Quote from: mAcular Chaotic;1110255Is this even really true? From what I've seen, tabletop of all kinds has been booming the last few years. Look at Kickstarter.

Boardgames are booming; not non-D&D RPGs I'd say. Very noticeable at my FLGS Orc's Nest - space is at such a premium that it's easy to track game & genre popularity by what goes where. Most RPGs are now vanished to upper floor with the historical miniatures gaming, while eurogames dominate the non-D&D premium shelves.

I've had an easy time finding a variety of games online... but face-to-face, locally, D&D is just about the only game going. People might mention an interest in some other game, in addition to 5e... but then end up just running 5e.
Another thing I've noticed, on our local Facebook group, is a number of people who talk about their games as if they're proposing a business venture. There are several that are trying to film their games and get them up online. So their choice of game is all about attracting the widest audience.
No clue if this is limited to any age group though.

Quote from: Shasarak;1110309Wow giving your rules out for free.  So new, so brilliant, so hard to get older editions.

Nope.

Yep.

I never said it was new or that older editions are hard to get, so...

I did say that older editions aren't free (which is true, SRDs are not complete games) and there is no SRD for anything TSR-era, so my point stands about older editions costing money with no guarantee of player participation, unlike 5E, which is totally free and can be guaranteed to easily find a game somewhere IRL or online.

And yes, it is brilliant. SRDs are not free basic rules that can be downloaded as a professional PDF and printed out, if desired. 5E's free basic rules make the old 3E and 4E SRD's look clunky and amateurish by comparison. Those aren't gonna get anybody "new to RPGs" or even "new to D&D" excited.

Speaking for myself, I completely skipped 3E and 4E because the SRD's made zero sense to me and the hardbacks were dense with arcane rules and, more importantly, prohibitively expensive. The 5E basic rules? Clean, concise, and professional-quality. 5E free basic rules got me back into gaming after a long, multi-decade layoff and then stoked my curiosity to purchase the B/X and OD&D official PDF's. I don't spend a dime without those easy to read and download 5E basic rules. The 5E SRD likewise would not have done the trick either.

Wait. D&D 3.0 was 20 years ago ?!?

Holy shit, yes! I just had a "feeling old" moment.

Anyway, on topic, whoever posted upthread about 5e being the most current version of the most popular game probably has it. As much hell as I like to give Millennials, I don't think this is a generation thing. I knew guys who were like this with AD&D 2e. Literally wouldn't even discuss playing anything else. It's what they liked, played and by God would keep playing come hell or high water!

Quote from: Kael;1110215^^Exactly this. Don't overthink it, it's not rocket science. Popularity and availability are why 5e groups are more common. It has nothing to do with age. You can walk into any Target in America and grab a 5e D&D box. When all your friends are playing 5e, then 5e it is.

Also, 5e is a very user-friendly game and the basic rules are totally FREE! Don't overlook the brilliant move Hasbro made by making the basic game 100% free of charge. That strategy alone will get noobs involved in gaming that wouldn't otherwise. Older editions cost money with no guarantees of any gaming returns or even simple participation.

I recently saw the 5E Starter Set on the shelf at a nearby Walmart for $20.

Quote from: deadDMwalking;1110243Twenty years ago it was hard to find any game that wasn't 3.x.  For a while.  A lot of people continued playing 3.x, but people also gradually became more open to other games.  

It's a lot to ask someone to start playing a game that isn't well-supported and they can't really buy-into on their own.  

It's kinda rude to ask the game store to support a game that they can't monetize, either.

20 years ago, DnD 3.x didn't exist. It is 2019, remember?

Quote from: Kael;1110215^^Exactly this. Don't overthink it, it's not rocket science. Popularity and availability are why 5e groups are more common. It has nothing to do with age. You can walk into any Target in America and grab a 5e D&D box. When all your friends are playing 5e, then 5e it is.

You are right. It is the same reason why McDonald's fast food is considered a popular dining experience.....

Quote from: Kael;1110331Yep.

I never said it was new or that older editions are hard to get, so...

I did say that older editions aren't free (which is true, SRDs are not complete games) and there is no SRD for anything TSR-era, so my point stands about older editions costing money with no guarantee of player participation, unlike 5E, which is totally free and can be guaranteed to easily find a game somewhere IRL or online.

