Quote from: Lurker on July 17, 2024, 03:58:02 PM

Quote from: Omega on July 17, 2024, 04:56:09 AM

Quote from: jhkim on July 15, 2024, 03:20:12 PMAs defined here, it's completely unremarkable. If the GM puts on scary music and a player's PC acts more jumpy, then that's bleed (aka "bleed-in" where out-of-character emotions affect the in-game stuff). If a player gets pissed at Bob because Bob psycho PC killed his PC, then that's also bleed (aka "bleed-out" where stuff in-game affects the player's feelings out-of-game).

But I've also seen it used as if it's more of a weird mental/emotional state. So I'm not sure how people in online play like startplaying.games intend it. It certainly isn't a "safety tool".

Well it stopped being "unremarkable" and started bordering on schizophrenia pretty damn fast.

Well if that is bleed, then I use it all the time in my sci fi and more so in DB CoC game. Ambient noise, Bladerunner background music. tehcno punk electro music for a bar scene etc as applicable in the Traveller game . Creepy music in DG and then low volume barely noticeable scarry sound effects when they are exploring the haunted house or cultist's underground temple.

However, Like you point out, if the 'bleed' goes the other way, yeah that is bad and not mentally stable !

You are describing ambient immersion. Rather than borderline schizo that does not end at the table. Which is what some are pushing bleed to be.

I mean really. I was watching a documentary on role play and there were multiple people going on about bleed and how great it was when they were out and about, NOT at the table, and all of a sudden they are thinking and acting as their character and not their real self out of the blue.

Quote from: yosemitemike on July 17, 2024, 05:03:09 PMRomance stories work in many sorts of media but there's a basic problem with them in tabletop rpgs.  All romance scenes will inevitably focus on one or two characters with the rest of the characters not being able to be involved in any meaningful way. 

Right. But that is a problem with any inter party interaction. Sometimes it is just two going at it and everyone else is milling about. Least it is not as bad as a single player taking up way too much time trying to squeeze every drop of info from an NPC.

Bleed is when mentally ill people can't separate fantasy from reality.

Quote from: Omega on July 17, 2024, 08:06:38 PMRight. But that is a problem with any inter party interaction. Sometimes it is just two going at it and everyone else is milling about. Least it is not as bad as a single player taking up way too much time trying to squeeze every drop of info from an NPC.

That doesn't change the fact that it's a problem.  I didn't say it was the only problem.

Quote from: yosemitemike on July 17, 2024, 08:06:55 PM

Quote from: Omega on July 17, 2024, 08:06:38 PMRight. But that is a problem with any inter party interaction. Sometimes it is just two going at it and everyone else is milling about. Least it is not as bad as a single player taking up way too much time trying to squeeze every drop of info from an NPC.

That doesn't change the fact that it's a problem.  I didn't say it was the only problem.

There's a huge class of issues from lockpicking to piloting that not every character can contribute to. The obvious solution is roughly the same thing that's done in combat -- taking turns. i.e. passing the spotlight around.

After the pilot PC gets spotlight time when she heroically flies everyone out of danger, then maybe the soldier gets some moments of romantic interaction with the woman he rescued, and then maybe the fixer gets to talk to his underworld contacts after they get back. I just try to keep it short and have the PCs regularly check back and work together.

In my last D&D campaign, there was a romantic subplot between a PC fighter and an NPC ranger that the fighter's mother set her up with. After a successful adventure in their home city, he agreed to join the next adventure - and when the campaign concluded they got married. None of the interaction took up much time, though. It was just something going on in the background.

Quote from: jhkim on July 17, 2024, 08:48:50 PMThere's a huge class of issues from lockpicking to piloting

Those things are skill checks that take seconds.  They're aren't ongoing plot lines that take chunks of time repeatedly while the other players sit around and wait.  These things are not at all comparable.

Quote from: yosemitemike on July 17, 2024, 09:24:23 PM

Quote from: jhkim on July 17, 2024, 08:48:50 PMThere's a huge class of issues from lockpicking to piloting

Those things are skill checks that take seconds.  They're aren't ongoing plot lines that take chunks of time repeatedly while the other players sit around and wait.  These things are not at all comparable.

OK, fair point that lockpicking is usually just seconds - but piloting a chase or escape can be an extended action that can take minute or more to resolve. Likewise with Diplomacy, or some complex traps or investigation.

My point is that romance isn't necessarily a big deal that eats up tons of play time. I grew up playing Champions in the 1980s, where it was a regular thing to have to spend a minute or two dealing with a Lois-Lane-like "Dependent NPC" every so often. And my James Bond 007 games generally had a few romances going.

