Quote from: thedungeondelver;1126354I don't 100% agree with Nick, but it's a good summation.

His summation is that it was a 'fictional sexual assault' which is exactly what the headline of the article he is attempting to ridicule states. Drunk commenting is his thing though so I guess we shouldn't expect a coherent argument. But attacking a Polygon article is going for some pretty low hanging fruit; and he still fumbled it.

It occurs to me that there may be some lack of understanding as to what constitutes sexual assault in law (as opposed to rape.) Obviously different countries and states will have their own takes. From this one I would suggest that the scenario would be considered sexual assault under 1(b) "The actor knows that the victim is incapable of appraising the nature of the victim's conduct" and 1(g) "The actor, while purporting to offer a medical service, engages in treatment or examination of a victim for other than a bona fide medical purpose or in a manner substantially inconsistent with reasonable medical practices" at the very least.

Quote from: mightybrain;1126381His summation is that it was a 'fictional sexual assault' which is exactly what the headline of the article he is attempting to ridicule states. Drunk commenting is his thing though so I guess we shouldn't expect a coherent argument. But attacking a Polygon article is going for some pretty low hanging fruit; and he still fumbled it.

It occurs to me that there may be some lack of understanding as to what constitutes sexual assault in law (as opposed to rape.) Obviously different countries and states will have their own takes. From this one I would suggest that the scenario would be considered sexual assault under 1(b) "The actor knows that the victim is incapable of appraising the nature of the victim's conduct" and 1(g) "The actor, while purporting to offer a medical service, engages in treatment or examination of a victim for other than a bona fide medical purpose or in a manner substantially inconsistent with reasonable medical practices" at the very least.

That's fair, and Rekieta's shtick is Rekieta's shtick; but to my point, this guy sucks balls as a DM by any measure and how he got INTARNET FAMOUSE is beyond me.

Quote from: thedungeondelver;1126354Well, I just mean his cadence, his game flow, etc.  He doesn't paint a picture, he ums and ahs because he knows the camera is on him.  Like, when he described the tool that was used on the character in the scene in question, did he say, "He picks up what looks like a modified diagnostic scanner; you don't recognize some of the retrofitted attachments, though." or "He picks up an unusual looking device.  It doesn't seem to be meant for synthetic body repair."?  No, he said, "He, um, picks up...this, uh, tool...thing, it's got these things, y'know, on it."

Just awful narrative skills.

I flipped through that episode and some others, and they're full of things like that.  I feel like he was probably very nervous because he was about to describe a scenario he knew the player wasn't gonna be comfortable with, and that probably didn't help, either.

Also, any DM or GM who has the appellation of a guy who likes to get inside his players heads and find out what makes them uncomfortable, sucks by any definition.  Table top role playing games with your friends are not time for you to experiment on them psychologically with some brain salad surgery.  I mean, if I was in a game with someone like that, and (for example) they "described a scene" (because apparently "created an adventure" isn't good enough for the hipster crowd) where my character's mom had dementia alzheimer's and demanded I role play it out, I'd break a fucking chair over his head, for reasons that would have been obvious beforehand to him (it's because I had to take care of my mom in later stages of dementia and alzheimers and it about broke me).  There's "roleplaying" in the 1950s headshrinker fashion where that might be part of cognitive therapy, but the "roleplaying" this fuckstick was supposed to be doing is the adventure and daring-do type.  All of that and his shit presentation skills make him a poor GM.  And I don't know why he'd be famous for it, or be given note for it.  But, as we see, he was a creep and eventually it blew up on him.

With that said, this video from Nick Rekeita is a good overview of the situation:

[video=youtube;Ptv8fl9o0hA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ptv8fl9o0hA[/youtube]

I don't 100% agree with Nick, but it's a good summation.

Now that I've seen the clip, I do agree with this 100%. Nothing happened.

I do think the GM is a hypocrite though, since he's from the kind of culture that produces this sort of outrage to begin with.

One thing I'm seeing in the discussion of this situation is a lot of advocacy of the X-card.

In this case it would seem that the X-card would not have helped at all, since the players would have been too stunned to use it. Which makes me wonder where would it help, if anywhere? And why anyone would advocate for it? Most of us, I imagine wouldn't need something like this, we'd just speak up and call a halt to the game if it got weird. And I can't imagine many DMs not being primarily concerned with the whether or not their players are enjoying their game. Well... I can imagine one, now.

If you need an X card, one of two things, you should not be playing RPGs, or two, the people you play with are pretty horrible people.  Either situation is rectified easily with no cards.

The "X-Card" is Storygames' talking points as to how the pervs protect themselves from social exposure and legal action.

"Well, if we'd had functioning X-Cards in place, this whole thing would never gave happened "

How about simple decency?

How about instead of making unverified claims about exclusivity in the hobby, present real instances of this discrimination against non-white male gamers.

It's easy to cry a wolf is in the woods  preying on the villagers. Ok. What proof of this wolf can you present? Or, are you presenting an inaginary monster to create fear and division in the hobby?

As an African-American GM since '83 who had female and non-white males at his table since day one, this exclusionary dialogue is nonsense to me.

What it seems? A new capitalistic group within a group looking to play "Divide & Conquer" with the hobby hoping to grasp the newer gamers into their fold and manipulate how new gamers spend their time and money in regard to the hobby.

Be wise.

Quote from: Theory of Games;1126410The "X-Card" is Storygames' talking points as to how the pervs protect themselves from social exposure and legal action.

"Well, if we'd had functioning X-Cards in place, this whole thing would never gave happened "

How about simple decency?

How about instead of making unverified claims about exclusivity in the hobby, present real instances of this discrimination against non-white male gamers.

