Quote from: BedrockBrendan;5914381) one percent is still play. By definition your claim does not work. The character is being played. You have to modify your premise here for it to work. Gimped characters cant play D&D is flawed. It doesn't work. Something like: gimped characters have low survivability over multiple encounters might work. But then you are just stating something that is, and still need to fit an ought to it. You may do so by making your ought conditional: gimped characters have low survivability over multiple are therefore a bad choice if you want to play the same character over a standard long campaign with regular combats. Even then, you still need to define gimped.
2) i believe you are equivocating here on the term objectivity. And it still does not follow from the definition of objective that gimped characters can't pay D&D.
3) again, you have examples of play and so do others.

Playing D&D means not playing pretend. And almost the exact instant you start playing D&D, the gimps start dying.

So while you can hide in the tavern and play pretend a few minutes... or even a few hours if feeling particularly cowardly eventually the adventurers must go adventure, and that is where the slaughter shall begin.

Regardless, I still see more empty useless posts and not a single person willing to prove gimps are valid and defend them at all. Am I to take this a concession that the gimps are indefensible?

Because in all this time, all this blabbering you could have completed the scenario. More likely, by dying well before its actual conclusion, but that's still an end point.

So still waiting for people to step it up or step on out but further useless posts will be disregarded entirely.

How can we step up when you havent even offered a stable or workable premise? I even gave offered up an example of a premise that might work for you. It just isnt clear what you are trying to prove here exactly.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;591448How can we step up when you havent even offered a stable or workable premise? I even gave offered up an example of a premise that might work for you. It just isnt clear what you are trying to prove here exactly.

...I just told you.

It's really quite simple.

1: You make a party, run through the scenario according to the rules laid out.
2: You either win or lose.
3: Or we can just have more pointless bitching.

Quote from: Mr. GC;591450...I just told you.

It's really quite simple.

1: You make a party, run through the scenario according to the rules laid out.
2: You either win or lose.
3: Or we can just have more pointless bitching.

My point is, until you establish a solid premise that we are trying prove here, there isn't much point in going through the scenario.

Quote from: Mr. GC;591443Playing D&D means not playing pretend.

Yikes. Just, yikes.

Quote from: Mr. GC;591450It's really quite simple.

1: You make a party, run through the scenario according to the rules laid out.
2: You either win or lose.
3: Or we can just have more pointless bitching.

What's actually going to happen:

1: Mr. GC proposes a ridiculous exercise that represents neither actual play nor the claims of the people he's trying to "disprove".
2: Everybody points and laughs at him.
3: Mr. GC pouts.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;591451My point is, until you establish a solid premise that we are trying prove here, there isn't much point in going through the scenario.

Been done. Just people would rather bitch about bullshit.

Calling you out specifically: Will you make a party? If no, kindly leave the thread.

Calling Doom out specifically: Will you make a party? """

Calling Justin out specifically: Same deal.

Quote from: Mr. GC;591455Calling you out specifically: Will you make a party? If no, kindly leave the thread.

Like I said, I have no interest in participating because it is so unclear what you are attempting to even prove here. (For all I know, we agree. For example if your argument is all things being equal, weak characters are more likey to die, then I dont disagree).

Quote from: Exploderwizard;591401Besides the entire point of roleplaying games you mean?

(snicker)

Quote from: Mr. GC;591443Playing D&D means not playing pretend.

Tom Hanks, is that you?

Quote from: Mr. GC;591455Been done. Just people would rather bitch about bullshit.

 .

No it really hasn't. I asked what you are trying to prove. When you stated your premise, it became clear it was flawed. I would say if you want to prove something here, establishing a clear premise that can be supported by some live play is essential. But "gimped characters cant play D&D" isn't working.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;591459No it really hasn't. I asked what you are trying to prove. When you stated your premise, it became clear it was flawed. I would say if you want to prove something here, establishing a clear premise that can be supported by some live play is essential. But "gimped characters cant play D&D" isn't working.

Or you can stop trying to weasel out of a clear definition to try and find something that the basket weavers can technically win, even though it's quite clear to everyone including them that they lost. For example, by having them die 10 times a day.

Or instead of still continuing to make useless posts you could actually contribute, instead of only contributing both directly and indirectly to more derailment bullshit. But nah, realistic standards.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;591456Like I said, I have no interest in participating because it is so unclear what you are attempting to even prove here. (For all I know, we agree. For example if your argument is all things being equal, weak characters are more likey to die, then I dont disagree).

New exercise: Somebody create a party of 7th level characters using Mr. GC's guidelines and I'll run you through The Sunless Citadel. Mr. GC loses if you complete the adventure. Mr. GC wins if monkeys fly out of my butt.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;591483New exercise: Somebody create a party of 7th level characters using Mr. GC's guidelines and I'll run you through The Sunless Citadel. Mr. GC loses if you complete the adventure. Mr. GC wins if monkeys fly out of my butt.

That's cute. A level 1 adventure, and an easy one at that, such that even the luck asplosion based level 1s might not die on it. But probably will anyways.

Right, so you can't do it either.

So I suppose the question at this point is "That Guy and me excluded, is there anyone here with a clue?"

Quote from: Justin Alexander;591483New exercise: Somebody create a party of 7th level characters using Mr. GC's guidelines and I'll run you through The Sunless Citadel. Mr. GC loses if you complete the adventure. Mr. GC wins if monkeys fly out of my butt.

You're on!  Six 7th level Commoners coming online.