Quote from: S'mon;1103326I think their plan to leverage PF2E into permanently maintaining a staff much bigger than that of WoTC's D&D department was always doomed to fail. Their best shot would have been to move quickly to producing 5e D&D compatible adventures once 5e went OGL. That is probably still the case if they want to keep a business more than just mom & pop (Stevens & Wertz). There just isn't the kind of big demand for a Not-D&D that there was in 2009.

Thanks S'mon, always good to start off the day with a big belly laugh.  Nice one.

Even the Paizo 2e forums are really slow compared to what the PF1e forums were just 2 years ago.

It's not looking good.

Quote from: Shasarak;1103349Thanks S'mon, always good to start off the day with a big belly laugh.  Nice one.

Er, you're welcome!

I guess I want to see them support 5e since that's the game I play (though I'll be playing some PF2e early next year). Ideally some reissued AP hardbacks with 5e stats - they could presumably have both 5e & PF2E stats in the same book? Or are PF2e stat blocks too bulky/PF fans too hostile?

Quote from: Rhedyn;1103360Even the Paizo 2e forums are really slow compared to what the PF1e forums were just 2 years ago.

It's not looking good.

Paizo forums are doing better then the WotC ones.  Oh, burn.

Seriously though all forums are in decline.  It's just not the way that people are talking to each other now.  We have Discord, Facebook, Twitter and probably stuff that I have not heard of.

Quote from: Haffrung;1103346...
... I had assumed that the massive popularity of 5E would have a 'rising tide lifts all boats' effect on the RPG hobby. I'm not so sure it has. Not when it comes to D&D-like systems such as Pathfinder, anyway.
...

I am a 'rising tide lifts all boats' skeptic when all the rising tide has really done is cement D&D's utter dominance of the rpg industry.

5e + 3.x SRD = no can defend.

Yes D&D was always the 800lb gorilla in the room. But now it is fucking King Kong with nary a lowly T-Rex to be seen...

All the other "big systems/games' that people used to play have fallen by the wayside.

Hero, Vampire, Shadowrun? Pffttt...

And objectively speaking D&D has never had anything resembling a serious competitor in the vanilla fantasy genre until they handed their clone 4e.

Quote from: Haffrung;1103346...
Those numbers suggest to me Pathfinder has been on a steady decline in players for some time now, maybe even predating the release of D&D 5E...

It appears they were almost compelled to go the PF2 route, or move to 5e support. I think for obvious reasons they are never going to willingly transition to 5e support.

But I also do not think that PF2 is enough to maintain what they have. And that is not a commentary on whether or not PF2 is even a good game.

PF2 could be a great game.

But in today's D&D saturated market, it just doesn't matter.

Also probably dosent help them that there first few books are pretty them just putting back in the stuff they already had from 1e (Also same deal with the bestiary for the 2nd part of age of ashes.)

Adventure Paths have always been Paizo's bread and butter. They needed to make a big splash with the first PF2 AP. Unless I'm missing some great buzz about it on Discord, Facebook, or Twitter, they seem to have misfired. There actually seems to be even less buzz about Age of Ashes than there was about the last couple PF1 APs. I had hoped to start a PF2 campaign sometime in the next year or so using Age of Ashes, but changed my plans with the lacklustre reviews and a flip through the first chapter at my FLGS. Instead, I'm going to convert Rise of the Runelords to PF2. On that subject, a 5E conversion of RotRL would a no-brainer for Paizo if PF2 falters.

Quote from: Haffrung;1103373Adventure Paths have always been Paizo's bread and butter. They needed to make a big splash with the first PF2 AP. Unless I'm missing some great buzz about it on Discord, Facebook, or Twitter, they seem to have misfired. There actually seems to be even less buzz about Age of Ashes than there was about the last couple PF1 APs. I had hoped to start a PF2 campaign sometime in the next year or so using Age of Ashes, but changed my plans with the lacklustre reviews and a flip through the first chapter at my FLGS. Instead, I'm going to convert Rise of the Runelords to PF2. On that subject, a 5E conversion of RotRL would a no-brainer for Paizo if PF2 falters.

