeah, that's a new publication.

Gee, it sounds like they're taking the same material as before and just converting it to 5E.

"Reimagining" is a lazy term for "we're creatively bankrupt, cheap, and can't come up with any new material that's good"

sort of like how Star Trek was recently "reimagined".

Re-imagined more often means "we slapped an IP on something barely related."

Nu Trek, Nu BSG, nu fucking everything at this point. nu Mission Impossible shared practically nothing with its origins other than them being maybe spies. The list is long of these abominations.

From how they were talking about the VTT recently, it sounds like they will want to add all kinds of other non-D&D hasbro IP to the thing over time. How many of you will be looking forward to "D&D: My Little Pony"?

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 29, 2024, 03:26:39 AMThere's nothing in this announcement that contradicts what I've been saying. I said from the start that they were publishing the new edition books because they know that's an instant cash grab (and WotC desperately need instant cash grabs). I even added that if the books sell extremely well (beyond pre-orders, that is, people have a chance to look at the books and decide they're actually worth it) they may put out more publications than they otherwise would. I also said that if the VTT turns out to be a disaster (which it could be), there's a chance that they might try going back to books (though there's an even bigger chance they might just farm out the D&D IP in the form of a license).

Here's what you said in the video from the original post of the thread (from 5:13).

Quote from: theRPGPunditI pointed out that that essentially they're not making books anymore that that that this is it right like there there might be occasionally some special edition book sort of thing or box set or something like that some kind of product um as merchandising in essence as like a special event thing right but where you're not going to get is four or five crappy Adventures a year in in hard cover format that is not going to happen. I said that I said they're going all in on the VTT. On theRPGsite thread related to this there's a guy frequently wrong guy named mwell who jumped in and said no they're not that they're going to keep publishing. I was like they don't even have a publishing division anymore for books. Everybody who was involved in the books has been fired. He goes no, they haven't. It's going to happen. He's like, "I predict that in a few years when it's clear that this is all that you were totally wrong you're just going to pretend like it never happened."

I think given that you're calling Mistwell out here, that it's reasonable for him to give the evidence on his side.

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 29, 2024, 12:54:51 PMFrom how they were talking about the VTT recently, it sounds like they will want to add all kinds of other non-D&D hasbro IP to the thing over time. How many of you will be looking forward to "D&D: My Little Pony"?

They already did a MLP RPG. Dont know if it uses the D&D system though. I glanced at it for my niece who liked the series. But was unimpressed.

From how they talked in the press releases they want Sigil to become some sort of IP platform rather than a D&D one. Hence why D&D is not directly supported. Nor Beyond as yet. That may change. wotc seems to be getting a few wake-up calls lately. But we all know they will ignore most of the warning signs.

Quote from: jhkim on August 29, 2024, 01:13:20 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 29, 2024, 03:26:39 AMThere's nothing in this announcement that contradicts what I've been saying. I said from the start that they were publishing the new edition books because they know that's an instant cash grab (and WotC desperately need instant cash grabs). I even added that if the books sell extremely well (beyond pre-orders, that is, people have a chance to look at the books and decide they're actually worth it) they may put out more publications than they otherwise would. I also said that if the VTT turns out to be a disaster (which it could be), there's a chance that they might try going back to books (though there's an even bigger chance they might just farm out the D&D IP in the form of a license).

Here's what you said in the video from the original post of the thread (from 5:13).

Quote from: theRPGPunditI pointed out that that essentially they're not making books anymore that that that this is it right like there there might be occasionally some special edition book sort of thing or box set or something like that some kind of product um as merchandising in essence as like a special event thing right but where you're not going to get is four or five crappy Adventures a year in in hard cover format that is not going to happen. I said that I said they're going all in on the VTT. On theRPGsite thread related to this there's a guy frequently wrong guy named mwell who jumped in and said no they're not that they're going to keep publishing. I was like they don't even have a publishing division anymore for books. Everybody who was involved in the books has been fired. He goes no, they haven't. It's going to happen. He's like, "I predict that in a few years when it's clear that this is all that you were totally wrong you're just going to pretend like it never happened."

I think given that you're calling Mistwell out here, that it's reasonable for him to give the evidence on his side.

Well sure, it is fair for him to try to argue that a setting book-set that is obviously tied to the new edition means that there will continue to be regular printing of more crap woke OneDnD books in dead tree format in spite of how corporate has been screaming at the top of their lungs that they need to make a billion dollars and the only way to do that is to force everyone onto the VTT, make them pay subscriptions, make them pay for virtual minis, make them pay for the better magic, and then put My Little Pony in there too.

And I can point out why his argument still doesn't hold water.

Quote from: Omega on August 29, 2024, 04:06:53 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on August 29, 2024, 12:54:51 PMFrom how they were talking about the VTT recently, it sounds like they will want to add all kinds of other non-D&D hasbro IP to the thing over time. How many of you will be looking forward to "D&D: My Little Pony"?

They already did a MLP RPG. Dont know if it uses the D&D system though. I glanced at it for my niece who liked the series. But was unimpressed.

From how they talked in the press releases they want Sigil to become some sort of IP platform rather than a D&D one. Hence why D&D is not directly supported. Nor Beyond as yet. That may change. wotc seems to be getting a few wake-up calls lately. But we all know they will ignore most of the warning signs.

The entertainment is mostly found in figuring out in what way Hasbro/WotC will screw up by not understanding their customer base.