It's easy to cry a wolf is in the woods  preying on the villagers. Ok. What proof of this wolf can you present? Or, are you presenting an inaginary monster to create fear and division in the hobby?

As an African-American GM since '83 who had female and non-white males at his table since day one, this exclusionary dialogue is nonsense to me.

What it seems? A new capitalistic group within a group looking to play "Divide & Conquer" with the hobby hoping to grasp the newer gamers into their fold and manipulate how new gamers spend their time and money in regard to the hobby.

Be wise.

Yeah.  If a person's doing cringey sorta-rapey things, don't game with them.  If they decide the gaming table is the place to air their unsolicited opinions on whatever subject and nobody's interested in hearing it, don't game with them.  It's not rocket science.  Building a Rube Goldberg device in some effort to somehow make people behave like a normal adult only wastes everybody's time when there's a simpler solution at hand.  It's not difficult to tell a good player/GM from a bad one, just don't play with the crazies and/or assholes and all's golden.

Quote from: Valatar;1126411Yeah.  If a person's doing cringey sorta-rapey things, don't game with them.  If they decide the gaming table is the place to air their unsolicited opinions on whatever subject and nobody's interested in hearing it, don't game with them.  It's not rocket science.  Building a Rube Goldberg device in some effort to somehow make people behave like a normal adult only wastes everybody's time when there's a simpler solution at hand.  It's not difficult to tell a good player/GM from a bad one, just don't play with the crazies and/or assholes and all's golden.

Greetings!

*Laughing* Exactly, Valatar! It makes me wonder, with all of these whiny crybabies, if there is such a deep "need" for X-Cards, consent forms, "safety tools" and on and on, to "ensure gamers are safe"--why the fuck are you gaming with these people? Why would anyone *want* to game with people that need all of this bullshit?

In my groups, the only things we need are soda, coffee, munchies--and some tequila, and fine cigars.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

"Storygames" again. You guys are hilarious

Quote from: Valatar;1126411Yeah.  If a person's doing cringey sorta-rapey things, don't game with them.  If they decide the gaming table is the place to air their unsolicited opinions on whatever subject and nobody's interested in hearing it, don't game with them.  It's not rocket science.  Building a Rube Goldberg device in some effort to somehow make people behave like a normal adult only wastes everybody's time when there's a simpler solution at hand.  It's not difficult to tell a good player/GM from a bad one, just don't play with the crazies and/or assholes and all's golden.

I always thought that they planned the X-card for when they were gaming with people that they don't really know--like in conventions, pick-up games at stores, and such things. For these things, it's not necessarily easy to tell the good player/GM from a bad one just by looking at them, and it's not like they can read resumes and check references (OK, maybe they could for those running and preregistering to play at conventions), so they came up with the X-card.

Since I don't play at those types of tables, the X-card is worthless to me. I really can't see a need for it in games where the players are familiar with one another. Those are the times that reasonable people should have enough time and sense to make an informed decision about whether or not to play with certain people, and they shouldn't need a prop to help them do so. I mean, I don't need to have X-cards around when having a mealtime conversation at a table with my friends and family, and that's not too different from gaming IMO.

Quote from: Trond;1126387Now that I've seen the clip, I do agree with this 100%. Nothing happened.

I do think the GM is a hypocrite though, since he's from the kind of culture that produces this sort of outrage to begin with.

Greetings!

Fucking awesome video and commentary by the lawyer. The analytical light of actual legal dynamics are applied to this pathetic trainwreck.

Nothing happened is right. Ridiculous how fragile and stupid these kinds of people are.

This shows just how brain-damaged and emotionally fucked up so many of these people are.

This clown Koebel now is in professional therapy...*laughing*

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: thedungeondelver;1126284I'd take offense at just how bad a DM he is.

I fast forwarded and rewound it and all I saw was a GM who couldn't shut up and players saying next to nothing.
Pretty much the opposite of how I GM.

Quote from: Valatar;1126411Yeah.  If a person's doing cringey sorta-rapey things, don't game with them.  If they decide the gaming table is the place to air their unsolicited opinions on whatever subject and nobody's interested in hearing it, don't game with them.  It's not rocket science. ...  It's not difficult to tell a good player/GM from a bad one, just don't play with the crazies and/or assholes and all's golden.

If people discuss this upfront for a private in-home game, and you are looking for a game with adult content, there's no reason not to play. I feel like these blanket statements are just admonishing the subject-matter. I appreciate your feelings of moral superiority, but the BEHAVIOR is what at issue here. GMs or players inflicting unwanted subject matter into a game that wasn't agreed to. A group of people playing a consensual RPG containing adult subject-matter are not crazy nor are they assholes.

Quote from: Valatar;1126411... Building a Rube Goldberg device in some effort to somehow make people behave like a normal adult only wastes everybody's time ...

I love this. I want to make a t-shirt. :-D

Again, I think the x-card is a terrible idea. There is literally NOTHING that can replace a reasonable conversation about the campaign, subject matter and preferences before a game.

In addition, adult subject-matter should never be included in convention / public games. Maybe in one of those after-hours convention slots with a precise disclosure in the description.

I will keep repeating this with every attempt at moral-shaming the forum. :-P

Quote from: HappyDaze;1126414I mean, I don't need to have X-cards around when having a mealtime conversation at a table with my friends and family, and that's not too different from gaming IMO.

Just wait till these same people start suggesting everyone should carry around a pack of X-Cards with them at all times whenever attending public gatherings of any type. And that doing so is part of being a "decent human being". Fun times.

From what I've seen, the x-card doesn't just fail to help with the problem it's intended to address, it actively exacerbates it.