I have not seen a review of Age of Ashes. Do you have a link?

Quote from: Mistwell;1103378I have not seen a review of Age of Ashes. Do you have a link?

https://paizo.com/products/btq01znq/reviews&page=1?Pathfinder-Adventure-Path-145-Hellknight-Hill#tabs

Quote from: Haffrung;1103410https://paizo.com/products/btq01znq/reviews&page=1?Pathfinder-Adventure-Path-145-Hellknight-Hill#tabs

Huh. Yeah, pretty mixed. Seems like "If you want a more simplistic, light hearted intro to the new rules, this is for you. If you're looking for a deeper, more adult and complex adventure, this is not for you."

It's reminiscent of some of the more terrible pathfinder APs out there.

Very one dimensional, a bit of a railroad, and contains pages of NPC dialogue. Didn't we stop doing that years ago?

Edit: I've actually found it relatively easy to convert other adventures over to pathfinder II, given the ease of how encounters are designed using the new XP budget system. It can be done on the fly in fact.

Quote from: Graytung;1103439It's reminiscent of some of the more terrible pathfinder APs out there.

Very one dimensional, a bit of a railroad, and contains pages of NPC dialogue. Didn't we stop doing that years ago?

Ugh. The worst thing about the APs I've read is the pages and pages given over to NPC backstories and canned dialogue. I know that stuff is meant to appeal to the 50 per cent or so of the audience who buys them as reading material rather than game aids. But it's annoying space-waster for the rest of us.

Not sure why Paizo wouldn't lead with their A-team of veteran adventure contributors for the first PF2 adventure path (Greg Vaughan, James Jacobs, Mike Shel, Michael Kortes, Crystal Frazier, etc.). A lot of new writers contributing to Age of Ashes.

Quote from: Graytung;1103439Edit: I've actually found it relatively easy to convert other adventures over to pathfinder II, given the ease of how encounters are designed using the new XP budget system. It can be done on the fly in fact.

Good to hear. I've never played Pathfinder, and want my first campaign to be set in Golarion. The plan is to run a mash-up of Rise of the Runelords and Shattered Star.

Quote from: Haffrung;1103453The plan is to run a mash-up of Rise of the Runelords and Shattered Star.

My 5e Runelords of the Shattered Star blog may be useful!

Since 2015 I've run SS1-SS2-RL2-RL3-SS3-SS4-RL4-(bit of) RL5-SS5 and now on SS6; RL6 still to come. Didn't use RL1 since a previous PC group had played through it and TPK'd at the end, leading to the destruction of Sandpoint.

RL is consistently good. SS 1, 2, 5 and 6 are good; SS3 is uneven and SS4 really wasn't very good.

Quote from: S'mon;1103457My 5e Runelords of the Shattered Star blog may be useful!

Since 2015 I've run SS1-SS2-RL2-RL3-SS3-SS4-RL4-(bit of) RL5-SS5 and now on SS6; RL6 still to come. Didn't use RL1 since a previous PC group had played through it and TPK'd at the end, leading to the destruction of Sandpoint.

RL is consistently good. SS 1, 2, 5 and 6 are good; SS3 is uneven and SS4 really wasn't very good.

Thanks for the link.

It's funny, but I think we've come up with almost completely opposite AP chapter choices. SS1 and SS2 both sound dull to me. I'm eager to play in Kaer Maga, so SS3 is a no-brainer. And SS4 and SS5 sound like cool dungeon settings. Neither RL2 or RL3 appeal to me, as urban serial killer and hillbilly horror aren't my jam.


My plan is:

Burnt Offerings (RL1) augmented with Magnimar sourcebook content

Several Cult of Lissala arc Pathfinder Society scenarios

Asylum Stone (SS3) augmented with Kaer Maga sourcebook content

Doomsday Door (SS4)

Fortress of the Stone Giants (RL4)

Into the Nightmare Rift (SS5)

Spires of Xin-Shalast (RL6)