And yes, it is brilliant. SRDs are not free basic rules that can be downloaded as a professional PDF and printed out, if desired. 5E's free basic rules make the old 3E and 4E SRD's look clunky and amateurish by comparison. Those aren't gonna get anybody "new to RPGs" or even "new to D&D" excited.

Speaking for myself, I completely skipped 3E and 4E because the SRD's made zero sense to me and the hardbacks were dense with arcane rules and, more importantly, prohibitively expensive. The 5E basic rules? Clean, concise, and professional-quality. 5E free basic rules got me back into gaming after a long, multi-decade layoff and then stoked my curiosity to purchase the B/X and OD&D official PDF's. I don't spend a dime without those easy to read and download 5E basic rules. The 5E SRD likewise would not have done the trick either.

RPGs are prohibitively expensive?  Really $20 is prohibitive?  How much do you pay to print out those "free" rules of yours so that you can walk around with a bunch of loose leaf paper.

because they once smelled a grognard.

~~
JUST KIDDING

Quote from: jeff37923;1110349You are right. It is the same reason why McDonald's fast food is considered a popular dining experience.....

McDonald's sucks but fast food is a disposable investment/experience so who cares. You can always go somewhere else next time, with no social repercussions. Gaming (and RPGs in particular) necessitate a minimum time buy-in and unless you only play one-shots with strangers, are not disposable. An ongoing RPG campaign is more like choosing *not to eat fast food everyday* rather than eating at McDonald's on occasion.

And hey, isn't there a Wendy's RPG out there somewhere?? What's up with RPGs and fast food lately??? LOL...

Quote from: Shasarak;1110352RPGs are prohibitively expensive?  Really $20 is prohibitive?  How much do you pay to print out those "free" rules of yours so that you can walk around with a bunch of loose leaf paper.

How much did the 3e and 4e core books cost when they came out? Printing is optional and costs almost nothing. I wanted to like those 3e and 4e books, but the pricing was insane and the SRDs made my eyes glaze over in frustration.

5E fixed both of those issues for me. Readable and understandable PDFs, gratis.

Quote from: jeff37923;111034820 years ago, DnD 3.x didn't exist. It is 2019, remember?

Thank you Mr. Literal.  

3rd edition was released in August of 2000.  That was 19 years 2 months ago.  The true 'boom' was more around 2001.  

In any case, any normal person would accept that ~20 years ago (ie, it is more than 15 but less than 24) would round to 20.  Even my 3rd grader knows that.

Quote from: Kael;1110359How much did the 3e and 4e core books cost when they came out? Printing is optional and costs almost nothing.

The 3.0 PHB/DMG/MM each cost $19.95 list price.  

The 3.5 PHB/DMG/MM each cost $29.95 list price and were published 3 years later.  

Adjusted for inflation in today's dollars, the 3.0 books would be $29.81 per an online inflation calculator.  The 3.5 books would cost $41.85.  

The 5th edition PHB list price is $49.95.

Quote from: S'mon;1110299Sounds plausible.
I do wonder why so few publishers are doing 3rd party D&D stuff now, considering the 3e OGL glut. Some books like Kobold Press Tome of Beasts surely sell far more than any non-D&D product is likely to.

Quote from: HappyDaze;1110301There are a lot of independent/small works coming out on PDF, but certainly not a lot of hard copy books like in the 3e days.

It is puzzling that even a small bite of the D&D pie hasn't enticed more publishers to release hardcopy D&D adventures and setting guides. It's not as though WotC is flooding the market with content.

Maybe some of those network externalities are having an impact on not just D&D as a system, but on WotC adventures. People only want to play the same official WotC campaigns they watch on streams and actual plays and read about on forums?

Quote from: deadDMwalking;1110368Adjusted for inflation in today's dollars, the 3.0 books would be $29.81 per an online inflation calculator.  The 3.5 books would cost $41.85.  

The 5th edition PHB list price is $49.95.

Yeah, $90 - $120 in today's prices wasn't going to happen for a poor college student like myself. If 5e's free rules had been around then, I probably wouldn't have quit RPGs and I'd guess that finding a group would have been easier. That's just conjecture though, I was super busy at the time.

I haven't and will never buy the 5e hardbacks. No reason to. $150 is still too rich for my blood for something that's free. The starter sets are much better values, IMO.