Quote from: SHARK;1126412*Laughing* Exactly, Valatar! It makes me wonder, with all of these whiny crybabies, if there is such a deep "need" for X-Cards, consent forms, "safety tools" and on and on, to "ensure gamers are safe"--why the fuck are you gaming with these people? Why would anyone *want* to game with people that need all of this bullshit?

Quote from: Trond;1126413"Storygames" again. You guys are hilarious

There is no cause and effect with "Storygames".  There might be a correlation for all I know, but I don't play with enough people interested in story games to have an opinion on that.  There is most definitely a cause and effect relation with SJWs.  To the extent that SJWs prefer story games, there's your correlation.  At a guess, though, given what a tiny percentage of gamers are involved in story games, I'd say we are back to the problem that SJWs are interested in infecting all kinds of things, and their virus knows no game type boundaries.

I won't say "liberal" because of the grand, wholesome tradition of the classical liberal. I hesitate to even say "leftist" because some outright communists aren't quite that mixture of priggish, corrupt, narrow-minded, and stupid in their pursuit of a secular theocracy--though admittedly its an occupational hazard of the type.  Whatever label you want to put on it, and whatever they come from, the classic first principle of SJWs (and others or their ilk) is that they live and breathe "projection".   They think other people are just as bad as they know they are.  Many of them have self esteem issues on top of all their other problems, and are thus desperate to be convinced that others are worse than they are.   The way they go about insisting on that point is firmly in the camp of "doth protest too much," but when a person is desperate enough, they'll believe their own lies.  They know no game is "safe" with them in it.  How the hell would it be "safe" with others in it that are just as bad or worse?

So to answer your question, Shark, they do this because the correct answer of "no gaming is better than bad gaming" means from their perspective that there will be no gaming--ever.  Deep down, they know that too.  The outcome is entirely predictable:   A few of the worst devious assholes trying to make gaming worse for everyone, on the grounds of why should anyone else be happy if they can't?  And a bunch of useful idiots parroting this out of fear that they may be in the same boat.  (Exactly the same way a household with a chronic alcoholic in it means that no one is allowed to be well-adjusted because the alcoholic isn't.)  Which is very sad, because most of the useful idiots would at least start on a better path by separating from the assholes.

Roll20 just announced cancelling their Descent Into Avernus stream. Presumably due to the same incident.

I feel like that card will do as others are saying.  Make a problem worse...creeps will push out as much creepy as they can hedging on the fact most people hate person to person confrontation.  People who have it in them; will just push the margin as much as possible and have the fall back that no one carded them, or get carded and then use their mastery of playing victim to justify it/get forgiven.

Quote from: mightybrain;1126425Roll20 just announced cancelling their Descent Into Avernus stream. Presumably due to the same incident.

It is probably to divert attention from the complete shit show they are right now.  A botched release of a very poorly tested feature and network failures which make the app near unusable. Also apparently it is not cancelled it is suspended and AK and his girlfriend have been booted from the cast.

And he had another one featured on the D&D channel: Jace Beleren Must Die. Also gone.

I think it's delicious that this happened.  Regardless of how ridiculous you might think the circumstances are, this guy was part of the cancel culture crowd and he got what he deserved for it.  Adios, amigo.

I guess it demonstrates the wisdom of limiting your streams to a tiny incestuous pool of indie darling narcissists. I thought these guys were supposed to be all about diversity.

Quote from: Steven Mitchell;1126422There is no cause and effect with "Storygames".  There might be a correlation for all I know, but I don't play with enough people interested in story games to have an opinion on that.  There is most definitely a cause and effect relation with SJWs.  To the extent that SJWs prefer story games, there's your correlation.  At a guess, though, given what a tiny percentage of gamers are involved in story games, I'd say we are back to the problem that SJWs are interested in infecting all kinds of things, and their virus knows no game type boundaries.

I won't say "liberal" because of the grand, wholesome tradition of the classical liberal. I hesitate to even say "leftist" because some outright communists aren't quite that mixture of priggish, corrupt, narrow-minded, and stupid in their pursuit of a secular theocracy--though admittedly its an occupational hazard of the type.  Whatever label you want to put on it, and whatever they come from, the classic first principle of SJWs (and others or their ilk) is that they live and breathe "projection".   They think other people are just as bad as they know they are.  Many of them have self esteem issues on top of all their other problems, and are thus desperate to be convinced that others are worse than they are.   The way they go about insisting on that point is firmly in the camp of "doth protest too much," but when a person is desperate enough, they'll believe their own lies.  They know no game is "safe" with them in it.  How the hell would it be "safe" with others in it that are just as bad or worse?

