Quote from: Spike;573504Since I haven't got my permanet Kudo yet, nor have I been told I was dead wrong, the movie who's named escaped me just came to me: Sanjuro.

I won't attempt to remember the character's name as he gives a different, obvious lie, in each movie.

You were correct on the first count of the actor, and the second of the movie, and it IS Toshiro Mifune, as Thirty Years Old in Sanjuro.

Sorry, I've been pretty much ignoring the peanut gallery in this thread.  You kudo will go in my sig, and I'll swap back to my OTHER esoteric avatar.

I choose to use Mifune because of all the old west people, I thought I'd draw on some of the real roots of those movies like the Magnificent Seven and such.

Huzzah!!

I love Mifune, especially with Kurosawa.... or the other way 'round.

And yojimbo, of course, is one of the most copied of all his movies, yet sanjuro was, I think, somewhat superior... if a bit less universal a tale.

Quote from: Spike;573523Huzzah!!

I love Mifune, especially with Kurosawa.... or the other way 'round.

And yojimbo, of course, is one of the most copied of all his movies, yet sanjuro was, I think, somewhat superior... if a bit less universal a tale.

I definitely prefer Sanjuro, but my favorite is The Hidden Fortress, its a classic formula.  But that's off topic.

Quote from: jeff37923;573429This is the Thunderdome.

Two men enter. One man leaves.

I figured as much. Just laying it out there.

And don't worry Spike. After the battle(s) end I'm sure jeff wouldn't mind letting you know just how simple the tactics I am using are.

You obviously missed the point of my comment.  Not surprising at all.

Quote from: Spike;573430Actually: your obsessive desire to keep every one of your actions, with the exception of that single spell, confined to a PM hurts your case. We can't, as witnesses, objectively measure what you did fairly since, just like we can't measure your character as we haven't see it, we don't actually know.

Sounds a lot like saying you can't take measure of what I'm doing because I'm being secretive. "You'll see afterward" seems like the appropriate response to that idea.

QuoteFurther: unless the stated goal was 'can I annoy the fighter for four rounds' you haven't made the case for anything yet. I could, for example, prove victory based on the conditions you declared simply by... not showing up to the fight.

You seem to suffer from premature exclamation.

I felt no need to comment on this part because I know I've already covered this ground, but let'sdo this dance again. To start this is a "surprise" fight. If my wizard had been scheduled to fight the fighter (like you know, known in advanced I would be for some reason flying around to some useless location to fight somebody that could never, on his own, stop me from doin anything I wanted to be doing) I wouldn't have started 1000ft away from him, I would've teleported in with my summons already called and gangraped him before he could even make the spot check to identify everything I brought with me. So this already isn't a real fight. These aren't "adventure" characters either because if mine was one my spell selection would've logically been bigger because that's the common fucking sense thing for me to do and it is trivially easy to do so. So right out the ate I'm more awesome than the fighter despite conditions that specifically favor him.

Beyond that I gimped myself purposefully to make a point. I didn't spend all of my wealth, didn't grab lesser planar binding on a scroll, didn't get a cohort wizard, didn't break use magic device over my knee to make it my bitch. So I specifically kept my abilities save for 2 items, in the realm of things my conjurer can do on his own. So not only am I playin in the fighter's conditions I'm doing so while relying on things my character can do with shit on his character sheet without getting things that I can't actually use from outside sources.

Now the real kicker about why I am "prematurely" claiming victory is that I effectively disabled the fighter. He literally (and I'm betting he doesn't have a magic item to counter this) can't do shit to me right now. If I knew where he lived I could teleport to his home and destroy everythin he ever cared for and he wouldn't even be able to see me leave to do it. Were I in his position though I'd still have options both offensive and defensive. What's worse (for him) is I'm a conjuerer. 4 Rounds with uninterrupted shennanigans? That benefits ME. So what if I can't see him. I don't need to because I'm a fucking wizard and even aainst invisible threats I have options.

These thins are the factors that make the fighter shit. These thins were the point I was making in the Fighter vWizard thread. The fact that I specifically asked about victory conditions before the battle is because this is what I expected. I have to completely compete with the fighter on the only terms a fighter can participate. Battle. I've effectively negated the fighter's ability to DO battle. That is why I'm already counting a personal victory. Killing him is just going to have to be the final nail in this stupid fucking coffin.

