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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware

Started by trechriron, May 01, 2018, 02:51:12 PM

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Gronan of Simmerya

#570
May 29, 2018, 05:30:06 PM
[ATTACH=CONFIG]2516[/ATTACH]
You should go to GaryCon.  Period.

The rules can\'t cure stupid, and the rules can\'t cure asshole.

Ratman_tf

#571
May 29, 2018, 05:32:50 PM
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1041192In the 80s the rich found it to their advantage to manipulate things such that the far right loonies were active.  Part of the fallout of that was the whole "D&D is satanic" bullshit.

Now the rich find it to their advantage go manipulate things such that the far left loonies are active.  Part of the fallout of that is the whole "Enworld" bullshit.

Wait twenty or thirty years, it'll go back the other way.

And twenty or thirty years after that, it'll go back the other other way.

Et cetera.

Was it the Rothschilds, Soros or the Koch Brothers?
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

Gronan of Simmerya

#572
May 29, 2018, 05:38:06 PM
Does it really matter?  Human history, in many ways, is the story of "The rich get richer and the poor get drafted," to quote Johnny Cash.
You should go to GaryCon.  Period.

The rules can\'t cure stupid, and the rules can\'t cure asshole.

CarlD.

#573
May 29, 2018, 05:51:38 PM
Quote from: trechriron;1041143I feel like this thread has taken 9 turns at Albuquerque and veered way off course. :-D
[/QUOTE[

Just a wee bit, but nothing unusual for the site.

QuoteMostly I'm just happy that it will live here forever so when people search about the controversy, this post should come up.


Legacies are important. :D
"I once heard an evolutionary biologist talk about how violent simians are; they are horrifically violent. He then went on to add that he was really hopeful about humanity because "we\'re monkeys who manage *not* to kill each other most of the time.""

Libertarianism: All the Freedom money can buy

markmohrfield

#574
May 29, 2018, 08:20:16 PM Last Edit: May 29, 2018, 09:25:46 PM by markmohrfield
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1041164My only disagreement is that it's not "the far left."  It's the rich.

Believing that political extremism is solely owned by one economic group is as silly as believing that it is solely owned by one wing of the political spectrum.

QuoteThinking that the Rich who pretend to be on either side give a shit about anything other than themselves is a mistake.

Likewise insincerity or any other fault. For that matter, many of these people are fanatics, and thus too sincere for anyone's good.

Ras Algethi

#575
May 29, 2018, 10:51:05 PM
Quote from: markmohrfield;1041209Believing that political extremism is solely owned by one economic group is as silly as believing that it is solely owned by one wing of the political spectrum.

The irony is him declaring there is no ideology while putting his on full display.

Gronan of Simmerya

#576
May 30, 2018, 01:21:04 AM
Hush, dear, grownups are talking.
You should go to GaryCon.  Period.

The rules can\'t cure stupid, and the rules can\'t cure asshole.

Christopher Brady

#577
May 30, 2018, 01:29:42 AM Last Edit: May 30, 2018, 02:14:00 AM by Christopher Brady
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1041240Hush, dear, grownups are talking.

Take your own advice, please.
"And now, my friends, a Dragon\'s toast!  To life\'s little blessings:  wars, plagues and all forms of evil.  Their presence keeps us alert --- and their absence makes us grateful." -T.A. Barron[/SIZE]

Ratman_tf

#578
May 30, 2018, 01:42:25 AM
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1041240Hush, dear, grownups are talking.

Let me know when they're talking. I'd like to hear what they have to say.
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

Spinachcat

#579
May 30, 2018, 05:49:22 AM
Quote from: Christopher Brady;1041182All of which boils down to that Mr. Helton and ENWorld are now garbage for toeing a party line that destroyed another human being.

Has there been any epilogue to the Sean Patrick Fannon drama?


Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1041179Politics is an elaborate pantomime put on to distract the masses because it hurts long term revenue less than actual war.

You might be right. Like sports, politics provides a non-deadly battleground for passions and energy that previously went into chopping up neighbors in civil wars.

rgalex

#580
May 30, 2018, 08:04:07 AM
Quote from: Spinachcat;1040872And considering how viciously free speech is under attack, we need ALL the allies we can.

We don't need to agree on anything, except the right to verbally disagree.

I agree, however more and more it seems like the loud minority keeps gaining ground day in and day out.  Right now the witch hunts are spreading and it seems like people are willing to join up with the mob rather than push back.  We've already seen it happen in the video game and comic book "media" where long-time fans/hobbyists/participants are now being gatekept out of their own hobby.

