As a GM I've long since taken to some hard and fast rules for dice rolling at 'my' table. No dice roll counts unless I called for it, excessive and unnecessary dice rolls tend to have unpleasant consequences, particularly if the dice come up bad, things like that.  Of course, I often game with unruly and occasionally untrustworthy strangers. From time to time my insistance on waiting until I'VE called for the dice to be rolled has led to friction from players who start feeling cheated of their 'best rolls' simply because they pulled them off while I was dealing with someone else...


The gist of this, however, isn't to take MY method of controlling the dice at the table, but to discuss the value or use of Rules... those things we pay money for that come in a pretty book... governing such things.  

Obviously rule zero applies, and each table will invoke it's own variation on anything put in the book willy-nilly, thus extravagent declarations about 'it's their game' need not dominate the thread.

But how would you react if you new game book came with a rule that the GM was free to apply any dice roll made at the table as if a significant event had just occured, regardless.  

For example: the party is in tense negotiations with the boss of all orks, and know that if they flub it they'll have a hard time fighting their way out of ork territory alive.  At the table one player, bored or stupid, let's call him Joe, decides to roll his dice for no reason and they come up with a one( Presuming a D20 game, lets say)...

Using the above rule the GM decides that Joe, who's last stated commentary was that he was trying to look big and bad, just seriously screwed up an intimidation check, even though Joe hadn't specifically said he was attemptign to do anything... If the dice had come up hot, the GM could have let Joe succeed at intimidating a random Ork. Either way, the GM now throws a major complication at the party due to Joe's 'action'.


Now, leave aside the crappy example, what about the rule? Is such a rule appropriate or inappropriate as 'canon'?  What about similar rules?

No thanks. I'm in control of the game table and things like this are determined directly by me, I don't need any uppity game designer attempting to alter this element of my style.

BTW, I too ignore any die roll made before I call for them.

I'd definitely say that it is not proper for a game designer to attempt to exert control over such things. That's what GMs are for.

Quote from: SpikeAs a GM I've long since taken to some hard and fast rules for dice rolling at 'my' table. No dice roll counts unless I called for it, excessive and unnecessary dice rolls tend to have unpleasant consequences, particularly if the dice come up bad, things like that.

That rocks.

I may have to adopt that.

Quote from: Caesar SlaadThat rocks.

I may have to adopt that.

Glad I could help. Rules like this keep me sane given the players I tend to get...


Ah, the sad life of a Nomadic RPG'er....

I rule the table with an iron hand in a velvet glove. I can't even imagine a player  trying to pull any kind of dice trickery with me. It's our game, but we do it my way.

I don't give a fuck if my players fiddle with the dice to their heart's content.  But no roll counts unless I've told them to roll, even if they said "I'm doing x"; if I don't say roll, it doesn't fly; and especially not if they roll first and then say "that was my roll for x".

Also, if any die falls off the table, it doesn't count. Ever. Solves the problem of players saying it didn't count if the roll was bad but trying to make it count if it rolled well.

RPGPundit

Quote from: RPGPunditI don't give a fuck if my players fiddle with the dice to their heart's content.  But no roll counts unless I've told them to roll, even if they said "I'm doing x"; if I don't say roll, it doesn't fly; and especially not if they roll first and then say "that was my roll for x".

Also, if any die falls off the table, it doesn't count. Ever. Solves the problem of players saying it didn't count if the roll was bad but trying to make it count if it rolled well.

I've been known to toss in some extra nasties or have cool items of treasure destroyed in the battle if I have any indication of dice fudging.  I generally do this (and feel no shame for it) because I give the players every chance to make it.  In fact, if one of them rolls something nasty, I've been known to "accidentally" knock their dice off the table and say, "Oops!  Floor dice!  Gotta reroll!"  

I do this a lot more with beginning players, though...

I'd promptly ignore any rule like that put into a book and figure the designer was a bit off his nut.

-O

I'm pretty strict about dice-rolling myself. I won't let players roll and call until I've asked for the roll. I encourage my players to use dice boxes too so that dice rolls are clean and clear, and I will insist on rerolls of pochled dice.

Also, running WFRP with percentiles as I do, I won't accept the use of 2 different coloured d10's- it's a tens and a units dice for me all the way. My players were a bit leery of this at first, feeling that it impugned their honesty. I got round this by pointing out that it didn't matter whether or not I trusted them. Rather, it was about setting a benchmark so that if a new player came along, they wouldn't feel singled out if they found out that I'd instituted stricter dice-rolling etiquette just because of them. This won the day in the end.

Good response there, JMcL!

RPGPundit

I'm on board with Pundit here.  Off-the-table dice are invalid.  Re-roll.

Not only do dice rolls not count until I call for them, but I also said don't roll transparent dice without visible numbers, don't roll micro-dice that are nigh-invisible, and don't roll jumbo dice the size of apples that could knock over miniatures.

When a player rolls dice that fall off the table, I say (and my veteran players now say it right along with me, because they've heard it a thousand times), "NO! Roll ON the TABLE! It's a HUGE, FLAT SURFACE, PERFECT FOR ROLLING ON!!"

Once Chris, who is left handed, tried rolling on the corner of the table.
"Roll a 15 or lower on D20" roll..miss the table
"Roll a 14 or lower on D20" roll...miss the table
"Roll a 13 or lower on D20" roll...miss the table...and he walked out of the room. I just laughed at him. You'd think someone with a college education would figure out to stop rolling it off the table.

I told my players that rolls don't count because there may be modifiers (positive or negative) that they weren't aware of before rolling, or that a roll might not be necessary and a handwave could do it. Not that I didn't trust them. It seemed kinder than saying, "I trust everyone to roll their own dice except Ace."