Quote from: Schwartzwald;1002241OK since you asked in a non trolling way I'll answer.

The judge dredd series was actually always written as satire and parody of various social issues as well as a cautionary tale against the willingness to trade liberty for security, and ending up with neither. The creators of the series always saw dress as a fascist and were really surprised to see him considered a hero by many. They even wrote stories like "America" and "a letter to judge dredd" plus others to show that the judge system was terrible and nothing but fascism under the guise of "protection".

Look at how tobacco is banned in mega city one except for one building, how sugar is illegal, how free speech gets you beaten down and imprisoned. It was a look at the " nanny state" meeting the gestapo.

Have I shown you how the dredd series is in fact social fiction about a fascist nanny state out of control?  A warning that was sadly ignored in England and America?

Quote from: Schwartzwald;1002242BTW when these dredd issues were ran a long time ago McDonalds sued in england to stop them and left them out of print for decades.  Lately English parody law changed making them fair game again. This is one where dredd, crossing post apocalypse america, comes across an area dominated by McDonalds. Pretty much too true to be funny.

https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=6g5sb6pd&id=D1C246F0EBB5A3D0D34830D364F3EAC1A68E1ECF&thid=OIP.6g5sb6pdDhVZ56ssSDo4NQDsEs&q=Judge+dredd+mcdonalds&simid=608031950650213181&selectedIndex=8&ajaxhist=0

Cool, thanks. I have only a limited knowledge of Judge Dredd because it just isn't my thing so I didn't know. I'll give it another look.

Quote from: Schwartzwald;1002318The hunger games is pretty much a very hard hitting piece of social fiction that is all too likely to become reality.

This I disagree with. The world would have to get catastrophically fucked up for the Hunger Games to become reality. I don't even see how it was good social fiction, it seemed more like a high school social scene writ large with a special effects budget.

I have a couple of collections of the early Judge Dredd comics and they are great social satire and black humor. Haven't thought about them in a while.

Later Dune Novels.  Although they might not count, they might be too much exposition.  The fear of beaurcrasy.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;1002083Yeah, I'd say so. When I think social fiction my mind goes to books like 1984, A Clockwork Orange, Brave New World and Fahrenheit 451. I'm not too worried about the parameters.

Those are still considered Science Fiction....

- Ed C.

Quote from: Koltar;1003292Those are still considered Science Fiction....

- Ed C.

We aren't allowed to discuss or argue about deffinations.  ; )

Quote from: Koltar;1003292Those are still considered Science Fiction....

- Ed C.

Social Science Fiction is s subgenre of science fiction. Again, I am really not worried about categories. As long as it deals with society in a somewhat science fiction or speculative way, I think it is fair game for discussion here. The point isn't to get bogged down in an academic debate about what films are acceptable here. I'm using the term very loosely to refer to the kinds of stories I mentioned in the OP. Personally I don't care how you categorize 1984 and A Clockwork Orange, as long as we get an interesting discussion out of it.

By all means you can have that discussion if you want. But the thread will probably die from lack of oxygen or die the death of derailment. If we keep it open and not worry how people are categorizing things, we might actually have  a longterm thread on the topic.

Quote from: Koltar;1003292Those are still considered Science Fiction....

- Ed C.

Why did you have to make a post this ignorant? To make yourself look superior? You just look like a pompous moron. Most good SF is social fiction. Only an idiot would think sf was precluded from also being social fiction. H.G. Wells' novel "the time machine" was a novel dealing with the issues of social  inequity between the rich and the working poor. Heinlein's starship troopers was a social commentary about duty to society being essential to social well being.

Guys, I really don't care about the social fiction categorization thing. I opened this thread because someone suggested we take the topic here since it was derailing another thread. No reason to derail this thread on an excursion into definitions. Also, I don't think Estar's [edit: I mean Koltar]comment means he is ignorant or trying to be pompous. He is just a science fiction fan who felt differently about which shelf the books go on. That is a fairly minor point of disagreement. Certainly not one I'd expending any energy trading insults over. If I had a dime overtime me and my friends disagreed over that sort of thing I'd be a millionaire. Personally, rather than push him out of the conversation like your doing Swartzwald (I can't imagine taking anything but a defensive or hostile posture in the wake of "Why did you have to make a post this ignorant", especially when said commend contained no direct commentary or judgment on Estar's [EDIT: ONCE AGAIN, KOLTAR]part), I'd be interested in his thoughts on the topic itself since he's proven a knowledgeable science fiction fan on this board the many years I've seen him here.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;1003317Guys, I really don't care about the social fiction categorization thing. I opened this thread because someone suggested we take the topic here since it was derailing another thread. No reason to derail this thread on an excursion into definitions. Also, I don't think Estar's comment means he is ignorant or trying to be pompous. He is just a science fiction fan who felt differently about which shelf the books go on. That is a fairly minor point of disagreement. Certainly not one I'd expending any energy trading insults over. If I had a dime overtime me and my friends disagreed over that sort of thing I'd be a millionaire. Personally, rather than push him out of the conversation like your doing Swartzwald (I can't imagine taking anything but a defensive or hostile posture in the wake of "Why did you have to make a post this ignorant", especially when said commend contained no direct commentary or judgment on Estar's part), I'd be interested in his thoughts on the topic itself since he's proven a knowledgeable science fiction fan on this board the many years I've seen him here.

If you could pull your head out of your ass and look at how lardo replies to posts you might see he's just getting his own shit thrown back at him.

John Varley's In the Halls of the Martian King is an interesting extension of some of the social ideas of Heinlein's very flawed Stranger in a Strange Land.

Quote from: Schwartzwald;1003365If you could pull your head out of your ass and look at how lardo replies to posts you might see he's just getting his own shit thrown back at him.

Last comment I am going to make on this subject. If you can't handle interactions with koltar without it becoming something that bleeds into other threads, then ignore him.

I really like Neal Stephenson.  Anathanamem is probably my favourite but they are all about socites under interesting conditions.  


Ohhh!  Ohh!  "Wool"  thats a cool book.  Its a post apocalyptic yarn about a society living in a silo.  Wool is a really well written and fun book.  Read it if you can find a copy.

Is Wool by Stephenson?

The Watch Below by James White is an underrated sf book about a society of human evolving underwater.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;1003373Last comment I am going to make on this subject. If you can't handle interactions with koltar without it becoming something that bleeds into other threads, then ignore him.

Fuck you. I'm not going to let that pompous piece of shit pull his PA whining at my posts but I can't tear on his.