It's pretty obvious that the table top community (however you want to take that word) is getting ready to follow suit.  The EN article, the Origins debacle (and other con bannings), the alt-right OSR thing, heck, TBP has a new "Values Policy" where they will ban people for wrongthink even if they've been a model member on their site.

QuoteValues/Rules & Off-Site Conduct: We draw a distinction between our site's values and rules. We infract based on rules violations if they occur on our site. If you call someone a shitbag in TRO, that is a rules violation on our site and you'll probably catch an infraction. If you call someone a shitbag on ENWorld, that's their problem. However, values matter regardless of where the conduct occurs, and social media now makes drawing distinct lines between identities across multiple online platforms impractical. If you are an alt-right racist, self-identified incel, white supremacist, Nazi, sexual predator, stalker, doxxer, or otherwise demonstrate offsite that you hold values incompatible with the RPGnet community, and we can identify you to a reasonable degree of certainty, we will ban you from RPGnet as based on the fact that you posting to RPGnet is a violation of our values.

TL;DR: We don't police off-site rules violations, but we will ban people over unbridgeable divides in values as demonstrated by off-site conduct.

Mike the Mage

#581
May 30, 2018, 08:41:27 AM
As I see it, the majority of OSR players and authors are too independent-minded and too grass-roots to co-opt. Comibine that with fact that the quality of the OSR ideas are too high and its creativity too original to compete with and it's easy to see why they are resorting to stigma, fear and smear.

Am I mistaken or are the SJWs and the bigger publishers getting quite pally?
When change threatens to rule, then the rules are changed

Ras Algethi

#582
May 30, 2018, 08:45:12 AM
Quote from: Christopher Brady;1041243Take your own advice, please.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1041245Let me know when they're talking. I'd like to hear what they have to say.

Come one now, he is a hero in his own world.

Opaopajr

#583
May 30, 2018, 08:57:07 AM
Quote from: Spinachcat;1041019I'm an Anthrax/Slayer fan from the early day, back when both bands had mixed fans of punks and metalheads. We used to have lots of punks at metal shows. Both groups were often painted with Nazi brush, which Anthrax pushed back hard against (Scotty Ian the guitarist is Jewish), while Slayer just said fuck it and adopted pseudo-Nazi iconography while writing songs decrying the Nazis and anything authoritarian.  

Can't control how the audience (or mob) interpret you. :o Tzeench laughs. :)

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1041145Well, then, if you prefer,

"Those damn hippies with their maryjoowanna and loud music are destroying America"
"Those damn beatniks with their poetry and expresso (sic) are destroying America"
"Those damn zoot suiters with their rotgut booze and shameless women are destroying America"
"Those damn Cro-Magnons with their fire and their big brains are destroying Village By The Hill"
...et cetera

:D Everything that goes around, comes around. Everything that comes around, goes around... I'm the Cult of Personality! :cool:
/Living Colour plays in the background

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1041192In the 80s the rich found it to their advantage to manipulate things such that the far right loonies were active.  Part of the fallout of that was the whole "D&D is satanic" bullshit.

Now the rich find it to their advantage go manipulate things such that the far left loonies are active.  Part of the fallout of that is the whole "Enworld" bullshit.

Wait twenty or thirty years, it'll go back the other way.

And twenty or thirty years after that, it'll go back the other other way.

Et cetera.

See? You've already seen the pattern! :cool: And now others realize we live in the Eye of Terror. :)

BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY!

If there's a Ctrl-Left, and an Alt-Right, who will be so kind as to provide us a Del-All? ;)

"Help us Oh Giant Meteor! You're our only hope!" :D
Just make your fuckin\' guy and roll the dice, you pricks. Focus on what\'s interesting, not what gives you the biggest randomly generated virtual penis.  -- J Arcane
 
You know, people keep comparing non-TSR D&D to deck-building in Magic: the Gathering. But maybe it\'s more like Katamari Damacy. You keep sticking shit on your characters until they are big enough to be a star.
-- talysman

Brand55

#584
May 30, 2018, 01:21:42 PM
Quote from: Spinachcat;1041255Has there been any epilogue to the Sean Patrick Fannon drama?
I haven't heard much except that he's stepped completely away from Savage Rifts and won't be contributing to the line in any fashion going forward. Given that it was supposedly a voluntary decision, he probably won't be working with Pinnacle or another company again in the near future. For now I expect the only things he might be working on are his own stuff like Shaintar.
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