So to answer your question, Shark, they do this because the correct answer of "no gaming is better than bad gaming" means from their perspective that there will be no gaming--ever.  Deep down, they know that too.  The outcome is entirely predictable:   A few of the worst devious assholes trying to make gaming worse for everyone, on the grounds of why should anyone else be happy if they can't?  And a bunch of useful idiots parroting this out of fear that they may be in the same boat.  (Exactly the same way a household with a chronic alcoholic in it means that no one is allowed to be well-adjusted because the alcoholic isn't.)  Which is very sad, because most of the useful idiots would at least start on a better path by separating from the assholes.

I'm a heretic on here who actually quite enjoys Story-driven systems, although that might have more with me almost exclusively P&P'ing via text wherein crunchy combat can very quickly drag everything to a screaming halt.

Anyway, my suspicion is that the correlation between 'Storygames' and... ahem, certain audiences for the most part stems from them being typically light on the crunch front. I suppose D&D - even in it's very streamlined 5E form - is the exception to this, but that arguably has more to it being a relatively simple system if you want it to be and most of these people engorging a (un)healthy diet of Critical Roll, where they've devoured enough to at least comprehend the basics. I'm a 'relative' newcomer to RPGs (if you count a decade or so as such) at least compared to a lot of people on here, but I do think that a lot of it does come down to the Usual Suspects being new themselves, arriving at such a time where as much as possible is being done to streamline (I'm sure some would say 'dumb down') both existing, updated rulesets and entirely new ones where they're designed for 'Storygames'.

I am not trying to make Critical Roll sound like Da Boogeyman. I'm no fan of it but I don't hate the thing (other than flooding fantasy artwork with that fucking Draenei Tiefling). My suspicion is that, from some experience, these people are looking more for 'experiences' rather than games. You know that period between 2005-2016 where a good portion of the video game audience seemed obsessed with being digital movies rather than experiences led by gameplay? That's essentially what is being craved here, rather than the 'mundane' nature of rolling up stats, tossing a lot of dice, working out the best way to do this and that and having something 'epic and awesome and greentext'able' almost randomly as opposed to vomiting their OCDonutSteal out there and nigh-demanding a story revolving around said OC and their quirky social hijinx, which Storygames(tm) are much more focused upon.

Quote from: mightybrain;1126437I guess it demonstrates the wisdom of limiting your streams to a tiny incestuous pool of indie darling narcissists. I thought these guys were supposed to be all about diversity.

To quote Ice-T "Freedom of speech/yeah/just watch what you say."

Quote from: mightybrain;1126421From what I've seen, the x-card doesn't just fail to help with the problem it's intended to address, it actively exacerbates it.

Working as intended.

Quote from: thedungeondelver;1126384That's fair, and Rekieta's shtick is Rekieta's shtick; but to my point, this guy sucks balls as a DM by any measure and how he got INTARNET FAMOUSE is beyond me.

Storygamer favorite. Pink hair. Declaring himself "feminist". Declaring himself "queer".

Quote from: mightybrain;1126393One thing I'm seeing in the discussion of this situation is a lot of advocacy of the X-card.

In this case it would seem that the X-card would not have helped at all, since the players would have been too stunned to use it. Which makes me wonder where would it help, if anywhere? And why anyone would advocate for it? Most of us, I imagine wouldn't need something like this, we'd just speak up and call a halt to the game if it got weird. And I can't imagine many DMs not being primarily concerned with the whether or not their players are enjoying their game. Well... I can imagine one, now.

So... I'm guessing you didn't watch my video?

Quote from: Snark Knight;1126438I'm a heretic on here who actually quite enjoys Story-driven systems, although that might have more with me almost exclusively P&P'ing via text wherein crunchy combat can very quickly drag everything to a screaming halt.

I could see narrative driven RPGs working very well for forum or text games. It's quite true that crunchy combat is rough and anti-immersive in those mediums.

Quote from: RPGPundit;1126452So... I'm guessing you didn't watch my video?

I did. And I'm agreeing with you, in the most part. You were of the opinion that this was an example of having an X-card and it didn't help. Since then, from what I've seen, the story is that he didn't have an X-card system in place, or do a session zero, or have consent forms, or anything else these muppets come up with. So people, a week later, are still proposing the X-card as the solution to this problem. But I agree that it's not likely a solution and more likely to cause these issues than solve them.

From the looks of it though, he's not going to brush this one off. He might at some point start running games again, but most of the people hosting shows are dropping him and anyone associated with him.

I understand Koebel and co were playing Stars Without Number. A damning indictment of the OSR!!