Quote from: MGuy;573578Robble Robble Robble

So what you're saying is that you're the winner whether you win or lose, since you've already set all the conditions and purposefully gimped yourself so that if you DO lose, it's because you didn't have a chance to adequately prepare etc etc etc?

If you're the winner either way, why are you wasting your time?  Proving your point can't be THAT important, since if you DO lose you'll just say it was because you were gimped by the restrictions (that you agreed to pretty much at face value at the beginning of this).

So it's fine, declare yourself the victor and ride off into the sunset

The idea that he could lose seems ludicrous.  

But his point again seems to be lost.  If this were a competition of any kind other than 'kill the other guy' (like get the item first, get past the guard without being noticed, go murder this guys whole family) then he could do that while the Fighter is stuck in a solid fog.  

When he does win, you should understand that he could have won 'even harder' if he had done some actual character optimization.  He didn't.  He's not trying to show that 'it's easy to break the game with optimization'.  That could certainly be true, but again - not the point.  His point is that a non-optimized Wizard is better than an optimized-Fighter in every arena.  Combat (the one the Fighter is supposed to be good at), exploration, social interaction.  

There's no 'both are good in different ways' - there's just the Wizard being better in all aspects of the game.  And this is still Level 10.  It gets worse the higher the level is.

I realized in my own Thunderdome that by trying to under-optimize (instead of just making solid characters) by doing things like shorting bonus spells, thousands of gold in treasure and so forth that I was setting an unfair condition on Kaelik and robbing him of the ability to crow his 'inevitable' victory... so I fixed it.

Me? I'd like to get to the actual encounter some day, but I do feel vaguely obligated to go through the motions so that no one will be tempted to jump up and say that I didn't make a serious effort of it.

Nope: If he gets his TPK fair and square, it'll be fair and square, and not because I gave it too him.


The reason for openness is so that everyone can fairly evaluate, in real time (so to speak) what is actually going down.  True double blind play doesn't really happen at the table anyway.

We can't actually evaluate how fairly you got the drop on PK unless we see the ruling, nor can we evaluate your various tricks. We can GUESS what's going on, but an after the fact report isn't the same thing.


Not to mention incredibly boring.  You do realize that you are here to entertain me, don't you? Motherfucker?

Quote from: Spike;573609Me? I'd like to get to the actual encounter some day, but I do feel vaguely obligated to go through the motions so that no one will be tempted to jump up and say that I didn't make a serious effort of it.

Just pointing out that, per your request, I won't assume you move deeper into the dungeon unless you say so.

Quote from: Kaelik;573458Benoist, stop being an idiot for six whole seconds.

U mad?

Quote from: Benoist;573625U mad?

Hey Benoist, remember that time you said that Hitler was your hero and you can't wait to kill all the Jews?

U mad?

There, do I fit in now, I'm doing just like the mod, lying about what people said and then using 4chan terminology as if that excuses it.

Quote from: Kaelik;573626Hey Benoist, remember that time you said that Hitler was your hero and you can't wait to kill all the Jews?

U mad?

There, do I fit in now, I'm doing just like the mod, lying about what people said and then using 4chan terminology as if that excuses it.

Meh. You have to hone your skill, padawan. That's too over the top.

I think it says more about your perception bias than it does about me, in fact.

Quote from: Just Another User;573495nitpick: feel free to ignore


 the spell description say that it spread in "20 feet radius 20 feet high", not 20 feet deep. the description assume the spell is cast at ground level, but I still think the cloud is actually only 20 feet high.
So, either there is no fog under Panzerkraken's mount or there is only 10 feet or it, it depend if you read the center of the spell as the geometrical center or as the origin point.

Yeah, sorry.

No, I actually did consider this when the spell was cast. I just came to the conclusion that having a 20 foot radius sphere of a terrain feature would be more interesting. No worries.

Moves are being made via PM and I am waiting for a bit of clarification.

I also have to go to work again, so sit tight true believers!