Well... listening to it I must agree with Ron. At least in the moment when he say, he is fanatic. Yeah. Now, in that moment he was honest with us.

I bought Vampire but I didn't get the hot goth sex

Perhaps I should have bought two copies?

Quote from: C.W.RichesonI bought Vampire but I didn't get the hot goth sex

Hmmm. You must have played it wrong or your brain damage got in the way

Is there anywhere that we can get a transcript of this fucking thing?! I can't sit and listen to this idiot for this long; I could read it much faster though.

Plus, that way Jimbob could hear it too.

RPGPundit

It's hard for me to listen to any podcast that goes on for more than 30 minutes (my mind starts to wander). Maybe I should email Clyde and ask him to think about breaking long interviews up in the future, or something. Doesn't matter who it is or what the subject is, unless it's an actor reading a book-on-CD or something, I can't listen to 1-2 people's voices for any more than a few mins at a time.

In any case, Clyde (the interviewer) is the most punk-rock person you're ever likely to meet: He has the word SUICIDAL tattooed on his forehead in big "thugg life" style lettering*... it looks scary at first, and yet he is one of the nicest, genuine people I've ever met (he oozes friendliness once you start talking). Great guy. I hope to meet up with him at GenCon again.

-Andy

* One of my friends was running a game as GM, where  all the characters were punk rockers. When Clyde showed up at the table, facial tattoo and all, he felt like the most milquetoast dude on the planet and got kind of embarrassed ("Hey mister Platonic Form of Punk Rock, here's your character, a 'punk rocker'. He's hardcore. He's got a bobby pin through his ear and ripped jeans..." ).

Quote from: David RWell I'm unsure of the definition of Indie or at least the way how Ron defines Indie, but does the Forge push all Indie games?

I believe the definition of indie at the Forge is the same one used by the indie roleplaying awards. Essentially, it means that the game's copyright is owned by someone who has written 50% or more of the game. There are complications involving licensing. But basically, by the Forge's definition, Marco, Clash, Hinterwelt, Atomic Sock Monkey Press (Chad U.) all have "indie" products.

As far as "pushing" games, the policy on the Forge itself, with regard to talking about existing games was (last I checked) to encourage actual play discussion of all games. I think the logic of this is that AP discussion is needed to explore tastes and preferences, which then leads on to design.

Naturally the design and publishing forums are just for "indie" games, based on the definition above.

In addition, the Forge hosts specialized forums for a number of games. To get a forum, the game has to qualify as "indie"--which is why the Heroquest forum shut down. (HQ is a weird case since its indie status was disputed from the start, and neither Robin Laws nor Greg Stafford participated in the forum, whereas all the other indie game forums at the Forge are moderated by the creator.) But just being "indie" is apparently not sufficient, though I don't know what other criteria are used.

In the past Ron has regretted the fact that so -called "simulationist" games haven't come over to his side--whether he means The Forge or just the "indie publishing model", I don't know. And he's also expressed this in frankly weird language, in one notable case expressing himself through a parable comparing the situation to the Spanish Civil War (it seems, with "mainstream" publishing corresponding to the Fascists).

In actuality, the appropriation of the word "indie" by the Forge, combined with Ron's moderation style, theory of game design, personality--and the social dynamics created by the way that different people react to those things--has tended at the Forge to marginalize games and designers that are technically indie but which fall outside of the Narrativist paradigm.

Quote from: C.W.RichesonI bought Vampire but I didn't get the hot goth sex

That's because clearly Vampire was too flexible a game that could appeal to too many different play styles (besides hot goth sex). While we barbarians see this "diversity" as a good thing and one of the reasons we're willing to put down so much money for a game and keep coming back to it, Edwards wisely knows it to be a hindrance to good gaming. What you really needed was a mini-game that focuses entirely on one theme (of hot goth sex) so there's no "incoherence" and all the players are free to cooperate in the goal of crafting a shared story (of hot goth sex) without risking "brain damage" due to conflicting motivations (having nothing to do with hot goth sex). To support this, it should have a proprietary system (somehow revolving around hot goth sex) to set it apart from other games and make it less useful for non-hot-goth-sex games--although people on RPG.net will nevertheless immediately start threads titled "Using Hot Goth Sex system for space opera/post-apocalyptic/wild west game."

Since you're already drooling in anticipation of the hot goth sex action, let me give you this opportunity to pre-order your copy of Hot Goth Sex. Your $20 will get you a 50-page, 5"-by-7" booklet with crappy b&w art I drew myself. Order today and get a free 10-sided butt-plug. Money order or certified check only, please. And go ahead and pat yourself on the back for supporting the indie revolution.

Black Flag, you had me at "Using Hot Goth Sex system for space opera/post-apocalyptic/wild west game." That is so typically rpg.net.

Quote from: Black FlagThat's because clearly Vampire was too flexible a game that could appeal to too many different play styles ....

CAN'T REPLY LAUGHING OH GOD MY RIBS

Thanks Elliot for the reply. I sort of suspected it was something like this:

Quote from: Elliot WilenIn actuality, the appropriation of the word "indie" by the Forge, combined with Ron's moderation style, theory of game design, personality--and the social dynamics created by the way that different people react to those things--has tended at the Forge to marginalize games and designers that are technically indie but which fall outside of the Narrativist paradigm.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: C.W.RichesonI bought Vampire but I didn't get the hot goth sex

Perhaps I should have bought two copies?

Of course! You need one for each participant.

Quote from: JongWKOf course! You need one for each participant.

Then ... we're gonna need more than two.

QuoteBecause I did watch a section of an interview Edwards did with Settembrini. And that was enough to freak ME out, merely from watching.

Could you elaborate? I spent quite some time on that thing, and would love to know what creeped you out.

I thought he came over ok on the interview, especially compared to the Demo at the Stasi headquarters.

Quote from: SettembriniCould you elaborate? I spent quite some time on that thing, and would love to know what creeped you out.

It was months ago, and it was nothing specific he said, much less anything to do with your own role (which I don't remember at all at this point, I didn't know you who you were). It was simply that, as Doc put it, the weird demeanor of the guy is a major turn-off.

That said, now we all want to hear about what happened at Normannenstrasse.

Why all this talk about Ron Edwards? He's not special. He's just another nerdy game designer with some outlandish opinions. That's damn common if you ask me. As for the pod cast . . . I got bored listening to it after about two minutes.