Sure, it's more than a single roll, but that doesn't mean it derails the adventure.

Greetings!

Cities in my Thandor campaigns always have lots of brothels and whore-houses. The cities are flooded with swarms of whores. Skanks walking the streets, working the taverns and Inns. Even the laundry-services have lots of ripe broads eager to make some coin for sugar.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Courting, romance, trim hunting and the like come up once in a while but I would never act it out in character. It's a matter of "the tavern wench invites [insert name of PC] to her room" or "Lady Summerisle and her guardian accept the marriage proposal from [insert name of PC]". There are in-game reasons for courting (a character really wants someone's lands and title, for example) and skirt-chasing (bars, clubs, public baths and whorehouses have always been goldmines for information), but play-acting it? That's just fucking weird.

Same. Who is playing out sex scenes at a table that isnt a one-on-one session? WoD players?

Quote from: Omega on July 23, 2024, 05:37:30 AMSame. Who is playing out sex scenes at a table that isnt a one-on-one session? WoD players?

The same type of people that demand YOU use "safety" tools, remember the Robot grape scandal?

Progressives can't differentiate between fantasy and IRL nor can they help themselves to push their weird fetishes into the game and ACT THEM OUT.

I think they hear/read Dungeon and think of their BDSM fantasies.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on July 23, 2024, 12:03:08 PMremember the Robot grape scandal?

I don't. I did a Google search and it came up with a robotic-assisted surgical video. Is that what you're talking about? If so, how does that fit with safety tools?

Quote from: HappyDaze on July 23, 2024, 02:10:39 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on July 23, 2024, 12:03:08 PMremember the Robot grape scandal?

I don't. I did a Google search and it came up with a robotic-assisted surgical video. Is that what you're talking about? If so, how does that fit with safety tools?

A progressive asshole (but I repeat myself) had a youtube show where he ran his TTRPG, it was a Sci-Fi RPG, in one chapter he has an NPC stick stuff into the robot PC live and without consent, the player complained, Pundit even made a video about it, it was big even between the progs, guy apologized but not sure if he got cancelled or not, since without double standards progressives would have none.

The GM was also a proponent of using "Safety" tools and they were supposedly on the "table" for his players.

Edited to add sources, funny you didn't find it since it took me 5 seconds.

https://www.polygon.com/2020/4/6/21207309/rollplay-far-verona-sexual-assault-lets-play-season-2-canceled

Quote from: GeekyBugle on July 23, 2024, 02:15:13 PM

Quote from: HappyDaze on July 23, 2024, 02:10:39 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on July 23, 2024, 12:03:08 PMremember the Robot grape scandal?

I don't. I did a Google search and it came up with a robotic-assisted surgical video. Is that what you're talking about? If so, how does that fit with safety tools?

A progressive asshole (but I repeat myself) had a youtube show where he ran his TTRPG, it was a Sci-Fi RPG, in one chapter he has an NPC stick stuff into the robot PC live and without consent, the player complained, Pundit even made a video about it, it was big even between the progs, guy apologized but not sure if he got cancelled or not, since without double standards progressives would have none.

The GM was also a proponent of using "Safety" tools and they were supposedly on the "table" for his players.

OK, yeah, I remember it was...Adam? Something...? Weird looking dude with pink hair, right? That seems like a long, long time ago. I didn't remember anything about grapes in that one though.

Quote from: HappyDaze on July 23, 2024, 02:19:04 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on July 23, 2024, 02:15:13 PM

Quote from: HappyDaze on July 23, 2024, 02:10:39 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on July 23, 2024, 12:03:08 PMremember the Robot grape scandal?

I don't. I did a Google search and it came up with a robotic-assisted surgical video. Is that what you're talking about? If so, how does that fit with safety tools?

A progressive asshole (but I repeat myself) had a youtube show where he ran his TTRPG, it was a Sci-Fi RPG, in one chapter he has an NPC stick stuff into the robot PC live and without consent, the player complained, Pundit even made a video about it, it was big even between the progs, guy apologized but not sure if he got cancelled or not, since without double standards progressives would have none.

The GM was also a proponent of using "Safety" tools and they were supposedly on the "table" for his players.

OK, yeah, I remember it was...Adam? Something...? Weird looking dude with pink hair, right? That seems like a long, long time ago. I didn't remember anything about grapes in that one though.

Adam Koebel yes. Not sure about the danger hair bit, but it wouldn't surprise me.

Danger hair...